What religion is the one true religion?

[Trailblazer]

We have discussed this before when you were preaching about your religion, you were unable to explain why Jesus, Mohammed, David Koresh and Charles Manson were not all messengers from your god.

Sorry I cannot keep track of every poster on this forum, so I do not recall saying that. Nevertheless, I will take you at your word.

In brief, I believe that Jesus and Mohammed were Messengers of God because they meet the criteria for being Messengers of God, but I do not believe that David Koresh and Charles Manson were Messengers of God because they do not even meet the minimum criteria (#1-5 below).

The minimum criteria are:

1. He had good character as exemplified by his qualities such as love, mercy, kindness, truth, justice, benevolence, gracious, merciful, righteous, forgiving, patient.

2. He believed he had been given a mission by God and did everything he could to see that it was carried out. He was completely successful before his death, and he accomplished everything that he set out to do.

3. He wrote much about God and God's purpose for humans both individually and collectively. He firmly believed that the work he was doing was for the Cause of God.

4. He had many followers while he was alive, and there are still millions who follow his teachings and gather in groups based on the religion he founded.

5. His followers have grown more numerous in recent times.

This is a starting point but there are other questions we would want to ask ourselves before we would be able to believe that a man was a true Messenger of God because that is a bold claim so there should be a lot of evidence to support such a claim.

Other criteria he would have to meet is that his religion could not contradict or be in opposition to any of the world religions that are already established and he could not talk down any of those religions and say his religion is the only true religion from God.

Depending upon his claims he would have other criteria to meet.

 

[Viker]

See, what you need then is to have a thread on evidence for a creator or something like that. But you are engaged in a thread that discusses some true religion, for which if you are to engage, rather than making rhetorical dismissals and enjoyable jibe, you should have some criteria to measure anything against. You dont even seem to like reason and logic by the way you are responding.

Anyway, since this is to compare theologies, which one do you think is more reasonable, polytheism or monotheism? And why? Based on what criteria? At least this way you could eliminate some things to narrow the topic down.

You're missing my whole request.

Let me make it simple.

What makes a religion the one true religion, as such rendering all others false..using logic and reason ( since that has been brought up )?

 

[Justanatheist]

Sorry I cannot keep track of every poster on this forum, so I do not recall saying that. Nevertheless, I will take you at your word.

In brief, I believe that Jesus and Mohammed were Messengers of God because they meet the criteria for being Messengers of God, but I do not believe that David Koresh and Charles Manson were Messengers of God because they do not even meet the minimum criteria (#1-5 below).

The minimum criteria are:

1. He had good character as exemplified by his qualities such as love, mercy, kindness, truth, justice, benevolence, gracious, merciful, righteous, forgiving, patient.

2. He believed he had been given a mission by God and did everything he could to see that it was carried out. He was completely successful before his death, and he accomplished everything that he set out to do.

3. He wrote much about God and God's purpose for humans both individually and collectively. He firmly believed that the work he was doing was for the Cause of God.

4. He had many followers while he was alive, and there are still millions who follow his teachings and gather in groups based on the religion he founded.

5. His followers have grown more numerous in recent times.

This is a starting point but there are other questions we would want to ask ourselves before we would be able to believe that a man was a true Messenger of God because that is a bold claim so there should be a lot of evidence to support such a claim.

Other criteria he would have to meet is that his religion could not contradict or be in opposition to any of the world religions that are already established and he could not talk down any of those religions and say his religion is the only true religion from God.

Depending upon his claims he would have other criteria to meet.

So none of the above, ok.

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

as I said
why are you confused about the fact that we need trees

Mmk, well this got circular fast. The explanations are there for you to reread as many times as needed.

 

[firedragon]

You're missing my whole request.

Let me make it simple.

What makes a religion the one true religion, as such rendering all others false..using logic and reason ( since that has been brought up )?

This is why I asked you, which one do you think is more reasonable, polytheism or monotheism? And why? Based on what criteria? At least this way you could eliminate some things to narrow the topic down.

If you think logic and reason is good criteria, then based on it, which one do you think is more logical or reasonable?

 

[Trailblazer]

This might be fine if what they produced didn't then pass into the future to then cause even more conflict. Which is what tends to happen rather than being welcomed and enlightening us all. So why wasn't any original message good enough, even if later explanations were required?

No message from God was good enough for all time because as I said in my post, different ages have different requirements:

“These principles and laws, these firmly-established and mighty systems, have proceeded from one Source, and are the rays of one Light. That they differ one from another is to be attributed to the varying requirements of the ages in which they were promulgated.” Gleanings, pp. 287-288

Moreover, what was required in past ages is no longer required in this age, as the world and its peoples change over time. We should be concerned about the age in which we live and the requirements of that age:

“The All-Knowing Physician hath His finger on the pulse of mankind. He perceiveth the disease, and prescribeth, in His unerring wisdom, the remedy. Every age hath its own problem, and every soul its particular aspiration. The remedy the world needeth in its present-day afflictions can never be the same as that which a subsequent age may require. Be anxiously concerned with the needs of the age ye live in, and center your deliberations on its exigencies and requirements.” Gleanings, p. 213

 

[Viker]

This is why I asked you, which one do you think is more reasonable, polytheism or monotheism? And why? Based on what criteria? At least this way you could eliminate some things to narrow the topic down.

If you think logic and reason is good criteria, then based on it, which one do you think is more logical or reasonable?

My position is they're both reasonable. We should be cautious applying logic. Logic isn't friendly.

 

[Trailblazer]

So none of the above, ok.

No, David Koresh and Charles Manson did not meet any of the criteria listed above.

 

[Justanatheist]

No, David Koresh and Charles Manson did not meet any of the criteria listed above.

Neither did Jesus or Mohamed,

Other criteria he would have to meet is that his religion could not contradict or be in opposition to any of the world religions that are already established

Christianity contradicts Judasim and Islam contradicts both. You ruled them out by your criteria.

 

[firedragon]

We have discussed this before when you were preaching about your religion, you were unable to explain why Jesus, Mohammed, David Koresh and Charles Manson were not all messengers from your god.

On what basis did you pick these names as candidates for potential prophets?

 

[firedragon]

My position is they're both reasonable. We should be cautious applying logic. Logic isn't friendly.

Alright, so logically, why are both "reasonable"?

 

[Viker]

Alright, so logically, why are both "reasonable"?

Neither have been validated, logically. Both are subject to personal discrimination.

Why not wear the shoe that fits?

 

[Starlight]

Paganism.

Many different religions is paganism

You have to be more spesific, or do you believe all the religions who is pagan (religions who not are abrahamic) is true?

 

[Justanatheist]

On what basis did you pick these names as candidates for potential prophets?

Starting from left to right on the number of people killed by or because of their followers. Not sure if I have been fair to Koresh though.

 

[Jack Smitten]

Mmk, well this got circular fast. The explanations are there for you to reread as many times as needed.

but trees are good

 

[firedragon]

Starting from left to right on the number of people killed by or because of their followers. Not sure if I have been fair to Koresh though.

Okay. So can you give the numbers killed by each of those four people, and whats your historical sources for the information?

 

[firedragon]

Neither have been validated, logically. Both are subject to personal discrimination.

Why not wear the shoe that fits?

What are the validation criteria you used on both?

 

[Justanatheist]

Okay. So can you give the numbers killed by each of those four people, and whats your historical sources for the information?

Millions, at least thousands, between ten and twenty and a few rich people, look on Wikipedia for details.

 

[firedragon]

Millions, at least thousands, between ten and twenty and a few rich people, look on Wikipedia for details.

Thats just a belief statement. Your faith is irrelevant when it comes to historical claims.

Can you give the numbers killed by each of those four people, and whats your historical sources for the information?

 

[Justanatheist]

Thats just a belief statement. Your faith is irrelevant when it comes to historical claims.

Can you give the numbers killed by each of those four people, and whats your historical sources for the information?

Right from left to right, The Holocaust, 9/11, Wako and the Sharon Tate murders, now if you are not aware of any or all look them up and get educated.