whats your beef with brexit?

[Altfish]

It is not all bad news.

Hopefully this woman will be packing her bags shortly.

All we need is more Mogmentum with a little help from his friends!

Nigel still has it, where it counts!

You prove my point.
The people who oppose Brexit are demonised, called treasonous.
The people who said Brexit would bring back British Justice (whatever that is) are up in arms every time someone says something they don't agree with.
Tell me one benefit we will get from Brexit...I've not heard one yet.

 

[Altfish]

Project fear rearing its ugly head again.

Is that really the best you can do.
Tell me about project optimism, what is going to be good, how will we benefit...publish all the reports the Brexit side has commissioned showing the benefits.

Oh, I forgot, Brexit doesn't do experts

 

[Notanumber]

As George Michael used to say, “You’ve got to have faith”.

I know this is difficult when some of our political leaders, the civil service, celebrities and Trump haters are loath to accept democracy.

 

[ChristineM]

As George Michael used to say, “You’ve got to have faith”.

I know this is difficult when some of our political leaders, the civil service, celebrities and Trump haters are loath to accept democracy.

Some political leaders? Its the ones who instigated brexit who are panicking about their profits now.

Civil services are in a prime position to see whats happening. My guess is you wouldn't be dissing them if their forecasts said brexit would be good for the uk.. But they aren't

Celebrities, who cares, oh you do, right

What has trump to do with brexit? Ahh right, straw man.

37.5% of the population is not truly democraric is it? And lets face it, everyone has the right to object just as you have the right to object. Or is that right only bestowed on exiters by exiters?

So you have faith that the light at the end of the tunnel is not an express train heading right for you.

 

[Altfish]

As George Michael used to say, “You’ve got to have faith”.

I know this is difficult when some of our political leaders, the civil service, celebrities and Trump haters are loath to accept democracy.

So the big red bus should have said "The NHS has got to have faith".
You sum up my thoughts on the Leavers current narrative which is basically "Keep your fingers crossed, despite what we promised you this might not turn out to be a total disaster"
Brexiteers now realise that they have c*cked up and are now trying to spin the least worse scenario.

 

[England my lionheart]

Ok this is my thread, there are many good points presented for both camps but its not just about finance l.

 

[Altfish]

Ok this is my thread, there are many good points presented for both camps but its not just about finance l.

Agreed, but that's mainly what we were sold.
So what are these other benefits my kids can look forward to?

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

Yeah OK, I read it all.
Your Lincolnshire farmers, all screeching because they might lose some Latvian cheap labour, eh?
They'll have to pay proper wages if they lose those folks.
I'm not going to lay in bed worrying about Lincolnshire farmers tonight, or any night.
I never seen a poor Lincolnshire farmer in my life.

Oh my .................. you left school at 16, did you by any chance go to agricultural college? Are you a Lincolnshire farmer? I'm only having fun.

It is not a case of cheap labour. they have to pay better rates than anywhere else in the EU to attract them.
We simply do not have a workforce with the right skills and attitude to do the work, at any price.

If farmers can not get seasonal field workers they can not harvest the crops.
We will then have to buy (import) supplies at a higher price from the EU,
and shop prices will go up.
As the government wishes to leave the customs union and free trade area this will also add costs and slow the supply train.
It will hit your, mine and everyone,s pocket... not just the farmer's.

 

[Altfish]

It is not a case of cheap labour. they have to pay better rates than anywhere else in the EU to attract them.
We simply do not have a workforce with the right skills and attitude to do the work, at any price.

If farmers can not get seasonal field workers they can not harvest the crops.
We will then have to buy (import) supplies at a higher price from the EU,
and shop prices will go up.
As the government wishes to leave the customs union and free trade area this will also add costs and slow the supply train.
It will hit your, mine and everyone,s pocket... not just the farmer's.

It's happening already...

Cornwall says crops ‘rotting in fields’ due to Brexit labour shortage

 

[oldbadger]

It is not a case of cheap labour. they have to pay better rates than anywhere else in the EU to attract them.

Fair enough. OK......

We simply do not have a workforce with the right skills and attitude to do the work, at any price.

That's looks about right as well. How to motivate a spoilt nation into training and a wish to 'do it'.

If farmers can not get seasonal field workers they can not harvest the crops.

That will raise prices, but where our youth doesn't want to work in fields (or anywhere?) Farmers don't want to do that much to attract, train, motivate Brit youth either. Farmers are as selfish as our lazy kids.

We will then have to buy (import) supplies at a higher price from the EU, and shop prices will go up.

True. And shop prices are already going up........... I buy the same 'basic' shopping from the same store every Wednesday and over the last 12 months the base shop-cost has increased by about 10%.
But we are harvesting fruit which is transported to Spain for storage in cryo-freezing. When this fruit is unfrozen for transport back to the UK it needs to be reprocessed to introduce colour back into into it before delivery to stores.
A Unit near Faversham is involved with this (somehow).
We are going to pay for our freedom from Brexit, but we sure were paying to belong.
Freedom is going to cost, and rich farmers need to wake up just as much as our lazy kids.

As the government wishes to leave the customs union and free trade area this will also add costs and slow the supply train. It will hit your, mine and everyone,s pocket... not just the farmer's.

True. It has already. It is now. It will.
But this year I was put on a water meter and my bill is now £68 each month...... last year I paid an annual (water supply) bill of about £150.

We are adjusting to increased costs all the time, and if we need to pay more for an apple then so be it.

We will survive, and any hardships caused might wake us up.

 

[Notanumber]

It is not a case of cheap labour. they have to pay better rates than anywhere else in the EU to attract them.
We simply do not have a workforce with the right skills and attitude to do the work, at any price.

If farmers can not get seasonal field workers they can not harvest the crops.
We will then have to buy (import) supplies at a higher price from the EU,
and shop prices will go up.
As the government wishes to leave the customs union and free trade area this will also add costs and slow the supply train.
It will hit your, mine and everyone,s pocket... not just the farmer's.

The problem with that logic is if we have to rely on mass immigration to provide a cheap workforce for farmers & growers in order to feed the current UK population where are we going to get the extra farmland from to feed the increased population. It cannot go on infinitum.

 

[Altfish]

We will survive, and any hardships caused might wake us up.

Funny, I don't remember that slogan mentioned by the Brexit campaign??

I wonder why?

"Lets get £350m a week for the NHS"

or

"We will survive, and any hardships caused might wake us up."

Nigel, Boris, which do you prefer?

 

[Notanumber]

So the big red bus should have said "The NHS has got to have faith".
You sum up my thoughts on the Leavers current narrative which is basically "Keep your fingers crossed, despite what we promised you this might not turn out to be a total disaster"
Brexiteers now realise that they have c*cked up and are now trying to spin the least worse scenario.

It was much better than using ‘Project Fear’ and being told that we would be at the back of the line.

 

[Altfish]

It was much better than using ‘Project Fear’ and being told that we would be at the back of the line.

Oh Project Fear - glad you bring that up again; because it is slowly turning into Project Truth.
In fact if it wasn't for a very early and timely intervention by the Mark Carne and the Bank of England (Who recommended Remain) followed by May's sweeteners to the likes of Nissan it would be worse than project fear ever predicted.

 

[Notanumber]

Oh Project Fear - glad you bring that up again; because it is slowly turning into Project Truth.
In fact if it wasn't for a very early and timely intervention by the Mark Carne and the Bank of England (Who recommended Remain) followed by May's sweeteners to the likes of Nissan it would be worse than project fear ever predicted.

So now, we have identified two of the establishment that are backing Britain. It’s about time the rest got onboard and started doing their bit for Britain instead of looking for a coffin to knock nails in.

 

[Altfish]

So now, we have identified two of the establishment that are backing Britain. It’s about time the rest got onboard and started doing their bit for Britain instead of looking for a coffin to knock nails in.

I'm backing Britain just as all the other Remainers are. We just want what is best for our country. Not some vague promise of, "It may not be as bad as it looks"
There is only one side knocking coffin nails in, and it isn't the Remainers

 

[oldbadger]

Funny, I don't remember that slogan mentioned by the Brexit campaign??

I wonder why?

"Lets get £350m a week for the NHS"

or

"We will survive, and any hardships caused might wake us up."

Nigel, Boris, which do you prefer?

Nigel and Boris got a bit carried away.
They get excited about stuff.
Boris can say stupid things without thinking. That poor lady imprisoned in Iran could tell you about the stupid things that Boris says.

We will have hardships and difficulties connected to Brexit, it's true, but we really weren't going to fit into a European federation as a handful of states. We just about voted to go alone, and go alone we must. Let's get on with it......................

 

[Altfish]

Nigel and Boris got a bit carried away.

We will have hardships and difficulties connected to Brexit, it's true, but we really weren't going to fit into a European federation as a handful of states. We just about voted to go alone, and go alone we must. Let's get on with it......................

Why wasn't that the rallying call during the referendum?
It would look lovely on the side of a bus, "We will have hardships and difficulties connected to Brexit"

Basically you seem to be saying...we were sold a lie, but hard luck, the liers won

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

The problem with that logic is if we have to rely on mass immigration to provide a cheap workforce for farmers & growers in order to feed the current UK population where are we going to get the extra farmland from to feed the increased population. It cannot go on infinitum.

This is not mass immigration. The workers follow the seasonal work and harvests around Europe and come and go as needed. Much like the Australian sheep shearers do around the world. Seasonal farm workers are experts and worth every penny that they earn. Mostly they are paid by results and do very well.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

Nigel and Boris got a bit carried away.
They get excited about stuff.
Boris can say stupid things without thinking. That poor lady imprisoned in Iran could tell you about the stupid things that Boris says.

We will have hardships and difficulties connected to Brexit, it's true, but we really weren't going to fit into a European federation as a handful of states. We just about voted to go alone, and go alone we must. Let's get on with it......................

The big money seems to be coming out on the side of staying..i.e. Sorros, and the pressure from Japanese car manufacturers, who have advanced plans to move their investmrnts and factories to Europe.

It is not too late to do the right thing and stay.