Where are the people?

[Aupmanyav]

These two things will (I think) eventually erode and erase national boundaries. Without these two abilities, any global plans to eliminate boundaries and help all poor people are unlikely to succeed.

Nothing can erase national boundaries. Have the Christian majority nations of Europe or America erased the boundaries? Then we have constraints of religions. Will Isarel and Iran, Azerbaijan and Armenia, India and Pakistan ever erase their boundaries? What kind of pipe-dream do you or Bahais have?

 

[Aupmanyav]

Interestingly, the only Monarchy of the time that offerd a favourable reply to Baha’u’llah was the Queen of England. In turn Baha’u’llah praised some actions the Queen had initiated in Her Rule and offered because of these fruits of her reign, that her reign would last, which is 100% fulfilled, even to the extent a relative who became a Queen also became a Baha'i, Queen Marie of Romania.

Where are the other Monarchies? Did they fall as predicted! Yes indeed they did.

Most probably the Queen of England never saw Bahaollah's missive. Such inane letters from people are replied by the secretaries saying that her majesty appreciates Bahaollah's desire for world peace and wishes him God-Speed. Was the reply signed by the queen? I would like to see that. How does Bahaollah's reply in praising Queen matters? Did it change the Britain in any way? Britain supported Bahaollah because he was not a friend to the Iranian regime. That is how Bahaollah got away from Iran, with the support of Britain and help from the Ottomans.
How does Mary of Romania being impressed by writings of Bahaollah matter? Did Romania become a Bahai nation?

 

[Trailblazer]

Why did the egoist narcissist Bahaollah rule them out?

Such denigration of Baha'u'llah does not warrant an answer, even if I had one.

 

[Truthseeker]

know what my faults are and I have admitted to them many times on this forum. I guess you must have missed those posts.
@Truthseeker knows that I am always admitting my faults. I have never seen you admit to any.

In my Email to Rebecca Hutchinson I said:

But I would say her greatest strength is that she is truthful, even when it doesn't reflect well on her.

I also said:

Her communication style is straightforward. You know where you stand.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Such denigration of Baha'u'llah does not warrant an answer, even if I had one.

Bahaollah just talked while living in large mansions, Gandhi and King lost their lives for what they did and their belief.
Akka Barracks was not a prison, it was a whole building given to Bahaullah and his followers, 3 wives, 14 children, some 70 followers.

Acra Baracks

https://beyondforeignness.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/mansion-bahji-south-recent.jpg Mansion at Bahji

Mazarih

These building have been renovated or are being renovated.

 

[Brickjectivity]

Nothing can erase national boundaries. Have the Christian majority nations of Europe or America erased the boundaries? Then we have constraints of religions. Will Isarel and Iran, Azerbaijan and Armenia, India and Pakistan ever erase their boundaries? What kind of pipe-dream do you or Bahais have?

I think we are having a language disconnect. A 'Pipe dream' means someone thinks something crazy will inevitably happen. That is a pipe dream. All I have said is that if the OP wants to accomplish X they have to eliminate national boundaries; and to do that requires solutions in human psychology and ending scarcity. Those are two problems to resolve.

I think it is possible. I don't think its inevitable.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Scarcity or abundance does not affect this. The OP too walks in clouds. Peace and brotherhood are slogans of wolves. The world will continue to be what it is. Prophets/sons/messengers/manifestations/mahdis cannot change this.

 

[CG Didymus]

I see if one in intent on rejecting the Prophecies...

But there are also all the prophecies about the return of Christ, Krishna, Buddha, the coming of the Messiah, the Madhi etc. I don't know of any that are not questionable and therefore should be questioned and examined. Did Baha'u'llah really fulfill them? Of course, Baha'is are satisfied and say "yes". But, for me, too many are too vague and contrived. Like the Three Woes of Revelation. Like the Comforter.

But then, I think some of those that Jesus supposedly fulfilled are just as bad. Like the one verse in Isaiah that is used to show that the Messiah will be born of a virgin. They work great for believers, but all they really show is how gullible believers can be.

 

[CG Didymus]

Trailblazer, don't ask us to go to your advertising material, say in short what you want to say right here. There have been many leaders whose work has contributed to education and upliftment of humanity and betterment of morals more than what Bahaollah and his followers have been able to do. Should we, then consider them as manifestations of God? Gandhi and Martin Luther King are examples, and there will be many in the next 800 years. Why did the egoist narcissist Bahaollah rule them out?

For me, Joseph Smith made-up all that stuff about Golden Plates and the Angel Moroni. But his religion has more followers than the supposed "true" religion, the Baha'i Faith. And had done all sorts of good. But, to me, it's based on a fabricated, phony story. But it works and is believed.

 

[Trailblazer]

Bahaollah just talked while living in large mansions, Gandhi and King lost their lives for what they did and their belief.
Akka Barracks was not a prison, it was a whole building given to Bahaullah and his followers, 3 wives, 14 children, some 70 followers.

Your allegations against Baha'u'llah make it sound as if Baha'u'llah lived in large mansions for His entire life. That is not true.
I have a lot of videos of Baha'u'llah's life, but the following video is my favorite and it accurately depicts the history of Baha'u'llah's life.
Click on Watch on YouTube to view the video.

I thank you for bringing this up, since I just watched the video again and took some notes. I suggest you watch the entire video, which is only about 22 minutes long, but in case you won't want to watch the whole video, I highlighted the the beginning with the last period of His life, the second time He was imprisoned in Akka, after which time He was released to a house in the city, and then occupied two mansions, where He spent the remainder of His life.

14:47 In August 1868, Baha'u'llah and His companions arrived in Haifa. Then they boarded a sailing vessel to cross the bay to Akka.
Baha'u'llah arrival in Akka opened the last and longest phase of His ministry; one third of His life over half of His mission.

14:52 Barracks at prison in Akka

15:50 Entered prison at Akka

17:40 October 1870 – Baha’u’llah were released from the prison barracks and removed to a house in the western quarter of the city.

19:29 In the years following the revelation of the Kitab-i-Aqdas The attitude of the authorities and the public towards Baha'u'llah and His family and His followers underwent a gradual but dramatic transformation.

19:44 Mansion of Mazra‘ih for 2 years, was too small for Baha’u’llah and His family, so in 1879 Abdu'l-Baha rented the mansion at Bahji. Bahá’u’lláh characterized the Mansion of Bahjí as the "lofty mansion," the spot which "God hath ordained as the most sublime vision of mankind.” There Baha’u’llah lived until He died in 1892.

 

[ppp]

Scarcity or abundance does not affect this. The OP too walks in clouds. Peace and brotherhood are slogans of wolves. The world will continue to be what it is. Prophets/sons/messengers/manifestations/mahdis cannot change this.

The OP simultaneously preaches for harmony while inciting divisiveness. The OP is confused.

 

[CG Didymus]

Bahaollah just talked while living in large mansions, Gandhi and King lost their lives for what they did and their belief.
Akka Barracks was not a prison, it was a whole building given to Bahaullah and his followers, 3 wives, 14 children, some 70 followers.

Acra Baracks

https://beyondforeignness.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/mansion-bahji-south-recent.jpg Mansion at Bahji

Mazarih

These building have been renovated or are being renovated.

I wonder, he was a prisoner with, I assume nothing, how did he afford a mansion? Then how did Abdul Baha' get the rights and the money to buy the Mt. Carmel property?

Even now they still have plenty of money to spend on buildings. So, that's one thing they got going for them.

The Lotus Temple is a House of Worship located in New Delhi, India, and also a prominent attraction in Delhi. The temple was designed by Fariborz Sahba, an architect from Iran. The temple took 6 years to complete, where the construction began on April 21, 1980, and the edifice was formally dedicated to the Unity of God, Unity of Religion and Unity of Mankind on December, 1986. It cost an approximate US $20 million dollars. [1] It has won numerous architectural awards and been featured in hundreds of newspaper and magazine articles.​

​

The Lotus Temple, New Delhi, India.

 

[Trailblazer]

I wonder, he was a prisoner with, I assume nothing, how did he afford a mansion?

He did not buy the mansion, Abdu'l-Baha rented it.

Bahá’u’lláh moves to Bahjí​

In September 1879 ‘Abdu’l-Bahá rented a mansion that had been built by ‘Údí Khammár near ‘Akká. Named Bahjí (Delight), it was to be the home of Bahá’u’lláh for the remaining twelve and a half years of His life.

Recognition of Bahá’u’lláh continues to grow​

The mansion provided the space required by Bahá’u’lláh and His family to meet visitors and friends that came to see Him as His religion continued to grow beyond Iran and the Ottoman Empire.

Bahá’u’lláh moves to Bahjí - The Life of Bahá'u'lláh

In September 1879 ‘Abdu’l-Bahá rented a mansion that had been built by ‘Údí Khammár near ‘Akká. Named Bahjí (Delight), it was to be the home of Bahá’u’lláh for the remaining twelve and a half years of His life.

www.bahaullah.org

 

[Aupmanyav]

Your allegations against Baha'u'llah make it sound as if Baha'u'llah lived in large mansions for His entire life.

Did I say anything wrong? Bahaollah and his entourage lived for two years in the the Akka baracks (after just 4 months in Iranian prison), two years in Mazarih, and the next 20 years in Bahji mansion. He did not suffer imprisonment for 27 years like Nelson Mandela did.

 

[Trailblazer]

Did I say anything wrong? Bahaollah and his entourage lived for two years in the the Akka baracks (after just 4 months in Iranian prison), two years in Mazarih, and the next 20 years in Bahji mansion. He did not suffer imprisonment for 27 years like Nelson Mandela did.

No, you did not say anything wrong. Allegations was too strong of a word for me to use.

If you read my post you would see that Baha'u'llah and His family were in the Mansion of Mazra‘ih for 2 years, which was too small for Baha’u’llah and His family, so in 1879 Abdu'l-Baha rented the mansion at Bahji. Bahá’u’lláh died in 1892 so He spent 13 (not 20) years in the mansion at Bahji.

No, Baha'u'llah was not imprisoned for 27 years, but He was in exile and banishment for the better part of 40 years, during which time He was imprisoned at Akka twice for short periods of time. Just because He was not in prison as long as Nelson Mandela that doesn't mean He did not suffer as much or more.

 

[Aupmanyav]

I wonder, he was a prisoner with, I assume nothing, how did he afford a mansion? Then how did Abdul Baha' get the rights and the money to buy the Mt. Carmel property?

That is the advantage of being a prophet/son/messenger/manifestation/mahdi/gurus. They never need to work for their living. Their followers support them. Someone wrote in the forum recently that only one OT prophet worked for his living. Otherwise we have the examples of Agha Khan, the Dai of Dawoodi Bohras, and the lineages of Vallabha and Nirmbarka in India and many others. Bahaollah too did not work for a living, and similar was the case of Abbas or Shoghi in his lineage. All they did was to weave their stories. It is fun, all paid for, once the corporation is established.

 

[Aupmanyav]

If you read my post you would see that Bahaullah and His family were in the Mansion of Mazra‘ih for 2 years, which was too small for Baha’u’llah and His family, so in 1879 Abdu'l-Baha rented the mansion at Bahji. Bahá’u’lláh died in 1892 so He spent 13 (not 20) years in the mansion at Bahji.

No, Baha'u'llah was not imprisoned for 27 years, but He was in exile and banishment for the better part of 40 years, during which time He was imprisoned at Akka twice for short periods of time. Juest becaue He was not in prison as long as Nelson Mandela that doesn't mean He did not suffer as much or more.

OK. Not for 20, but for 15 years, from 1877 till his death in 1892 (I find the information ambiguous about this). After leaving Akka baracks, Bahaollah lived in several houses before settling down in the House of Abbud. Mazarih mansion was a little cramped. But the flow of money increases over time and Abbas was able to rent the Bahji mansion.

 

[danieldemol]

He did not buy the mansion, Abdu'l-Baha rented it.

But how did he afford to rent a mansion? I bet you do not even know the answer in my opinion.

 

[Aupmanyav]

But how did he afford to rent a mansion? I bet you do not even know the answer in my opinion.

It is simple. Bahaollah and Abbas did not work for living. So the money must have either been from Bahaollah's family or provided by his followers. Family money cannot last for ever with three wives, 14 children, and there were other claimants too. Bahaollah's father had
four wives and three concubines, and at least 15 children - Mírzá ʻAbbás Núrí - Wikipedia. So the answer is obvious.

 

[Trailblazer]

But how did he afford to rent a mansion? I bet you do not even know the answer in my opinion.

No, I don't know. Why should I know?
One of the other Baha'is such as @Truthseeker might know, since he knows a lot of the history of the Faith.