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Which Jesus is the right one?
- Thread starter oldbadger
- Start date
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
Not right now. 
Yeah, he could move mountains, but was powerless against Covid or forest fires, floods too.
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Ebionite
Well-Known Member
He was falsely accused of speaking against Rome. Here's the text where they tried to entrap him:
Then went the Pharisees, and took counsel how they might entangle him in [his] talk.
And they sent out unto him their disciples with the Herodians, saying, Master, we know that thou art true, and teachest the way of God in truth, neither carest thou for any [man]: for thou regardest not the person of men.
Tell us therefore, What thinkest thou? Is it lawful to give tribute unto Caesar, or not?
But Jesus perceived their wickedness, and said, Why tempt ye me, [ye] hypocrites?
Shew me the tribute money. And they brought unto him a penny.
And he saith unto them, Whose [is] this image and superscription?
They say unto him, Caesar's. Then saith he unto them, Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's.
When they had heard [these words], they marvelled, and left him, and went their way.
Matthew 22:15-22
Ebionite
Well-Known Member
YHWH [is] a man of war: YHWH [is] his name.
Exodus 15:3
but:
Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This [is] the word of YHWH unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith YHWH of armies.
Zechariah 4:6
The context relates to the anointed ones (messiahs)
Then said he, These [are] the two anointed ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth.
Zechariah 4:14
oldbadger
Skanky Old Mongrel!
No, he wasn't!
The above shows that he was NOT accused of anything. They just tried to catch him out, and failed.
The Priesthood was totally corrupt, it secretly cared nothing for Rome, but it would have been convenient if Jesus might have spoken out against Rome rather than themselves. But he didn't, so no accusation.
oldbadger
Skanky Old Mongrel!
I expect that one Jesus was indeed a fighter. That is shown in the gospels by what that Jesus said and did.
But I don't take much interest in prophesies spoken nor later claims of fulfillment.
Ebionite
Well-Known Member
Yes, he was.
And they began to accuse him, saying, We found this [fellow] perverting the nation, and forbidding to give tribute to Caesar, saying that he himself is Christ a King.
Luke 23:2
oldbadger
Skanky Old Mongrel!
In your chosen example Jesus was not accused, true?
Please acknowledge this and then we could look at your next offer.
OK?
Ebionite
Well-Known Member
What do you think "began to accuse" means?
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
I personally believe that in some cases He chooses not to act.Not right now.
Yeah, he could move mountains, but was powerless against Covid or forest fires, floods too.
oldbadger
Skanky Old Mongrel!
No Ebionite, they didn't get the chance. Their ruse was bust before it began. Jesus didn't bite!
Ebionite
Well-Known Member
Ignoring the facts doesn't help your argument. They accused him of forbidding the giving of tribute to Caesar.
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Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
That is being insensitive to the travails of people. That is why not every prayer is not answered. He willfully chooses to ignore it.
oldbadger
Skanky Old Mongrel!
Huh. Please show me a couple of verses that tell about this accusation.
Please?
Ebionite
Well-Known Member
My #207, for starters.
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
See my latest true story. I could have easily said that God was being insensitive to the suffering of my daughter and of me.
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
Here, I'll copy it for you: Once I had two daughters only 20 months apart. I was lulled into a false sense of security with the first one, because she literally slept most of the time, and when she was awake, she was charming and did everything early. Along comes the second one, and not only did she not do ANYTHING early, she screamed every single day from 4 till 7 and didn't sleep through the night for a year, etc. etc. She also would projectile vomit everything I gave her to eat. Finally at 4 months, after changing her formula over and over again, and doing everything I knew how to do to calm her down from 4 till 7, the doctor said, "I think she has cerebral palsy. We won't know for sure till she's around a year old but here's the name of the pediatric neurologist in Atlanta I want you to take her to see. And here's the name of the therapist for afterward. You cannot expect her to ever sit on her own or tie her own shoelaces. " So I cried and made the appointment and railed at God and I didn't understand why he was allowing her to suffer and not me. So there's a certain amount of suffering the world has to suffer for whatever reason? OK, then STRIKE ME instead of this innocent baby. Fast forward to a few months later when I could finally get in to see the pediatric neurologist. My husband and I bundled up this baby and parked the car in the parking garage and went up to the 4th floor to see this doctor. He looked over all her paperwork and grinned and said, "OK so here's what I'm seeing. Your baby definitely had a brain INJURY at birth, but she fully recovered. So, no brain DAMAGE, just a brain INJURY." I WAS SO RELIEVED! So my husband and I went down the elevator and into the parking garage and suddenly behind us, this doctor came running up to us, and literally said, with tears in his eyes, "I never, NEVER get to tell parents good news. I just wanted to tell you that you give me hope." Suddenly, it all made sense to me. And God didn't have to move that doctor to go find us in the parking garage. He didn't have to move him at all in fact. He didn't have to do anything. But He let me know WHY and it was amazing to me.
This daughter by the way, joined the military and passed the physical with flying colors.
This daughter by the way, joined the military and passed the physical with flying colors.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
God has not heard of the screams of Gazans, Ukrainians, Israelis and Russians.
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
I believe He has but they don't know His full plan yet.
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
He probably has bigger plans than we know about. One time He did let me see his larger plan. It was amazing. Prior to that, I would have told you that He was being insensitive to the travails of my daughter. Here's the true story:
Once I had two daughters only 20 months apart. I was lulled into a false sense of security with the first one, because she literally slept most of the time, and when she was awake, she was charming and did everything early. Along comes the second one, and not only did she not do ANYTHING early, she screamed every single day from 4 till 7 and didn't sleep through the night for a year, etc. etc. She also would projectile vomit everything I gave her to eat. Finally at 4 months, after changing her formula over and over again, and doing everything I knew how to do to calm her down from 4 till 7, the doctor said, "I think she has cerebral palsy. We won't know for sure till she's around a year old but here's the name of the pediatric neurologist in Atlanta I want you to take her to see. And here's the name of the therapist for afterward. You cannot expect her to ever sit on her own or tie her own shoelaces. " So I cried and made the appointment and railed at God and I didn't understand why he was allowing her to suffer and not me. So there's a certain amount of suffering the world has to suffer for whatever reason? OK, then STRIKE ME instead of this innocent baby. Fast forward to a few months later when I could finally get in to see the pediatric neurologist. My husband and I bundled up this baby and parked the car in the parking garage and went up to the 4th floor to see this doctor. He looked over all her paperwork and grinned and said, "OK so here's what I'm seeing. Your baby definitely had a brain INJURY at birth, but she fully recovered. So, no brain DAMAGE, just a brain INJURY." I WAS SO RELIEVED! So my husband and I went down the elevator and into the parking garage and suddenly behind us, this doctor came running up to us, and literally said, with tears in his eyes, "I never, NEVER get to tell parents good news. I just wanted to tell you that you give me hope." Suddenly, it all made sense to me. And God didn't have to move that doctor to go find us in the parking garage. He didn't have to move him at all in fact. He didn't have to do anything. But He let me know WHY and it was amazing to me.
This daughter by the way, joined the military and passed the physical with flying colors.
But before I could know God's plan, I had to be OK with my daughter not being OK. I never expected to know God's plan. Honestly, God's plan was the last thing on my mind.