RESOLUTION
Active Member
The KJV of the bible is the nearest to the original Torah and that is why it is a preferred translation.
The fact is that the covenants made
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Who are the real Children of Israel?
The KJV of the bible is the nearest to the original Torah and that is why it is a preferred translation.
The fact is that the covenants made
rosends
Well-Known Member
You really should read the posts people write to you. Go back to #82 and #83. If your only method is to keep reposting the same material which has been refuted it shows that you aren't paying attention. The fact that you don't understand Kissinger's quote is just plain sad. Calling someone a "wandering Jew" doesn't mean he is being called a Jew. The Wandering Jew is an archetype.
Wandering Jew - Wikipedia
Think Classical: Wotan - the Wandering Jew - and his Untergang
Imagining “the Jew”: Dickens’ Romantic Heritage
Tazarah
Well-Known Member
So Kissinger was calling the Igbo “mystical” men, LOL.
None of the info I posted has been refuted. There you go again claiming your statements as facts just because you want them to be.
The map that I posted of Africa with the slave coast labeled as “The Kingdom of Juda” is the nail in the coffin. Everybody knows the biblical jews fled into Africa to avoid being captured, but they were still captured. Why did the colonizers label the slave coast as the “Kingdom of Juda” on their maps? Think about it, they labeled the SLAVE COAST as the “Kingdom of Juda”.... then they went there specifically, captured negroes, put yokes of iron around their necks, and then put them on ships and sent them to ALL nations in bondage to serve enemies in unknown lands..... HAHAHAHA!
I don’t expect you to admit the truth because the lies that have been told are evil and wicked indeed. A nation of people was robbed of their heritage and forced to serve enemies in unknown lands (Jeremiah 17:4). But trying to continue the lies is where you will fail, no matter how hard you try.
Because like I said, even your OWN people and your OWN encyclopedias/documents admit the truth and have it recorded.
“The 1973 Jewish Encyclopedia documents that approximately 90% of the world’s so-called Jews are Khazar.
A. N. Poliak, Professor of Medieval Jewish History at Tel Aviv University, says that the majority of Eastern European Jews are Khazar and Japhetic in origin, not Semitic. Immigration statistics indicate approximately 90% of the world’s so-called or self-styled ‘Jews’ living in 42 countries of the world are emigrants of Eastern European Khazar Jews.”
rosends
Well-Known Member
Um, no. You should read what the archetype is. The Jewish Encyclopedia (a fave of yours, it seems) has it as "The figure of the doomed sinner, forced to wander without the hope of rest in death till the millennium," If you look at Kissinger's description of the Igbo as "at best envied and resented, but mostly despised by their neighbors in the federation." he is clearly invoking a literary trope, not making an identification of national origin. Do you really not know basic English devices?
So you can just keep on reposting the same material which has been debunked on this very thread if you want. It won't add anything because it isn't adding anything.
And the Kingdom was called Juda by the French. The Yoruba called it Xweda. So the people who lived there didn't connect it to Juda. The outsiders assigned it a name which it reminded them of, Anglicizing it. Look at the list here and see how others transliterated the name in a way that meant something to them. On this map, 2 names are given depending on the language. But this is just more stuff you will ignore. I'll leave you to respond (thus proving that you know you are wrong...remember?) and I'll go to sleep. You'll still be wrong tomorrow.
Tazarah
Well-Known Member
OK, so basically he called them jews but at the same time they are not jews. He just threw the word jews in there for the heck of it. Lmao. Where are you getting this childish nonsense from? It’s pathetic. Next you’re going to tell me that the sky isn’t blue and that whenever somebody says that the sky is blue, they are not really calling it blue. They are just saying that it’s blue. But they don’t mean it. Regardless of whether or not we are talking about a 100% authentic, historical, documented white house memo stored in the U.S. government archives.
— the passage that you referenced from the jewish encyclopedia has absolutely NOTHING to do with anything that Henry Kissinger said about the Igbo, you are so desperate that now you’re just trying to pull whatever kind of farce that you can.
LOL!!!!!!!!
And wow..... re-read what you just wrote about the map and what it says about the slave coast. What do translations have to do with the fact that they labeled the slave coast as the kingdom of Judah? Regardless, ALL of those translations mean the same thing - JUDAH. So now your argument is that they named the slave coast the kingdom of Judah just for the heck of it, right?
lmao!!!!!!
P.S. the map that you posted is the SAME exact map that I posted. And it says: JUDAH, regardless of what language it is written in — all of the colonizers labeled the slave coast as the same thing: “the Kingdom of JUDAH”.
And you say that I’m the one making public mistakes and making a fool of myself?
LMFAO.
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Tazarah
Well-Known Member
How does it contradict? The purpose of this thread is to prove who the true Israelites are according to the facts from the bible and facts from history.
Tumah
Veteran Member
No there hasn't. There's been a few, mostly made by the same few people. Conversely, as I showed you in my previous post, there have been a numerous genetic studies indicating that Jews the world over are related and that this is the position of the majority of geneticists.
No, I'm calling you a liar. You made a claim about the JE of 1972 that you could not back up with any proof. You also made a claim about the JE of 1906 which was based on your misunderstanding the context of the statement. I'm not saying anything about the scholars of the JE's, because so far, you haven't established that they've said what you've been saying.
You do keep repeating though, as though you think that it will become true if you state it often enough.
Get that beam out of your eye.
No, I'm claiming that this image is not necessarily indication of his actual color and that studies have been performed to determine it. If you actually read that whole article, you'll see that a genetic study on another Egyptian king indicated that he had pale skin and red hair. That there would have been an admixture of sub-Saharan peoples in Egypt would not be surprising. But that the people should also bare similar skin tones to the rest of the peoples of the Middle East should also not be surprising since it is the country of Africa that sits within the Middle East. So we won't be surprised when the Israelites were not identified specially by their skin tone. Similarly, we don't find any Biblical passages indicating that the Israelites skin tone was different than the Canaanites or surrounding nations during the years we sat in the Land of Israel.
All you need to do is prove it, instead of repeating it over and over again. If it's a known fact, show me the sources and the evidence. I know there was a small contingent of Jews who fled to Egypt after the destruction of the First Temple and took Jeremiah with them. I know there was a large community of Jews in Egypt around the destruction of the Second Temple, such that they even had their own area of land. I have not seen any evidence about a large community of Jews moving to Africa.
It seems that for you, cold, hard facts means repeating the same defeated claims over and over again. I can only suggest that maybe the reason you keep repeating these same claims is because you have trouble relating to the truth?
No it doesn't prove that Christian colonizers knew they were enslaving the sons of Jacob. It proves that there was a kingdom in Africa who's name when pronounced one way, was phonetically similar to the English pronunciation of the Hebrew "Yehudah". Just like the neighboring kingdom Asiante was also pronounced as Inta. Although maybe we can prove from here that the English colonizers believed they were enslaving Asians from this map.
All that aside, I think it's pretty well established that the Christians of Europe believed European Jews to be the real Jews.
There is literally nothing in Deut. 28 pointing to the trans-atlantic slave trade. The only mention of passing over water is in the verse describing Jews being sent back to Egypt. That would pass through the Mediterranean Sea, not the Atlantic Ocean.
Tumah
Veteran Member
It's not clear that you are actually familiar with Jewish history. After the split in the monarchy, the Southern Kingdom also called the Kingdom of Judah, was made up of the tribes of Judah, Benjamin and some Levites. Later, the Assyrians conquered the Northern Kingdom made up of the other 10 tribes, and killed and exiled it's members. Some of those people either escaped or were later brought back to the Southern Kingdom, but the vast majority was exiled into Assyrian territories or dead. At this point, the Kingdom of Judea houses all the remaining tribes. After the Babylonians conquer the Southern Kingdom, they renamed it Judea (and some variant of that over the following centuries). Anyone who comes from this region, regardless of tribal affiliation, is called a Judean. Mordecai, for instance, is called a Judean in the Book of Esther, even though his tribal affiliation is Benjamin. It is for this reason that Jews are called Jews - we were identified as Judeans, which became Jude, and in English, Jew. The area retains the name Judea all the way until the Romans rename it Palestine after defeating the Jews living there.
So now, when you say, "Judah fled into Africa", I have no idea what you're talking about. You clearly can't be talking about after the destruction of the First Temple, because Jewish history continues in Israel for hundreds of years after that. Yet you can't be talking about after the destruction of the Second Temple either because the tribe of Judah was indistinguishable from any other tribe and regardless, we have historical sources putting the Judeans in countries of the region, mostly Babylon, Rome and Egypt.
That verse isn't talking about enslavement, it's talking about spreading a message. The very next verse continues the idea of spreading a message all over the world. Have you even read the Book? The whole section, from chapter 15 -19 is talking about a message to the nations that G-d would take vengeance on behalf of Israel. It has nothing to do with the slave trade.
Igbo Jews are members of the Igbo people of Nigeria who practice a form of Judaism. They either adopted Judaism newly, or are descendants of the Jews of Bilad el-Sudan.
Jews of the Bilad al-Sudan describes West African Jewish communities who were connected to known Jewish communities from the Middle East, North Africa, or Spain and Portugal. Various historical records attest to their presence at one time in the Ghana, Mali, and Songhai empires, then called the Bilad as-Sudan from the Arabic meaning Land of the Blacks.
According to most accounts, the earliest Jewish settlements in Africa were in places such as Egypt, Tunisia, and Morocco. Jews had settled along the Upper Nile at Elephantine in Egypt. These communities were augmented by subsequent arrivals of Jews after the destruction of the Second Temple in Jerusalem in 70 CE, when 30,000 Jewish slaves were settled throughout Carthage by the Roman emperor Titus.
As early as Roman times, Moroccan Jews had begun to travel inland to trade with groups of Berbers, most of whom were nomads who dwelt in remote areas of the Atlas Mountains. Jews lived side by side with Berbers, forging both economic and cultural ties; some Berbers even began to practice Judaism.
An early (and widely influential) statement from an Igbo man, Olaudah Equiano, a Christian-educated freed slave, suggested a migratory origin of the Igbo Jews. He remarked in his autobiography of 1789 on
His essay has since been discarded as speculation. Critical historians have carefully reviewed the historical literature on West Africa during the nineteenth and early twentieth centuries. They have clarified the diverse functions (quite aside from questions of validity) which such histories served for the writers who proposed them at various times in the colonial and post-colonial past.[2][3]
Knowledge from sources broader and more self-critical than the Biblical — from contemporary historians, archaeologists, historical linguists, and other scientifically based disciplines — have argued against these claims. There is no doubt that Jews were present in Saharan trade centers during the first millennium AD,[4] but the proposition that Jews were directly involved with Igbo-speaking peoples in ancient times is controversial.
Jews of Bilad el-Sudan - Wikipedia
Igbo Jews - Wikipedia
Jews of the Bilad al-Sudan describes West African Jewish communities who were connected to known Jewish communities from the Middle East, North Africa, or Spain and Portugal. Various historical records attest to their presence at one time in the Ghana, Mali, and Songhai empires, then called the Bilad as-Sudan from the Arabic meaning Land of the Blacks.
According to most accounts, the earliest Jewish settlements in Africa were in places such as Egypt, Tunisia, and Morocco. Jews had settled along the Upper Nile at Elephantine in Egypt. These communities were augmented by subsequent arrivals of Jews after the destruction of the Second Temple in Jerusalem in 70 CE, when 30,000 Jewish slaves were settled throughout Carthage by the Roman emperor Titus.
As early as Roman times, Moroccan Jews had begun to travel inland to trade with groups of Berbers, most of whom were nomads who dwelt in remote areas of the Atlas Mountains. Jews lived side by side with Berbers, forging both economic and cultural ties; some Berbers even began to practice Judaism.
An early (and widely influential) statement from an Igbo man, Olaudah Equiano, a Christian-educated freed slave, suggested a migratory origin of the Igbo Jews. He remarked in his autobiography of 1789 on
"the strong analogy which... appears to prevail in the manners and customs of my countrymen and those of the Jews, before they reached the Land of Promise, and particularly the patriarchs while they were yet in that pastoral state which is described in Genesis — an analogy, which alone would induce me to think that the one people had sprung from the other." For authoritative support, he gives reference to "Dr. Gill, who, in his commentary on Genesis, very ably deduces the pedigree of the Africans from Afer and Afra, the descendants of Abraham....[1]
His essay has since been discarded as speculation. Critical historians have carefully reviewed the historical literature on West Africa during the nineteenth and early twentieth centuries. They have clarified the diverse functions (quite aside from questions of validity) which such histories served for the writers who proposed them at various times in the colonial and post-colonial past.[2][3]
Knowledge from sources broader and more self-critical than the Biblical — from contemporary historians, archaeologists, historical linguists, and other scientifically based disciplines — have argued against these claims. There is no doubt that Jews were present in Saharan trade centers during the first millennium AD,[4] but the proposition that Jews were directly involved with Igbo-speaking peoples in ancient times is controversial.
Jews of Bilad el-Sudan - Wikipedia
Igbo Jews - Wikipedia
As you can see, the question was whether North African Jews had made their way into sub-Saharan Africa and mixed with the natives.
Tazarah
Well-Known Member
1. Ok, so now the jewish encyclopedia is no longer credible. LOL.
2. WHAT article are you talking about? So now you’re trying to tell me that King Tut wasn’t a black african — he just had himself and his wife portrayed as black african people on his royal golden throne for the heck of it. LOL.
3. All of the different translations translate to the same exact thing — JUDAH. Regardless of what language it is, all of the translations say “Kingdom of Judah”. So now you’re telling me they all labeled it the kingdom of Judah just because they felt like it? LMAO. Christian colonizers labeled the slave coast as the kingdom of JUDAH, they then captured negroes from there, put YOKES OF IRON upon their necks, put them on SHIPS, sent them to ALL nations to be sold to their enemies and serve them in bondage — just like the prophetic curses said would happen.
— your pathetic argument has become so weak that it’s funny. You deny facts and when they are too obvious to deny, you lie and twist up the facts as if you honestly believe that people will be stupid enough to believe you. What a joke. You are jew-ISH, but you are NOT a descendant of the biblical Jews/Israelites. All of the facts are against you, regardless of how hard you attempt to lie and twist the truth.
"White House Memo Of 1969 Under Nixon Called The Igbo Jews Of West Africa"
White House Memo Of 1969 Under Nixon Called The Igbo Jews Of West Africa
In a White House memo dated Tuesday, January 28, 1969, to President Nixon, former Secretary of State, Henry Kissinger describes the Igbos as "the wandering Jews of West Africa-gifted, aggressive, westernized, at best envied and resented, but mostly despised by their neighbors in the federation." (foreign relations document, volume E-5, documents on Africa 1969-1972).
Here is a photo of the text from the actual memo:
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/image...ee3fd6ded164bf7e922483f84300f764de7dabc3b.png
Here is a web link to the actual memo:
Foreign Relations of the United States, 1969–1976, Volume E–5, Part 1, Documents on Sub-Saharan Africa, 1969–1972 - Office of the Historian
Tumah
Veteran Member
That is not a proof and again points to you lack of knowledge of Jewish history. Ashkenaz is the medieval Jewish name for Germany. Sefard is the Jewish name for Spain. Sephardic Jews is the name we call Jews whose ancestors ended up in Spain. Ashkenazi Jews is the name we use for Jews whose ancestors ended up in Germany. Teimani Jews is the name we use for Jews who ended up in Yemen.
The reason why Ashkenaz is linked with Germany in Jewish culture is because of a Talmudic passage that says that Ashkenaz is a place called "Germania". It's possible that this was a scribal error that should have read "Germanicia" which was a place in Syria and today, Turkey. Regardless, the link between Ashkenaz and Germany had been set in European Jewish culture and from there, was the name derived.
Tazarah
Well-Known Member
You people have fulfilled zero of the prophetic curses. Never been on ships, never served enemies in unknown lands, never had yokes of iron upon your necks, you are not OPPRESSED FOREVER (Deuteronomy 28:29, Deuteronomy 28:33)Israel is one of the wealthiest if not the wealthiest nation on the planet. You match ZERO of the curses. Your people took the holy land by force in 1947 with the help of the UN and a balfour declaration. Where is that in bible prophecy? lmao.
“Their visage is BLACKER than a coal; they are not known in the streets: their skin cleaveth to their bones; it is withered, it is become like a stick.” [Lamentations 4:8]
“Our skin was BLACK like an oven because of the terrible famine.” [Lamentations 5:10]
“Are ye not as children of the ETHIOPIANS unto me, O children of Israel? saith the LORD. Have not I brought up Israel out of the land of Egypt? and the Philistines from Caphtor, and the Syrians from Kir?” [Amos 9:7]
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Tazarah
Well-Known Member
“It’s possible that this was a scribal error”
LMAOOOOO!
No sir, it is definitely not an error. It means exactly what it says. GENTILES.
Like I have told you, like the JEWISH ENCYCLOPEDIA has told you — you all descend from EUROPEANS.
Cut the BS.
Tazarah
Well-Known Member
Hey, is this picture of the popes a scribal error too?
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Tumah
Veteran Member
No, it's you that's not credible because - as I keep saying - you have not proven that the Jewish Encyclopedia says what you are claiming it says. If I say the Encyclopedia Africana says that Black people are descendant from the Japanese, would you believe me just because I said it, or would you require that I actually showed you a link or image of the page that says it?
So you're not actually reading what anyone is responding to you with? No wonder you keep repeating the same things.
Anyways, you can find it here:
Ancient Egyptian race controversy - Wikipedia
And you should probably read the entire page.
No, I am not trying to tell you that the labeled it the kingdom of Judah because they felt like it. I'm trying to tell you that they labeled it the kingdom of Judah because there was probably some phonetic similarity between the local pronunciation of the name and the kingdom and the word "Judah", or it was the closest approximation that the cartographer was familiar with. Just because two words sound the same though, don't mean that they are describing the same thing. For instance, if you were asked to write the words "red" and "read (passed tense)" in a different language, you'd write them with the same spelling even though they're not the same word in English.
You keep repeating this and I can only assume that this is your way of denying all the disproofs you have been shown in this thread.
Yes, I already responded to this in your previous post and I'll add here, that President Nixon is not the one who establishes the roots of a nation. You probably already know that the President wasn't a scientist, geneticist or historian, so his words on this issue carry very little, if any, weight. The question of Igbo roots remains controversial to this day and - as you may suspect - scientists, geneticists and historians don't rely on the words of President Nixon for establishing historical accuracy.
Tumah
Veteran Member
I have no idea. I'm not Christian or Catholic and don't particularly care what the Pope does. But I'm not sure I even understand your question. Are you suggesting that the Pope is praying to a picture of a black madonna should be proof that he believes Jews were black?
Here is the same pope kissing the knees of a white Jesus.
Does that mean he believes that Jesus' mother was black but Jesus himself was white? Seems like there might be an adoption story here behind the scenes.
Tazarah
Well-Known Member
So I guess the jewish professor at tel aviv university is lying, right? Why don’t you prove that it DOESN’T document what all of the sources say that it says? The burden of proof lies on the accuser. I have shown you what it says, now why don’t you prove me wrong? It should be easy, seeing how it isn’t the truth, right? Look at you bro, giving me wikipedia links but at the same time denying actual studies done by jewish professors themselves, along with information that comes from jewish sources. You’re a wreck. Then when it comes to other facts that you’ve been presented with, like nixon, or the slave coast being called the kingdom of Judah, you reply with “it probably”, or “it likely”, LMAO. You have been thoroughly demolished. All of the facts are against you and you’re like a little child backed into a corner with no other options, I feel embarrased for you but you keep replying as if you like being made a fool of. That map says JUDAH. It translates to JUDAH. Cut the BS. It’s a fact that your people have never been affected by any of the prophetic curses, and it’s a fact that this whole time you have been doing everything to snake your way out of dealing with facts because you KNOW that they are all against you.
Tazarah
Well-Known Member
I have no idea. I'm not Christian or Catholic and don't particularly care what the Pope does. But I'm not sure I even understand your question. Are you suggesting that the Pope is praying to a picture of a black madonna should be proof that he believes Jews were black?
Here is the same pope kissing the knees of a white Jesus.
Does that mean he believes that Jesus' mother was black but Jesus himself was white? Seems like there might be an adoption story here behind the scenes.
“Their visage is BLACKER than a coal; they are not known in the streets: their skin cleaveth to their bones; it is withered, it is become like a stick.” [Lamentations 4:8]
“Our skin was BLACK like an oven because of the terrible famine.” [Lamentations 5:10]
“Are ye not as children of the ETHIOPIANS unto me, O children of Israel? saith the LORD. Have not I brought up Israel out of the land of Egypt? and the Philistines from Caphtor, and the Syrians from Kir?” [Amos 9:7]
Tumah
Veteran Member
You're like a broken record.
This is all not true.
A report issued by the OECD in 2016 ranks Israel as the country with the highest rates of poverty among its members.
Standard of living in Israel - Wikipedia
Standard of living in Israel - Wikipedia
We match all of them actually.
I actually worked out that the 2300 days of Daniel is the exact number of years between the time the Second Temple construction started and 1947.
This is saying that their pallor was black from hunger.
It's saying the same thing here. Black because of the famine. Not because that was their skin tone.
The word "as" means "like". It doesn't mean that they are Ethiopians, it means that G-d was comparing them to Ethiopians.
Tazarah
Well-Known Member
Everything that you just said is BS. What I noticed about you is that you love to break down my responses sentence by sentence in order to take attention away from the fact that you are a fraud. Everything that you just said was a LIE.
So their skin was black because of the famine? When has anybody’s skin ever turned black because of famine? Wasn’t hitler starving your people to death in those camps? When did ANY of their skin turn black?
LMAO.
And hmmm, I wonder WHY he was comparing the Israelites to ethiopians.
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Faithofchristian
Well-Known Member
My question for you is, As to why are you leaving out Verse's 1-14, when there are 68 Verse's and not 54 Verse's.
Had you read Verse's 1-14, that would tell you, That if the 12 tribes of Israel would do the right things, then God would bless them.
But seeing two tribes of Israel, which are the tribe of Judah and the tribe of Israel, were going in the wrong way, that the curse's were coming on these two tribes,
The other 10 tribes broke off and left the other two tribes, rather than have the Curse's come on them also.
Back around 2000 or more years ago there were no European countries.
Back at that time Europe was nothing more than a vast wilderness with no people in it.
Until 10 tribes of Israel broke off and left Israel went over what is called the caucus mountains. To settle what is now called Europe.
So that only leaves two tribes in Israel the tribe of Judah and the tribe Israel.
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