Who IS "The Only TRUE God"- as Jesus put it?

[groovyable]

Jesus wasn't God, Jesus prayed to God, Spoke to God - when put to death; Claimed he wasn't God therefore he aint God, simple.

 

[ayani]

Jesus wasn't God, Jesus prayed to God, Spoke to God - when put to death; Claimed he wasn't God therefore he aint God, simple.

Jesus also said that if we have seen Him, we have seen God (John 14:6-9). He has the authority of God to forgive sins (Mark 7:1-12), and is called the Good Shepherd, The Resurrection and the Life, and the Light of the World.

clearly, He is no ordinary man, teacher, or prophet. His virgin birth also shows that He is no human, but a Person uniquely sharing in God's divine nature, holiness, and power. His resurrection from the dead shows a singular power over death, evil, sin, and corruption. a power recorded as given only to Him, the Messiah.

yes, He prays to God and teaches us to do the same. He gives His Father all the credit for His miracles, words, and power. at the same time He points to Himself as the only Way to the Father (John 14:6), the cause of believer's eternal life and spiritual vitality (John 14:19, John 15:5), and as having glory with God before the earth was formed (John 17:5). no human man was there at the beginning, only God (Genesis 1:1).

Jesus is not all of God- the Father still reigned in heaven while Jesus walked on earth. but He is certainly "God with us" as scriptures foretell (Isaiah 7:14 and Isaiah 9:8).

without Him, we are spiritually dead, alienated from God, and unable to get nearer to Him on our own (1 Timothy 2:5, John 8:12, John 15:5-8). He is worthy of our respect, worship, focus, adoration, obedience, gratitude, hearts, time, and honor. He is to hold the highest place in the life of a Christian as both Lord and Savior, Messiah, King, and God. not over the Father, but from the Father, of the Father, and one with the Father (John 8:42, John 1:1 and 14).

 

[Fatihah]

Pretty clear... Jesus accepts being called God by Thomas...

Response: He doesn't say that Jesus is his Lord and His God, He says "My Lord and my God". There's a difference. When something happens to a person and they say in response, "Oh my God," are they calling the other person their God? Not at all. It's a figure of speech. So the verse is not sufficient enough to claim that Jesus accepted being acknowledged as God. Plus there is no statement in the whole bible where Jesus says himself that he is God or worship him.

 

[Elessar]

Response: He doesn't say that Jesus is his Lord and His God, He says "My Lord and my God". There's a difference. When something happens to a person and they say in response, "Oh my God," are they calling the other person their God? Not at all. It's a figure of speech. So the verse is not sufficient enough to claim that Jesus accepted being acknowledged as God. Plus there is no statement in the whole bible where Jesus says himself that he is God or worship him.

Then came Chanukah in Yerushalayim. It was winter, and Yeshua was walking around inside the Temple area, in Shlomo's Colonnade. So Judaeans surrounded him and said to him, "How much longer are you going to keep us in suspense? If you are Mashiach, tell us publicly!" Yeshua answered them, "I have already told you, and you don't trust me. The works I do in my father's name testify on my behalf, but the reason you don't trust is that you are not included among my sheep. My sheep listen to my voice, I recognize them, they follow me, and I give them eternal life. They will absolutely never be destroyed, and no one will snatch them from my hands. My father, who gave them to me, is greater than all; and no one can snatch them from the father's hands. I and the father are one. (Aramaic: Eno Ava B'Khad)

The Accounting of the Rabbi's Life by Yochanan (John)
10:22-30

 

[sojourner]

Response: He doesn't say that Jesus is his Lord and His God, He says "My Lord and my God". There's a difference. When something happens to a person and they say in response, "Oh my God," are they calling the other person their God? Not at all. It's a figure of speech. So the verse is not sufficient enough to claim that Jesus accepted being acknowledged as God. Plus there is no statement in the whole bible where Jesus says himself that he is God or worship him.

Except that the Greek isn't written as expletive...

 

[logician]

A lot of "people" have claimed to be gods over the ages. who is correct?

Maybe none of them.

 

[Buttons*]

Is it 3 Gods in 1?
God-the-Father, God-the-Son, and God-the-Ghost?

Did Jesus HAVE a God?

I would say that it is the Oneness of the Gnostic traditions. A "God" that is not a jealous god, that doesn't turn to punishment at first wrongdoing. At least, I assume this because it seems similar to what Yeshua actually preached.

 

[Elessar]

A lot of "people" have claimed to be gods over the ages. who is correct?

Maybe none of them.

This observation is entirely irrelevant in a thread, in a forum explicitly for debates on written scripture, in the case of this specific thread, the Standard Protestant New Testament, related texts (i.e., the Standard Protestant Old Testament), and other versions of both the previous (i.e., the Lutheran New Testament in the former case, or the Jewish Tanakh in the latter case).

 

[jtartar]

Hello,
It is true that most people just will not believe that God and Jesus are two different people, it definitely is not the Bibles fault. This is what is called a NO-BRAINER.
All you have to do is obey God, Himself!! Notice Mark 9:7, which says: THIS IS MY SON, LISTEN TO HIM!!
SO, what does Jesus say on the subject?
Consider John 14:28. Here Jesus says that the Father is greater than I am. ECCE SIGNUM!!
Notice John 20:17. Jesus says that the Father is his Father and his God. Proof Positive.
Consider Col 1:15 and Rev 3:14. Both say that Jesus is the first of God's creations.
Look up Daniel 7:13,14 and Rev 5:6-8. Here we have God sitting on His throne and Jesus come in before God on His throne. Definitely cannot be the same person.
Consider Matt 20:23. Here Jesus says that he does not own everything, but the Father controles some things.
Consider Matt 24:36. Jesus says that no one knows the day or the hour, not even the son, but only the Father. Is it possible to be the same person and you do not know everything you know??? Remember, the Bible says that God is PERFECT in knowledge, Job 36:4, 37:17. If Jesus and God were the same person would they not both be perfect in knowledge???
Consider Heb 2:10 and 5:7-9. Here Jesus is made perfect through sufferings, for the job God wanted him to do. Is not the true God perfect in every way???
Consider Phil 2:9. Here Jesus is resurrected to a superior position, because of giving his life as a ransom sacrifice. Since God is supreme how could he be raised to a superior position???
Why would God lie several times?? He said that Jesus is His son, as God spoke from heaven to his son, who was on earth, Matt 3:17, Mark 9:7, John 12:28-30. God hates liers, Ps 5:6, Prov 6:16,17.
Consider Matt 16:13-17. When Jesus asked Peter who the people were saying that he was, Peter said that he was the SON OF THE LIVING GOD. Then Jesus said that his Father in heaven had revealed that to Peter. WHO IS IT THAT HAS THE NERVE TO CALL GOD AND JESUS LIERS????

 

[logician]

A lot of "people" have claimed to be gods over the ages. who is correct?

Maybe none of them.

The claim that there are no "true" gods in a thread about who is the TRUE god certainly isn't irrelevant, it fact, it is intuitively obvious.

 

[gnostic]

Homer Simpson!

D'oh!

The son is Bart.

And the Holy "Spirit" is a "liquor" from Moe's Tavern.

 

[jtartar]

Is it 3 Gods, God-the-Father, God-the-Son, and God-the-Ghost?

Did Jesus HAVE a God?

theMadJW,
The God Jesus was referring to at John 17:3, is the God that inspired forty writers to write the Holy Scriptures. We are told His name at Ex 6:3, Ps 83:18, Isa 12:2, 26:4, in the King James Bible.
The Almighty God's personal name or proper name is Jehovah. Every place the titles LORD and GOD, in all capital letters, are found, the original Hebrew Scriptures said YHWH. The usual and longest English pronunciation of this NAME, called THE TETRAGRAMATON, is JEHOVAH. God's personal name was in the original scriptures over 7,000 times. Many English translators have substituted the TITLES Lord of God for The Sacred Name of God.
If God inspired writers to put His name in His book over 7,000 times, He must have meant for the people to use His name every day.
What do you think is the destiny for unrepentent men who removed the Sacred name of God from His own Bible??? PERSONALLY, I would not want to be in their shoes.
Notice in John, chapter 17, Jesus said that he had made God's name know, verse 6& 26.Jesus called this same God, his God and his Father, John 20:17, Rev 3:12-four times.
Jesus also said that the Father is greater than he is, John 14:28, that the Father knows things that he does not know, Matt 24:36, and that some things the Father alone controls Matt 20:23.
Jesus spoke about his Father being in heaven while he was on earth, Matt 7:21, 16:16.
God spoke to His son while His son was on earth, three different times, Matt 3:17, Mark 9:7, John 12:28.
Who was the one that Jesus prayed to on the night before his death??? Matt 26:39-42, Heb 5:7=10.

 

[lockyfan]

Pretty clear... Jesus accepts being called God by Thomas...

Quote the scripture number as well please

Is it 3 Gods in 1?
God-the-Father, God-the-Son, and God-the-Ghost?

Did Jesus HAVE a God?

Yes his father JEHOVAH

Luke 4:8 In reply Jesus said to him: “It is written, ‘It is Jehovah your God you must worship, and it is to him alone you must render sacred service.


For there has been a child born to us, there has been a son given to us; and the princely rule will come to be upon his shoulder. And his name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace. To the abundance of the princely rule and to peace there will be no end, upon the throne of David and upon his kingdom in order to establish it firmly and to sustain it by means of justice and by means of righteousness, from now on and to time indefinite. The very zeal of Jehovah of armies will do this. Isaiah 9:6-7

he is a Mighty God not almighty God

Just as satan is called the "god of this system of things" (2 Cor 4:4) Jesus is a god as well in the fact that God is not a name, but a position, like that of being a Ruler or King

2 Cor 4:3-4
If, now, the good news we declare is in fact veiled, it is veiled among those who are perishing, among whom the god of this system of things has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, that the illumination of the glorious good news about the Christ, who is the image of God, might not shine through

Luke 4:5-8
So he brought him up and showed him all the kingdoms of the inhabited earth in an instant of time; and the Devil said to him: “I will give you all this authority and the glory of them, because it has been delivered to me, and to whomever I wish I give it. You, therefore, if you do an act of worship before me, it will all be yours.” In reply Jesus said to him: “It is written, ‘It is Jehovah your God you must worship, and it is to him alone you must render sacred service

 

[aymen amir]

the only divine book which has not been changed is the HOLY "QURAN" it is the words of GOD ALMIGHTY

 

[roddio]

Back up?
The Dogma is NOT in the scriptures.
When Constantine started the 'Universal' (Catholic) Church , the Trinity Dogma was formulated and made 'official'.

Simple Facts

disagree. its in scripture but are you willing to believe it? God bless

 

[jtartar]

I think you're partly right about Jesus not conceiving of himself as God, if by that we mean Jesus thought "Oh yes, I'm the second person of an as-yet-unheard-of trinity with all the divine rights, powers, and privileges of deity." Folks like that get locked up, and rightly so. But Jesus DID think of himself as God in other senses. He thought it was his right to do what only God could do, for example forgive sins and execute judgment. He taught "as one with authority, and not as the scribes." Whatever else that means, it means he thought his own interpretation of scripture was decisive, and he felt no need to justify his interpretation by appeal to other interpreters. These (among other things) point to Jesus' self-understanding as including himself in the divine in a way unique among Jews. I agree that he probably wouldn't have parsed this out in a trinitarian way, but that doesn't mean the trinitarian formulation is untrue.

And given all the other ways in which Jesus was ascribed deity or ascribed it to himself, the citation from Mark. 10:18 and Luke 18:19 is a pretty weak refutation. After all, Jesus may well have said it in order to test his listener. He was waiting for a response such as "Well, I call you good because you are God" as a response. We'll just never know, I suppose, but it seems that the tradition of Jesus' deity is quite early and precedes the compilation of the NT. The best explanation for that is that Jesus did and said things only God should have been doing and saying; that is, the scriptural portrait is more or less accurate.

Duenmeister,
There seem to be a few things that you are overlooking about Jesus. Remember that Jesus said several times that all authority had been GIVEN him, Matt 28:18, John 5:26. Who do you believe gave Jesus this authority?? The Almighty God, whose Personal name is Jehovah, Ex 6:3, Ps 83:18. Jesus said that he had made God's name known, and that Jehovah is the only true God, John 17:3,6,26.
The Bible tells us that God resurrected Jesus from the dead, and actually raised him to a superior place in heaven, Acts 2:24,32,33, 3:15,26. Notice that these scriptures also speak of Jesus as being God's SERVANT. Eph 1:20, Heb 12:2, Phil 2:8-11. Notice that Stephen, in a Beatific Vision, actually saw Jesus standing at God's right hand. Jesus was standing at the right hand of GOD, as many other scriptures attest to.
When on earth God who, was in heaven, spoke to Jesus, three times, Matt 3:17, Mark 9:7, John 12:28. Jesus even said that the Father was in heaven at the same time that he was on earth, Matt 7:21, 16:13-17. Notice that these scriptures also say that Jesus is the SON of GOD, as do many others. The fact is: if a person does not recognize Jesus as the SON of GOD, he has no chance at life, John 20: 30,31.
The Bible is so clear about this truth that it is stated that a person who does not believe that Jesus is the SON of God is actually calling God Himself a lier, 1John 5:9-12. This is because God stepped in with powerful mirscles an digns and portents to bear witness to Jesus as HIS SON, Acts 2:22, Heb 2:3,4.
There is only one name that has been given to men by which they MUST get saved, Acts 4:10-12.
Other scriptures also tell that Jesus said that the God of heaven was his God and our GOD, Jesus Father and our Father, John 20:17, that THE Father is greater than Jesus, John 14:28, that Jesus LIVES because of the Father, John 6:57, that the Father knows things that Jesus does not, Matt 24:36.

 

[AK4]

Duenmeister,
There seem to be a few things that you are overlooking about Jesus. Remember that Jesus said several times that all authority had been GIVEN him, Matt 28:18, John 5:26. Who do you believe gave Jesus this authority?? The Almighty God, whose Personal name is Jehovah, Ex 6:3, Ps 83:18. Jesus said that he had made God's name known, and that Jehovah is the only true God, John 17:3,6,26.
The Bible tells us that God resurrected Jesus from the dead, and actually raised him to a superior place in heaven, Acts 2:24,32,33, 3:15,26. Notice that these scriptures also speak of Jesus as being God's SERVANT. Eph 1:20, Heb 12:2, Phil 2:8-11. Notice that Stephen, in a Beatific Vision, actually saw Jesus standing at God's right hand. Jesus was standing at the right hand of GOD, as many other scriptures attest to.
When on earth God who, was in heaven, spoke to Jesus, three times, Matt 3:17, Mark 9:7, John 12:28. Jesus even said that the Father was in heaven at the same time that he was on earth, Matt 7:21, 16:13-17. Notice that these scriptures also say that Jesus is the SON of GOD, as do many others. The fact is: if a person does not recognize Jesus as the SON of GOD, he has no chance at life, John 20: 30,31.
The Bible is so clear about this truth that it is stated that a person who does not believe that Jesus is the SON of God is actually calling God Himself a lier, 1John 5:9-12. This is because God stepped in with powerful mirscles an digns and portents to bear witness to Jesus as HIS SON, Acts 2:22, Heb 2:3,4.
There is only one name that has been given to men by which they MUST get saved, Acts 4:10-12.
Other scriptures also tell that Jesus said that the God of heaven was his God and our GOD, Jesus Father and our Father, John 20:17, that THE Father is greater than Jesus, John 14:28, that Jesus LIVES because of the Father, John 6:57, that the Father knows things that Jesus does not, Matt 24:36.

Hey i good job in noticing that Jesus and the Father are not the same "entity". God has blessed you with this. The only problem i see is you think Jehovah is God the Father. This is not so. The Lord/Jehovah is Jesus, not God the Father. Jesus is the God of the OT and NT.

Here is why all should know that Jesus is Jehovah and that Jehovah is not God the Father

John 1:18 - No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son[the greek here is theos and it means God], which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.

5:37 - And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape

And all the many verses like it should help you out here.

 

[lockyfan]

disagree. its in scripture but are you willing to believe it? God bless

Where?

use scriptures to prove your point. especially to Jehovahs Witnesses.

 

[sojourner]

Duenmeister,
There seem to be a few things that you are overlooking about Jesus. Remember that Jesus said several times that all authority had been GIVEN him, Matt 28:18, John 5:26. Who do you believe gave Jesus this authority?? The Almighty God, whose Personal name is Jehovah, Ex 6:3, Ps 83:18. Jesus said that he had made God's name known, and that Jehovah is the only true God, John 17:3,6,26.
The Bible tells us that God resurrected Jesus from the dead, and actually raised him to a superior place in heaven, Acts 2:24,32,33, 3:15,26. Notice that these scriptures also speak of Jesus as being God's SERVANT. Eph 1:20, Heb 12:2, Phil 2:8-11. Notice that Stephen, in a Beatific Vision, actually saw Jesus standing at God's right hand. Jesus was standing at the right hand of GOD, as many other scriptures attest to.
When on earth God who, was in heaven, spoke to Jesus, three times, Matt 3:17, Mark 9:7, John 12:28. Jesus even said that the Father was in heaven at the same time that he was on earth, Matt 7:21, 16:13-17. Notice that these scriptures also say that Jesus is the SON of GOD, as do many others. The fact is: if a person does not recognize Jesus as the SON of GOD, he has no chance at life, John 20: 30,31.
The Bible is so clear about this truth that it is stated that a person who does not believe that Jesus is the SON of God is actually calling God Himself a lier, 1John 5:9-12. This is because God stepped in with powerful mirscles an digns and portents to bear witness to Jesus as HIS SON, Acts 2:22, Heb 2:3,4.
There is only one name that has been given to men by which they MUST get saved, Acts 4:10-12.
Other scriptures also tell that Jesus said that the God of heaven was his God and our GOD, Jesus Father and our Father, John 20:17, that THE Father is greater than Jesus, John 14:28, that Jesus LIVES because of the Father, John 6:57, that the Father knows things that Jesus does not, Matt 24:36.

None of that refutes Trinitarian thought.

 

[sojourner]

Where?

use scriptures to prove your point. especially to Jehovahs Witnesses.

why "especially to Jehovah's Witnesses?"