Who Was Baha’u’llah, and How Can We Evaluate His Claims?

[CG Didymus]

We don't have to examine them all. We only have to find one that is wrong. That has already been done.

Yes, there's not one that I don't have doubts about. One of the best is that Revelation says he will come with a new name. But everything else in Revelation makes it sound like Jesus, so even that one is questionable. One of the weakest to me is the one about the "Three Woes" in Revelation being Muhammad, the Bab and Baha'u'llah. Fo me, that's a mighty big stretch to make the context support that.

 

[CG Didymus]

You quote the socalled divine books of other religions and in the same breath, you say that they are corrupted. Is that not a contradiction.

All so called divine books were created by men, edited, added, substracted, all through the ages. Why should we put our faith in them. Shoghi was selling his family snake oil.

That's true. Any Scripture that contradicts Baha'i beliefs is for one reason or another not reliable. But a prophesy that says something that can be made to point to the Bab or Baha'u'llah, that they take as true? But still, what is very strange is how many prophecies point to the Bab and 1844. But he's not the main prophet.

Actually, even with prophecies, they switch things around to make them work... Like with the prophecies about Kalki and Maitreya. I wouldn't be surprised if there's anything else that they use from those Scriptures where they find those prophecies. And they do the same with the Bible. They find a verse or two they can use and ignore the context.

 

[CG Didymus]

I personally look for the light in all those holy books, as I am asked to do. Interestingly when one does, the same light of Love and Unity is found.

I would politly suggest that if anyone thinks they have an exclusive scripture and exclusive God/s, that one should look at other scriptures the same way they study theirs.

What do you think of the Bible verses that get into the conquest of Canaan? You know, God ordering the Israelites to kill all the living things, including woman and children in some of the cities.

 

[CG Didymus]

I repeat the question, as any discussion about God, depends upon the answer to that question.

Do you believe in God?

Regards Tony

I've believed in three different versions of God... a New-Age God, a Fundamental Christian God and the Baha'i version of God. As I've said before, as long as I was believing, they all worked for me. I felt the love. The power and spirit of that God. But then, as soon as I learned something new that gave me a reason to doubt that God, things stopped working. My conclusion is that it didn't matter what I believed about God as long as I truly believed it. But they were all different, so at least two of them have got to have been false and maybe all three.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

What do you think of the Bible verses that get into the conquest of Canaan? You know, God ordering the Israelites to kill all the living things, including woman and children in some of the cities.

I see their rejection is that death, their rejection is foretold. This is also another way to see what is prophecy.

So the rejection of the parents was installed into their children, they repeated that rejection. God already knew their response, and as such, pre issues the warning clearly to those that take the path of the Spirit instead.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

I've believed in three different versions of God... a New-Age God, a Fundamental Christian God and the Baha'i version of God. As I've said before, as long as I was believing, they all worked for me. I felt the love. The power and spirit of that God. But then, as soon as I learned something new that gave me a reason to doubt that God, things stopped working. My conclusion is that it didn't matter what I believed about God as long as I truly believed it. But they were all different, so at least two of them have got to have been false and maybe all three.

What I see you saying CG, is that you have embraced 3 concepts of God and are yet to reconcile the differences that we tend to make with those concepts.

Regards Tony

 

[rational experiences]

Every human exists first.

To think. Tell human beliefs. Theory. Stories. Just humans.

If you quote in human species all humans equal are a human.

No need to idolise. Exact.

A man human says I am a gods descendant. As the baby man himself.

Isn't every human living today born a baby human?

Yes.

Exact. The same. Equal position no argument. Biology exact.

No argument.

Your theme why I argue is about my father.

The first human being man. An adult man first in memory not yet a father.

Isn't a man baby. Man adult.

As theme a baby man thinking about my living father.

As an adult man are you father the living adult human man.

Owning consciously a changed position from his personal first fixed man status? Adult man.

Yes. Only as living human biology.

Isn't and doesn't memory human a baby adult advise you he died?

Yes.

In fact don't you irrationally claim you came back consciously just by theorising from his dead body? Memory the recordings.

As you can't make thesis as a baby your owned actual natural man's history. Personal memory.

Consciousness.

Hence theory involves using human memories had lied? As the adult not bio the first man adult father.

You should be enabled to claim yes. Only if you don't self idolise another human.

Now if you claim as father by biology he is deceased. Gods heavens owns a state to record human life by image and voice.

So memory today about father he is with God. Recorded. Biology however dead.

Now humans lost half atmospheric use water oxygen as it was taken from the life biology to cool unnatural hot machine used transmitters.

When the atmosphere cools. We get it given back. It comes back by image.

You own bio life by sex. Your bio life can heal by getting back what we had lost from natural biology. By cooling.

Yet biology has to be biology first and living to gain it. As the human.

No biology living that recording can't merge into anything.

Ask why only a small human population ever owned the effect?

As sex owns the population mass.

Which proves why it's only an old humans science cause.

As water does not first relate with most of the population who remain sick and dying.

Evidence. You live it to know.

Now if you say I believe that father was formed by a God. It's just a belief not fact.

A scientific theists as a human says fact is physical evidence only.

As mass is position zero space frozen held. Numbers...as science came out of mass. Thesis how to convert mass as and by a biological human.

The advice is exact all chosen in physical presence the biological human.

Also owning no argument.

So humans proved already no theist human thinker owned any fact about how a God created their human man father. Cannot lie about it as it was legally taught no man is God.

Legal. As human theists are dangerous. The exact reason.

 

[Aupmanyav]

.. when there is no logical reason ..

Laws change because of society and times. They do not depend on intervention of any imaginary God or falsely acclaimed prohet, son, messenger, manifestation or mahdi.

It is proof of free will.

Nice, you have proved free will. Now prove the existence of your God and that he chose this uneducated 19th Century Iranian to convey his message.

 

[Aupmanyav]

I see their rejection is that death, their rejection is foretold. This is also another way to see what is prophecy.
So the rejection of the parents was installed into their children, they repeated that rejection. God already knew their response, and as such, pre issues the warning clearly to those that take the path of the Spirit instead.

Is that your loving God.
He takes for granted that the children even after growing up, studying and experiencing life will turn out to be exactly the same as their parents and even before they had the chance to grow up. Were your parents exactly like you. Then, in that case, why did he caused them to be born. I chose differently from my grandpa and pa who were theists. God had given them free will, they could have chosen otherwise. By killing them, God did not allow them to use their free will. That is a travesty of a promise.

 

[rational experiences]

The human legal position was the understanding human life got sacrificed. As just men changed cold earth gases in mass that are equal above.

Burnt them up in reactions. So it did above also..causes.

Reason a gas came out of volcanic mass first. Not cold rock. Theism direct to earths Rock mass lying.

Two theists minds exist.

The men who identify with human machine causes historic. Image voice recording human losses.

As new human built designed machines now use it. They knew.

Proving beyond doubt human men with machines had caused it before.

To a brother.

In living biology his closest theism. An ape or monkey living is not a human. Yet is close enough human proof DNA biology in living biology advices that no human is part machine.

We would be less living biology. Not part machine.

As humans theorising bases of machines in earth mass itself is from God eArths substances.

Saying that biology owns the same reactive advice as his built machine.

Is why the argument was consciously placated before.

Via Thoth numbers and baboon biology. God reasons. To state no man is God.

As the sacrificed of humans living biology involved the sacrifice of animals biology also. Not just human sacrifice. All life attacked plus new sin holes in mass.

Machines total removal reactive evidence. Attack.

Life taken aboard the UFO orbital cloud ark image was by cause effect....mass God earth ground reaction.

Pressure changes gas heating falling burning...water evaporation.... ice melting. That took bio lifes water oxygen away from Living. To cool save life in an unnatural flooding of causes.

Teaching what human sciences of God had caused.

Machines own direct flooding causes only. As ice kept water cool. As ice kept gas cooled.

Already.

So a machine theist a human first is advised naturally first. Human was already told he was using lifes saviour to produce a machine from melt and to own cause a nuclear reaction.

Their mind already agreed with the advice. Advised.

They then tried to use the advice for another new machine and reaction and only wanted it controlled by humans.

The string's of human science. From earth direct to their machine. From earth direct to mans controlled reaction. Leftovers in science of man is direct to science evaluations as nuclear waste only as a theist.

As only humans theory as science the state.

You can't pretend you begin at God body dust again by a new machine human controlled theism. As the power plant begins again at the dust position.

How a human theories completely naturally human advised first that nuclear science knowingly caused bio lifes sacrifice. Already knew.

So when you do a bahuallah review a human was bio body and conscious mind changed. Exactly told.

No human life should be changed as an equal human in an equal balanced heavens the teaching.

Gods own.

So some humans aren't anywhere near as sacrificed biologically as another human in another country.

Proven by russias hit.

One brother hence doesn't rationally speak on behalf of another's national DNA brother.

 

[CG Didymus]

What I see you saying CG, is that you have embraced 3 concepts of God and are yet to reconcile the differences that we tend to make with those concepts.

Regards Tony

I was believing in them one at a time. The New Age type of belief was first. God was within. God was in the trees and in the mountains. I could become one with that higher power and connect to spiritual things that Baha'is believe only manifestations of God could do. I friend believed she was a higher spiritual being from Venus that had reincarnated back into a human to help usher in the Age of Aquarius here on Earth. Then I met Baha'is. That God had sent several manifestations to people at different times and in different places. But this God also was into having lots of laws and moral codes, something the New Age God didn't worry about. Then came the Fundamental Christian God. This was during the "Jesus Movement" of the 70"s. That God was made up of God, The Father, God, The Son, and God, The Holy Spirit. This God was a jealous God that hated it when people worshipped false Gods... And every other religion, except Judaism, believed in a false God. And even the Jews didn't have it right, because, to those Christians, they believed in the Father, but rejected the Son.

Each negated the previous one. Then finally, I began to doubt and question that Christian version of God. Ironically, some of the reasons I reject that Trinitarian God are the same reasons Baha'is reject that version of God. But then Baha'is also reject the Hindu Gods, the Greek Gods and the Aztec Gods, and the Egyptian Gods. So, Baha'is aren't as all-inclusive to all the other religions as they claim to be. They too reject the Gods of some people and cultures.

And why is that? Probably the same reason why I do... They were made up by those people in that culture. They're not real. But... they were believed to be real by those people. Just like good, loving, humble people today go to their Churches and worship the Father, the Son and Holy Spirit as God. But you and I believe they are wrong and believe that is a false God. But I include the Baha'is concept of God on the list of beliefs about God that I disagree with.

 

[rational experiences]

As biology we aren't planet earth.

We stand on earth living inside a heavens only.

So human claims as the human I own life inside the heavens spirit only.

Not earth as mass. I stand on top of earths body.

A human my equal says I want to think not for my life survival but as a human only Inferred thesis. Calculus also. My human words. All said applied by a human by I want.

You aren't any God.

You're just a human meant to live naturally.

What personal rights do you assert that gives you the reason to not just live naturally?

Self idolisation. I'm better than you in thinking. Conscious use.

Rational advice says you are a worse thinker.

As you use mass advice and not self human advice.

You use God against us.

So just a human says. I believe when earth base chemicals changed bio life began.

Okay what was happening above?

Sun mass falling burning gases was changing the earths mass.

As a human do you include that advice as the exact thesis? Reason ground chemicals changed.

No.

Why?
I already owned a pre human want. And it was about earth mass and machines only.

Why you are Very dangerous human. The advice is dangerous only and advised adds to the powerful thoughts you wield.

Human theist.
Self idolisation thinking using consciousness.
Egotism..power monger.

Legal said no man is God.

You can only ever be a human.

As human thoughts don't exist before yourself.

Your coercion said God told you. Yet you already existed.

If you ask who was the God type it's a man he him his thinking ownerships.

By a ship theme I own I give owner the man human claim to ship...wandering thoughts as man only theisms.

Hence I also said many God types bodies told me also.

Is really named as the human man in two discussions in mind by word naming theism.

Human he already gave his word to his type. Hu and man. By his words.

So he said man man twice proven in theism said adam adam.

The testimonial of men said a man brother had theoried as a man human about God. Brothers human had agreed.

 

[rational experiences]

Pretty basic human thinking advices.

I look at dust is mass as the human. I observe. I see it's exact.

Exactly informed to be living the dust is the dust.

If I stand on the ground where just dust exists. If I reacted that dust on the ground Id be dead destroyed.

Exact advice.

Consciousness a truthful seen theory.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Is that your loving God.
He takes for granted that the children even after growing up, studying and experiencing life will turn out to be exactly the same as their parents and even before they had the chance to grow up. Were your parents exactly like you. Then, in that case, why did he caused them to be born. I chose differently from my grandpa and pa who were theists. God had given them free will, they could have chosen otherwise. By killing them, God did not allow them to use their free will. That is a travesty of a promise.

No, not God, I see that is an immature humanity. We need to grow up and find peace and unity, admit to our mistakes and learn from them.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

I was believing in them one at a time. The New Age type of belief was first. God was within. God was in the trees and in the mountains. I could become one with that higher power and connect to spiritual things that Baha'is believe only manifestations of God could do.

I see that is the connection to the Manifestations of God, Who are all we can know of God, so the path was well worth pursuing.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

I friend believed she was a higher spiritual being from Venus that had reincarnated back into a human to help usher in the Age of Aquarius here on Earth

I see it is a mistake we make, when we let out own desires and thoughts dominate over the clear guidelines God has given

Regards Tony

 

[Truthseeker]

I have. I can't read your mind.

I'm asking to think about it for yourself. What do you care what I think?

 

[Truthseeker]

It's just that some Baha'is make it sound like Baha'u'llah received perfect knowledge about anything he needed directly from God.

I believe that Baha'u'llah received the above information from God, but He expressed it as if it was from a scholar because He hadn't made the declaration that he was He Whom God Shall Make Manifest.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Their 'learning' was not the reason the Pharisees rejected Christ.

I agree. Christ said only the pure in heart shall see God so if one is not pure in heart, their learning will avail them not in drawing closer to God. So it’s always possible if we are not pure hearted to wrongfully use our knowledge to condemn a Prophet or Messenger from God.

 

[samtonga43]

Most atheists I have posted to think that religions would be the same if there was a God because God would not reveal contradictory messages... For example:

KWED said: ↑
In which case, why have there been so many contradictory and conflicting messages?
Why would god deliberately confuse the issue that way and make it look as though he was just made-up in the image of the culture of his creators?

All I can say is that I know of no atheists who expect all the religions to be the same. (When I say 'know' I mean know in real life).