Who's more racist... the religious or the non-religious?

[Gharib]

Yes, there is much to worry about. It is obvious that you haven't read Darwins works but still feel compelled to fabricate the most ridiculous conclusions so far removed from reality, decency, honesty and integrity, and then have the gall to top it all off by saying...

OK.

Stupid character thing

 

[beerisit]

Yes, there is much to worry about. It is obvious that you haven't read Darwins works but still feel compelled to fabricate the most ridiculous conclusions so far removed from reality, decency, honesty and integrity, and then have the gall to top it all off by saying...

Quote:
A Muslim has a better status in the sight of Allah than a non-Muslim

But you see mate, that isn't racist. It is probably bigoted, but not racist.

 

[Gharib]

Quote:
A Muslim has a better status in the sight of Allah than a non-Muslim

But you see mate, that isn't racist. It is probably bigoted, but not racist.

Hahahah.

 

[beerisit]

Hahahah.

What eselam don't you believe what Allah believes?

 

[Gharib]

What eselam don't you believe what Allah believes?

Where did you get that idea? BTW they need to get me a better facepalm smiley. This one is too old.

 

[1robin]

You're not providing any sourced quotes.
Do I smell a straw man?

Quotes for what, my statement about what non-theistic evolutionists say? Surely this is not reference to no Hitler quotes. I usually don't automatically supply Quotes unless asked. I am just too lazy. Tell what me specifically you want and I will supply them.

I don't know who your "famous atheist" is, but I advise to not believe everything you hear.
Science is all about describing & understanding how the natural world works.
It is not a fault that it provides no moral guidance....that's not it's job.

I am really baffled by your unwillingness to look outside the biological application and see "Well what does all this mean?" I never suggested it's implications have anything to do with it's truth, and an abstract concept isn't guilty or innocent in the classic sence.

Clearly, you want us to all have inerrant truth about right & wrong....& religion provides that for you.

Well not quite. I am mainly saying that anti-theistic evolution eliminates God, who is the only potential source for objective values and most meaningful moral claims. It does not posses in itself any rational way to establish evil, good, sanctity of life, accountability, and meaning. Many evolutionists are strict determinists. If we went with their ideas how could anyone be accountable for his actions. The moral standards we require to have civil law require what evolution does not have but Christianity does. It is the only frame of reference to justify what society by and large inherently needs. Morality outside of God is chaotic and subjective and there is no justification for over all standards or a way to settle disputes. Everyones opinion (even Hitler's) is just as valuable and legitamite as anyone elses. Since God isn't everything goes.

But I see that religions cannot agree even on that, so they also fail to provide your desired absolute inerrant truth

Because this is a fallen world and will many will always deny God then there is now way that the world would agree to adopt Christianity or anything else as an ultimate standard. I am not discussing a world government. I am taliking about an individuals decision to believe and live by faith in the biblical God. Since I have faith then I have a justification for considering Hitler wrong and evil. My system provides a duty or a way the world aught to be (an objective absolute standard). Your system provides no [aught to be or duty (to who) ] or objective standard or even a way to justify right and wrong. All yours produces is 6 billion opinions and no way to value one over the other. Our constitution assumes God to be the ultimate standard and so has produced the most just (but not perfect) nation in history. Read Jefferson's explanation of the source of our rights. Even though secularists have led this country away from God, it's roots in Christianity were so deep that it still provides a justification for individual dignity that people from countries that don't have our roots (instead they have their roots derived from power struggles consistent with atheistic evolution) will risk death to come here.

He had his own version of Xianity. And that is the problem with religion, ie, it's dogma may be bent to justify whatever the individual wants.
So Hitler altered it to suit. You say he got it wrong, & he would've said you get it wrong. Some say terrorism is wrong, while others see it as
God's will. Where's the absolute truth in this?

God has stated that his will is alwsays consistent with his revelation. If the bible says do not murder and Hitler murders and claim it is the name of God we can rationaly declare him incorrect because we have an objective standard to justify our decision. It doesn't matter if someone claims they are doing it in the name of God, it can easily be compared to the absolute standard and decided on justly. I am sure there would be some grey areas but infinately less than evomution which has justified stansard.

That's a pretty tortured argument that Hitler was inspired by Darwin & evolution.
Hitler was much more specific about God (Gott) being on his side.
Yet I don't blame his religion for his evil.....I blame Hitler for his evil.

You can blame Hitler only if there is an objective standard to compare him to. In evolution there is not and so you are appealing to a Godly standard to justify your claims even though you seem to think one is not needed. I don't know how to provide a more applicable selection of quotes than this. It is as obvious as it can be. Sometimes rational intelligent people seem to loose their ability to rationally evaluate something to a degree that suggests to me either a bias or a spiritual blindness. There is no other reason I can think of to be dissatasfied with the post I made with his quotes.

John 12:39-40 Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again, He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.
2 Corinthians 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Bible Topics: Unbelief

 

[A Troubled Man]

In Australia and New Zealand the most racist people, even though a multicultural society, are the white people.

I don't mean all white people, only the majority of those who are the descendants of the English invaders.

Considering, you haven't provided any evidence or citations to support your claim, I can only conclude that your claim was meant to promote racism.

 

[Gharib]

Considering, you haven't provided any evidence or citations to support your claim, I can only conclude that your claim was meant to promote racism.

WOW! Stunning!

What better way to answer you than with your own words.

 

[beerisit]

So you don't think that killing innocents is an evil work,which means in other words an awful deed,please clarify.

trruth, do you believe that the practice of homosexuals is evil? In other words an awful deed? And if you do how do you place it in relation to the bombing of Hiroshima?

 

[A Troubled Man]

What better way to answer you than with your own words.

In other words, you cant back up your claim that the majority of descendants of the English invaders to Australia are racist? Further to that, you can't refute the fact that your statement only serves to promote racism?

 

[Gharib]

In other words, you cant back up your claim that the majority of descendants of the English invaders to Australia are racist? Further to that, you can't refute the fact that your statement only serves to promote racism?

What can I say, my time is precious, I don't like wasting it. :beach:

 

[beerisit]

What can I say, my time is precious, I don't like wasting it. :beach:

Perhaps you missed my post regarding bigotry?

 

[FearGod]

trruth, do you believe that the practice of homosexuals is evil? In other words an awful deed? And if you do how do you place it in relation to the bombing of Hiroshima?

In short, we need to recognize that HIV/AIDS is largely a male homosexual disease in the U.S., and it is highly preventable.
Here are some facts to consider:
1. Over 1 million people now have HIV in the U.S.(a)
2. Almost half of HIV cases (just under 500,000) are known to involve male homosexual behavior.(b) This is a highly conservative figure. Male- to- male sex is a contributing factor in other transmission categories as the Centers for Disease Control defines them. A more realistic actual figure is around 60-70%.
An estimated 300,000 males in the U.S. have died of AIDS as a result of male homosexual sex.(c)
3. In 2006, 53% of new HIV cases were attributed to MSM (males who have sex with males). Another 4% falls into the category of MSM plus IDU (injection drug use).(d) And many of the cases in the category of “high risk heterosexual” (31%) originate with the homosexual behavior of the partners of the heterosexuals who contract HIV. There are also cases classified as “unknown” in origin, and many of these are likely to involve MSM.
4. In certain states, the percentage relating to male homosexual sex is much higher:
• In California, at least 67% of HIV/AIDS cases are directly linked to male homosexual behavior, with another 9% involving the combined risks of MSM and IDU.(e)
• In Oregon, 66% of AIDS cases are attributable to male-to-male sex, with another 10% involving the combined risk factors of MSM and IDU.(f)
• In Ohio, 58% of AIDS cases are caused by male homosexual behavior, with another 6% transmitted through MSM and IDU.(g)
5. The number of cases involving men who have sex with men is increasing while other transmission categories remain stable or are declining.(h) Safe sex is not working. Homosexual men know about condoms, but they often don’t use them.

6. Between 2001 and 2006, HIV among teen and young adult males who have sex with males rose over 12 % per year. Let’s repeat that—in the age group 13 to 24 years of age, HIV rose over 12% per year for six years.(i) Teen boys encouraged to enter the ‘gay’ lifestyle, are being enabled to enter a world of danger. Affirming homosexual behavior in schools should be viewed in this light.
7. California, where a faction wants to legalize homosexual relationships as “marriage,” has experienced 69,000 HIV/AIDS deaths due to males who have sex with other males since the beginning of the epidemic. Allow us to repeat this number: 69,000 dead due to male homosexual sex in California alone.(j)
8. In California, nearly 62,000 people are now living with HIV or AIDS.(k) Applying the current trend that at least two-thirds of these cases result from MSM, that means approximately 41,000 infected males who have sex with males might be eligible to legitimize this epidemic through “marriage” if the California Supreme Court rules against the voters’ decision on Proposition 8.
9. We are spending $3 billion federal dollars annually in the U.S. on a disease that is largely preventable.(l)

10. As of the end of 2006, approximately 566,000 deaths have occurred among people with AIDS, including 14,627 in 2006.(m)

11. The lifetime medical cost for an HIV patient is around $600,000.(n)

12. The top five deadliest states to live in regarding AIDS are the District of Columbia, New York, Maryland, Florida, and Connecticut.(o)
conclusion: Does America benefit from male homosexual behavior? No. Along with unmarried heterosexual behavior,male homosexuality should be discouraged as much as possible to responsibly address the HIV/AIDS epidemic.

Reference : Mission:America - Homosexuality / Bisexuality

So may i ask you now what do you think of the homosexual.

 

[beerisit]

trruth, do you believe that the practice of homosexuals is evil? In other words an awful deed? And if you do how do you place it in relation to the bombing of Hiroshima?

I asked first? How about you answer, without all the obfuscation?
I want to know whether you think it is evil and if you do how evil compared to the bombing of Hiroshima. I don't care whether it causes disease, the discovery of the New World did that. It didn't make it evil, other things did, but disease wasn't one.

 

[FearGod]

I asked first? How about you answer, without all the obfuscation?

hah,you're realy very weak,actualy my answer is very clear by showing you all the trajedy caused
by homosexual behaviour of death and loses to USA alone not mentioning reports from other countries.

And you are asking me what is my opinion.:areyoucra

Now tell me your opinion,that is awful deed or good deed

 

[Revoltingest]

conclusion: Does America benefit from male homosexual behavior? No. Along with unmarried heterosexual behavior,male homosexuality should be discouraged as much as possible to responsibly address the HIV/AIDS epidemic.
Reference : Mission:America - Homosexuality / Bisexuality
So may i ask you now what do you think of the homosexual.

I think of the homosexual the way I think of the football player.
Each engages in activity which he enjoys, but has some risks.
We cannot ban all things which people will do, just because the alternative is cheaper.
And yes, football players could switch to a different game, but that option is available to homos.
Suppose that research showed conclusively that faith saves money compared to atheism.
I could not choose to adopt faith, even for glorious money. Tis in my nature to be who I am.
So, as much as practical, we must learn to tolerate people who differ from us.
What do I think of homos? The same that I think of all people, ie, I judge them as individuals.

 

[1robin]

I asked first? How about you answer, without all the obfuscation?
I want to know whether you think it is evil and if you do how evil compared to the bombing of Hiroshima. I don't care whether it causes disease, the discovery of the New World did that. It didn't make it evil, other things did, but disease wasn't one.

I will offer an opinion. I believe homosexuality is wrong. The bible claims sexual sins are especially wrong. That being said I am not to subject a homosexual to judgement with the exception of things like a vote on same sex marriage, or child custody. That is a judgment of a concept not an individual person. The actions contained in the old testament were only for the Jews and for that time. They do not apply today. Today we are supposed to love the sinner but hate the sin. Christ spoke more kindly to sinners and more harshly about sin than anyone in history.
As for the comparison to Hiroshima (how you came up with that is beyond me) there is none. Hiroshima happened because the Japanese were so psychotic they believed their emporer was a God and surrender dishonorable. They would have and did fight to the death. Our estimates of a conventional attack were our 500,000 casualties plus maybe a million or more for the Japanese. The bombs caused laround 200,000 casualties none our own. This is as close to a justified act as can be found in this broken fallen world. Your comparison is strange.

 

[beerisit]

10. As of the end of 2006, approximately 566,000 deaths have occurred among people with AIDS, including 14,627 in 2006.(m)

I have no idea where you got these numbers from but they are funny.
2009 Source:FASTSTATS - Deaths and Mortality
Number of deaths for leading causes of death:

• Heart disease: 599,413
• Cancer: 567,628
• Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 137,353
• Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 128,842
• Accidents (unintentional injuries): 118,021
• Alzheimer's disease: 79,003
• Diabetes: 68,705
• Influenza and Pneumonia: 53,692
• Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 48,935
• Intentional self-harm (suicide): 36,909

If your data is correct then there are 2.5 more people who commit suicide than die of AIDS. I mean really why don't you concentrate your efforts on preventing the depression created by religions?

 

[beerisit]

I will offer an opinion. I believe homosexuality is wrong. The bible claims sexual sins are especially wrong. That being said I am not to subject a homosexual to judgement with the exception of things like a vote on same sex marriage, or child custody. That is a judgment of a concept not an individual person. The actions contained in the old testament were only for the Jews and for that time. They do not apply today. Today we are supposed to love the sinner but hate the sin. Christ spoke more kindly to sinners and more harshly about sin than anyone in history.
As for the comparison to Hiroshima (how you came up with that is beyond me) there is none. Hiroshima happened because the Japanese were so psychotic they believed their emporer was a God and surrender dishonorable. They would have and did fight to the death. Our estimates of a conventional attack were our 500,000 casualties plus maybe a million or more for the Japanese. The bombs caused laround 200,000 casualties none our own. This is as close to a justified act as can be found in this broken fallen world. Your comparison is strange.

This from a man who believes in an objective morality, truth? So you agree with me that the bombing of Hiroshima, Dresden and London can be viewed as both evil and good depending on your subjective point of view?
Oh and what is the concept you are basing your judgement on...............LOVE?

 

[Revoltingest]

I will offer an opinion. I believe homosexuality is wrong.

Even if it is "wrong", what is to be done?
I believe that religions are wrong (especially Baptists), yet I don't think sanctions against them would be a good idea.