why a bible?

[OmarKhayyam]

I don't think we're allowed to say, as per forum decorum rules.

There's always PM.

 

[sojourner]

There's always PM.

Nah. Rather dismiss it as one dispatches a pesky fly.

 

[OmarKhayyam]

Nah. Rather dismiss it as one dispatches a pesky fly.

Was not Socrates a gadfly? I am now in that company?

I would not have been so generous myself but thank you anyway.

 

[sojourner]

Was not Socrates a gadfly? I am now in that company?

I would not have been so generous myself but thank you anyway.

I didn't say Socrates was a gadfly. Don't flatter yourself.

 

[OmarKhayyam]

I didn't say Socrates was a gadfly. Don't flatter yourself.

Apparently I don't need to. You are doing very well on your own.:yes:

Something about imitation comes to mind . . .

 

[sojourner]

Socrates is to Omar as Einstein is to Rush Limbaugh.

One only has to look at your stated religion: heathenry is most definitely not "godless." One cannot be godless and be a heathen.

 

[LittleBear]

Maybe Satan is the True God, and Humans are inherently Evil.
I want to go to Borneo and live with Orangutans. Its the only fast disappearing place out of this HELL we are living in right now.

 

[sojourner]

Maybe Satan is the True God, and Humans are inherently Evil.
I want to go to Borneo and live with Orangutans. Its the only fast disappearing place out of this HELL we are living in right now.

Why Borneo? There are plenty of orangutans right here, apparently.

 

[OmarKhayyam]

Socrates is to Omar as Einstein is to Rush Limbaugh.

One only has to look at your stated religion: heathenry is most definitely not "godless." One cannot be godless and be a heathen.

Au contraire, mon Capitan.

The appellation comes from an ordained minster. He was most emphatic. A person who does not believe in God is godless. There is no god but God. To believe otherwise is to be godless, necessarily.

It is a rebuke I wear proudly. Rather like being on DuneMan's ignore list. At my age one cherishes these examples of accomplishment - however minor.

As for your relationship statement: was that meant to be a criticism of my intellect? Or debating style?

 

[sojourner]

A person who does not believe in God is godless.

That's his opinion -- one that the Heathens do not share. Since he's not a Heathen, I don't see how his opinion can carry any weight with regard to whether their gods are real, or not.

There is no god but God.

Not according to the Heathens. If you're gonna call yourself one, then you really ought to adopt their tenets -- not an outsider's.

It is a rebuke I wear proudly. Rather like being on DuneMan's ignore list. At my age one cherishes these examples of accomplishment - however minor.

I don't know how one can be proud of derision, unless one feels superior to those dishing it out. And if one feels superior, flaunting the derision in such a way, one is more like Rush Limbaugh than Socrates.

 

[sky cake]

Look, Skeezix, this is a religious forum. We're talking about God and attributes of God. God's greatest attribute is love. If we're gonna be talkin' about God, we're gonna be talkin' about love. If you're gonna talk about cars, you're likely gonna be talkin' about engines. Got it?

i understand you feel like you understand how a comples being like god can have emotions like a human, even though emotions are the result of biochemistry only. i understand your wanting to feel loved by the god you worship. i understand you belive that god loves you and a mankind, and man is the one that has trubble understanding than, and that god live man so much that he is eilling to send him to hell because his love compells him to do so, out of love. but thats not my point my point is that you have only one answer and it is "jesus loves you" you dont adress the questions offered to you. your answers are expressed by you, to avoiding anyway that does not in some way imply that jesus is the answer and his abbiding love is the sloution to every ill, you dont even seem to read the question, i could answer for you just by avoiding answering and just imply that"jesus loves you" btw that is foolishness.



Many of the questions stem from such poor theology that the love of God for us is completely obfuscated. That's a very important theme for the Divine/human relationship: love. The questions are, in a sense, not answered the way you want, because they're unanswerable -- they make such poor assumptions and disply such misunderstanding. It's like asking "why dogs' light bulbs get moldy." You can't answer such questions without setting the record straight from the get-go. The questions are foolish -- not because they oppose me, but because they're such poor questions.

we will use the case in point latter in this post to show you how wrong you are, oh the answer is jesus love you.

No, I said that slavery was completely different in 1st century Palestine than it was in modern America. It raises different social and cultural issues for us than it did for them.

No, the writers dropped the ball, as far as we're concerned, but probably not as far as the ancients were concerned.

ok, look reall simple, is salvery wrong? not now but anytime? "jesus loves you?" no slavery is bad, it was bad in jesus's time and it was bad now, he should have stood up and declaired it so. its not like they we not going to kill him, it sees that jesus could not think any farther than the cross. maybe he just died? saying that the wrighters of the bible convently did not express jesus oppions on slaver is being dishonest, by admidting that men can edit the bible you admit that it is possibly a big lode of crap, thanks for making my point for me, "jesus love you"

You're really in no position to label something as "evil" that you don't believe exists in the first place.

never said i dont belive in evil, i dont belive in the reviled god,godhead,jesus and satan. i belive in the posibility of god but i dont belive that men can know it, we would simply falter on what little bit of a glimps we happened upon. like love, or a buring bush, or holyness or firgivness. i do belive in evil i also belive in willful stupidness, better know as "faith based"

Maybe if you had bothered to learn some solid theology, you wouldn't have ended up being so resentful and untoward. And you might not look like such a homer yourself.

i am not resenful, i just dont see it the way you see it, look religious folks of all kind have claimed that gods talk to them, and impart knollage, and thats great, keep it to your self, dont bring everyone elce in to it. what gets me is when you"religious people" get backed in to a religious corner you decry that because the lost dont have that special knollage thats why what seems follishness to the lost is not seen as holy. so if your god is real, then have him love man and not send him to hell. trying to pin the failure on man is a cop out, i love my childrun unattended, i let them know i am there not thrught prophits or a bible i am there really in there life. if a am a homer to you then i guess i will have to be. but in the end your god need you to belive so he can be real to some one. just like santa

 

[sojourner]

i understand you feel like you understand how a comples being like god can have emotions like a human,

God doesn't have emotions like a human. But humans possess the God-like emotion of love.

even though emotions are the result of biochemistry only.

Or are they?

god live man so much that he is eilling to send him to hell because his love compells him to do so, out of love.

I don't think that's true at all. You're making assumptions that simply are not true upon which to base your argument.

ok, look reall simple, is salvery wrong? not now but anytime?

Not real simple. To us, the answer is "yes." To them, obviously, the answer (depending on the situation) was "no." Your oversimplification of the issue prevents you from getting an answer you think is helpful.

no slavery is bad, it was bad in jesus's time and it was bad now, he should have stood up and declaired it so.

You're just wrong here.

it sees that jesus could not think any farther than the cross.

It seems that the writers of the narratives could not look into the post-modern, Western world view.

saying that the wrighters of the bible convently did not express jesus oppions on slaver is being dishonest, by admidting that men can edit the bible

I didn't say it was convenient. In fact, it's decidedly inconvenient for us. It's a problem that cannot be solved. Yes! People edited the texts over and over and over again. So what? That doesn't make the Bible any less holy.

you admit that it is possibly a big lode of crap,

No, I don't. I admit that it is not infallible in point of fact, and must be read carefully.
You're assuming again. It's not serving you well.

never said i dont belive in evil, i dont belive in the reviled god,godhead,jesus and satan.

You misunderstood. You don't believe in God or Jesus. Since they don't exist, you're on pretty shaky ground proclaiming them as "evil."

religious folks of all kind have claimed that gods talk to them, and impart knollage, and thats great, keep it to your self, dont bring everyone elce in to it.

I don't go around claiming that God has talked to me.

what gets me is when you"religious people" get backed in to a religious corner you decry that because the lost dont have that special knollage thats why what seems follishness to the lost is not seen as holy.

I don't think I have any special knowledge that no one else has. I think I'm somewhat less blind than some folks are, but that doesn't make me "more holy," or "better." It simply means that I have a greater responsibility to deal with what I've been shown.

so if your god is real, then have him love man and not send him to hell.

God does love humanity. God doesn't "send us to hell." I think that's the biggest lie ever told in the name of Xy.

trying to pin the failure on man is a cop out,

What failure are you talking about? The failure of all people to see God? Well, let's just pass the blame! Let's not take responsibility for our own failure! Let's not be honest with ourselves. Let's stand God up and point the finger and beat on God! That'll make us feel better! Fact is, God has been standing right in front of us since time began, waving his arms and yelling, "Here I am!" Some folks aren't in the right place to see God. Some folks don't want to see God. We are frail human beings. Even I sometimes don't see God. But if I don't, the fault isn't God's -- it's mine.

i love my childrun unattended, i let them know i am there not thrught prophits or a bible i am there really in there life.

So is God.

in the end your god need you to belive so he can be real to some one.

God needs nothing. If God were in need, then God wouldn't be God.

i am not resenful

I think you are! I think you've had wacko fundigelicalism crammed down your throat so long it's made your stomach sour for all religion. I think that's true, because everything you have said thus far with regard to Xy has reflected that sort of bad theology. You assume that all Xians believe the same things, and bash all of us.

Please note: With the possible exception of the first two responses, and the twelfth, which were on the subject of love, I did not answer one time with "God love you." The ship of that accusation has sailed, I think.

 

[sky cake]

first off lol, omg, how sad. :sad4:

God doesn't have emotions like a human. But humans possess the God-like emotion of love.
Or are they?

doe he? look we cant study god because he is not real, but we can block human emotions, was can change the biochemistry. love can be made.

I don't think that's true at all. You're making assumptions that simply are not true upon which to base your argument.
like a all loveing sky god that does not manifest himself?

Not real simple. To us, the answer is "yes." To them, obviously, the answer (depending on the situation) was "no." Your oversimplification of the issue prevents you from getting an answer you think is helpful.
the answer here from jesus should be no slavery, i wish you could be transported back to jesus's time and lived as a slave and seen how wonderfull that life was, and see if your oppion would change. i bet it wood.tiger

You're just wrong here.
It seems that the writers of the narratives could not look into the post-modern, Western world view.
there are somany diffrent christians, diffrent dogmas hell even diffrent bibles that there is no unitfited centeral dogma to attack.

I didn't say it was convenient. In fact, it's decidedly inconvenient for us. It's a problem that cannot be solved. Yes! People edited the texts over and over and over again. So what? That doesn't make the Bible any less holy.

yes i do belives it does, as most christians make there minds up on its implyed dogma. and not some real visitation by jesus.

No, I don't. I admit that it is not infallible in point of fact, and must be read carefully.
and interpited excatly like you did so everyone can be right like you. jesus loves you.

You're assuming again. It's not serving you well.
you have astablished that the bible is poorly written, yet you still call it holy:run:

You misunderstood. You don't believe in God or Jesus. Since they don't exist, you're on pretty shaky ground proclaiming them as "evil."
i belive the concept that god in any form could take joy from man for anything man does or could do. i belive that if god were real that man could not come to this knollage. that any thing that exist outside mans understanding that is smarter than men could fool him. and at that level man would be hopeless against understanding a being as good or evil. i belive that any religion that puts forth the ideal that god allowing man to sin and then punishing him for that fall is evil, and is an attempt to enslave man to a dept he could not been charged with. i belive the ideal that a good god would create an evil devil and then release him on man , shows that men are the maker and keeper of god. just to control the social group.

I don't go around claiming that God has talked to me.
you could but he is not real so it does not matter, but you do belive the bible"speacks to you" right? even if it is some internal diolog, surely that is god talking.

I don't think I have any special knowledge that no one else has.
dont you? you sure seem to act as tho you do.

I think I'm somewhat less blind than some folks are,
see less blind = more inlighted= bs just so you know

but that doesn't make me "more holy," or "better." It simply means that I have a greater responsibility to deal with what I've been shown.

spoken like the religious zelot you are, great, and mighy, and so very very humble.
God does love humanity. God doesn't "send us to hell." I think that's the biggest lie ever told in the name of Xy.
you are lieing, you are trying to cover it up, god created sin, god creates punishment, and god has forgiveness at a price. the christians have taught that man was born into sin, and that the wadges of sin is death, and faliure to belive is to spend all of eternity in hell, with wailing and nashing teath were the worm dies not. the centeral tenit of christendom is that jesus saves you from hell. a hell god created. for mans failure to profess with his mouth and belive in his heart. look mans sin was created for him, he did not choose it. if you understood even stupid, evil people would chouse not to die and go to hell. but to muddy the watter and then hide between the edited words of premordern wrighters of rome the very salvastion god requiers to set you free, is to say 'i love you this much" which is not reall all that much at all, maybe god is just that weak. you know ho to tell id a religious person is lieing? if there lips are moving.


What failure are you talking about? The failure of all people to see God? Well, let's just pass the blame! Let's not take responsibility for our own failure! Let's not be honest with ourselves. Let's stand God up and point the finger and beat on God! That'll make us feel better! Fact is, God has been standing right in front of us since time began, waving his arms and yelling, "Here I am!" Some folks aren't in the right place to see God. Some folks don't want to see God. We are frail human beings. Even I sometimes don't see God. But if I don't, the fault isn't God's -- it's mine.
look if man has a seeing problem did not god give it to him? should it not then be god that ensured that man can clearly see him? god is a big boy he can take it, no were does it say you cant question god, in fact you should question everything all the time. not questiong leads to enslavement. i am sorry but the jews were here before the christians and to belive as you do and to disregard what they belive. is wrong. you cant ever see god he is not real. but you are right the fault is yours.


So is God.
God needs nothing. If God were in need, then God wouldn't be God.
i agree, man can not add to god, and if you cant lack, you cant want, if you cant want, you cant need. no need creats no action. no action whats the point. emotions are the results of internal biochemistry and previous personal experances, mans own emonital state to this will testify to it. religion needs it wants it acts, so if you belive that religion acts a buffer between man and and god, i am mearly pointing out that religion does not need god to be real for it to still have thoses wants and needs. see even if your answer is not "jesus loves you" it is formed to say 'i know i know it dont mankes sense but it is still true" like god is magic, and the truth does not aply to him. it looks more and more made up. you know when you find yourself in a hole maybe you should stop digging.

I think you are! I think you've had wacko fundigelicalism crammed down your throat so long it's made your stomach sour for all religion. I think that's true, because everything you have said thus far with regard to Xy has reflected that sort of bad theology. You assume that all Xians believe the same things, and bash all of us.

i do admidt that i act much like a christian in my unashamed self assurance of being right. very cocksure, and it is harsh sometimes, like a slap in the face, the problem is that the chrstians dogma likes to bite, and i aim to put it down for all that biting. the christians have become like an ant hill, wance you stir them up there are allove the place with there dogma, most dont offer enought about there own belifes to make the debate a personal one, so it forces me to run down the line like little bunny foo foo boping the mice on the head. :slap:

Please note: With the possible exception of the first two responses, and the twelfth, which were on the subject of love, I did not answer one time with "God love you." The ship of that accusation has sailed, I think.

well i have made a note of it, sailed or not the sperit of "jesus loves you" lives well in all you wright because faith to you is beliveing in magic. and jesus is magic. and how can magic not love you?

 

[sojourner]

look we cant study god because he is not real

Then why are you arguing about God??? Your argument is dishonest, because either you think God is real, but you're saying God isn't, or you don't think God is real, and you're arguing something that doesn't exist, either one of which is dishonest. And you call me off-base...

like a all loveing sky god that does not manifest himself?

I don't believe that God either lives in the sky, and I do think God is manifest. I've said this over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again, yet you still insist on branding me with the same assumptions. What is your problem?!

the answer here from jesus should be no slavery,

well, Jesus didn't write the Bible, now, did he! In fact, the gospel narratives were written over 40 years following the crucifixion, by non-eyewitnesses. it was they and not Jesus who "forgot" to include "slavery=bad." Once again, for the writers, writing from their perspective, slavery was not an issue. Why do you insist on making it an issue for them, just because it's an issue for us? You're obsessing.

i wish you could be transported back to jesus's time and lived as a slave and seen how wonderfull that life was, and see if your oppion would change. i bet it wood.tiger

My opinion doesn't matter. I didn't write the texts. It's the writers' opinions that matter.

there are somany diffrent christians, diffrent dogmas hell even diffrent bibles that there is no unitfited centeral dogma to attack.

First of all, modern Xian dogma doesn't matter any more to the writing of the Biblical texts than my opinion does. Second, why do you feel the need to attack any dogma? Xian dogma doesn't include advocating slavery.

yes i do belives it does

What you believe doesn't count since you're not part of the Church.

as most christians make there minds up on its implyed dogma.

Most Xians don't subscribe to sola scriptura.

and interpited excatly like you did so everyone can be right like you. jesus loves you.

Hah! I didn't say that. You said that. I couldn't car less how people interpret the Bible, as long as they can back up their opinions with reasonable argument, and the actions derived from the interpretations don't hurt anyone.

you have astablished that the bible is poorly written, yet you still call it holy

Again, I didn't say that. I didn't say it was "poorly-written." In fact, most of it is brilliant literature. I said it was not infallible with regard to its facts. That doesn't constitute "poorly-written."

i belive the concept that god in any form could take joy from man for anything man does or could do. i belive that if god were real that man could not come to this knollage. that any thing that exist outside mans understanding that is smarter than men could fool him. and at that level man would be hopeless against understanding a being as good or evil.

You have trust issues.

i belive that any religion that puts forth the ideal that god allowing man to sin and then punishing him for that fall is evil, and is an attempt to enslave man to a dept he could not been charged with. i belive the ideal that a good god would create an evil devil and then release him on man , shows that men are the maker and keeper of god. just to control the social group.

Your religious upbringing didn't teach you very much about the Church, did it!

you could

But I don't, so what's the point of arguing the non-issue?

but you do belive the bible"speacks to you" right? even if it is some internal diolog, surely that is god talking.

The Bible speaks for God at times, yes.

dont you?

No.

you sure seem to act as tho you do.

You're projecting again.

see less blind = more inlighted= bs just so you know

I didn't say anything about enlightenment. So your call of "BS" doesn't matter here.

spoken like the religious zelot you are, great, and mighy, and so very very humble.

You're being obtuse. Stop it.

you are lieing, you are trying to cover it up, god created sin, god creates punishment, and god has forgiveness at a price. the christians have taught that man was born into sin, and that the wadges of sin is death, and faliure to belive is to spend all of eternity in hell, with wailing and nashing teath were the worm dies not. the centeral tenit of christendom is that jesus saves you from hell. a hell god created. for mans failure to profess with his mouth and belive in his heart. look mans sin was created for him, he did not choose it. if you understood even stupid, evil people would chouse not to die and go to hell. but to muddy the watter and then hide between the edited words of premordern wrighters of rome the very salvastion god requiers to set you free, is to say 'i love you this much" which is not reall all that much at all, maybe god is just that weak. you know ho to tell id a religious person is lieing? if there lips are moving.

I choose to respond to your vicious, misguided diatribe with love. I'm sorry you've been hurt by your experiences. Spewing venom here won't make the hurt go away. It'll just make it worse.

look if man has a seeing problem did not god give it to him?

No.

should it not then be god that ensured that man can clearly see him?

God did. WE ruined it.

i am sorry but the jews were here before the christians and to belive as you do and to disregard what they belive. is wrong. you cant ever see god he is not real.

And the Sumerians were here before the Jews. So what?

but you are right the fault is yours.

No. You just said:

if man has a seeing problem did not god give it to him?

Therefore, you claim it's God's fault. Stop raging long enough to realize you're double-talking.

no need creats no action.

Desire creates action.

you know when you find yourself in a hole maybe you should stop digging.

You keep projecting. it's not healthy.

the problem is that the chrstians dogma likes to bite, and i aim to put it down for all that biting.

The problem is that you grossly misunderstand the basis and character of Xian dogma. Your quest is quixotic at best and toxic at worst. You're doing nothing more than tilting at windmills that are much, much bigger than you are. There are better ways for you to become a more productive member of society.

the christians have become like an ant hill, wance you stir them up there are allove the place with there dogma, most dont offer enought about there own belifes to make the debate a personal one, so it forces me to run down the line like little bunny foo foo boping the mice on the head.

No one's forcing you to do anything. You're the one who's on about Xy.

faith to you is beliveing in magic.

No, it isn't.

jesus is magic.

No, he isn't.

first off lol, omg, how sad. :sad4:

It is, indeed, very, very sad -- this business of raising one's blood pressure tilting at windmills. You have my pity.

 

[sky cake]

Quote:
look we cant study god because he is not real
Then why are you arguing about God??? Your argument is dishonest, because either you think God is real, but you're saying God isn't, or you don't think God is real, and you're arguing something that doesn't exist, either one of which is dishonest. And you call me off-base...


yes, i belive that there is no god, and for argument sake taking the side that the make belive jew jew sky god you profess to know personaly is a fake, shame,hokie,wishfull daydream. you can prase god this and thank jesus that but you are still just praying to yourself. there is no god you are decived. i once belived like you do, but i got better, i am hoping in some small way to pull you out to the lie you are living.

Quote:
like a all loveing sky god that does not manifest himself?
I don't believe that God either lives in the sky, and I do think God is manifest. I've said this over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again, yet you still insist on branding me with the same assumptions. What is your problem?!

your being dishonest look jesus assended and all the earley christians belive that jesus went to heaven up up and away. they also belived hell was at the center of the earth, as man has cone to understand that that is foolish he started to make up diffrent myiths about were jesus was. so it really matters not if you belive that jesus is in the sky, you belive in jesus, and that is pie in the sky thinking. second you dont belive that god is manifested, from one side of your face and from the othere side you belive jesus is god and walked and lived amounst us. twisted doubble talking *** of balolam, magic i tell you.



Quote:
the answer here from jesus should be no slavery,
well, Jesus didn't write the Bible, now, did he!
no he did not, a fact that sees to be dull to you, jesus had the oppertunity to wright somethind inportant, to clearly state, so not to be edited and muddled up, and did he? no, why because he is not real. you are so quick to blaim man and excuse god. dishoniest you blaim the child for letting an adult force sex on them, and let the adult off because is just a kid and how could the adult lie


In fact, the gospel narratives were written over 40 years following the crucifixion, by non-eyewitnesses. it was they and not Jesus who "forgot" to include "slavery=bad." Once again, for the writers, writing from their perspective, slavery was not an issue. Why do you insist on making it an issue for them, just because it's an issue for us? You're obsessing.

not obsessing, you clearly see that 1. jesus did not account for the editors of his holy book, 2. that if jesus was god he should have chossen better editors. 3. that if jesus failed to cleary state what should be correct that slabery is bad that maybe jesus left out other important things or maybe the editors cut out thingsand or added things that would have had they been in there may have made a diffrence in what you and all christians belive.

what gets me is you see all the oppertunity for wrongness with how the bible was collected, and you see holyness. magic prase jebus. you belive because you want to, it make you feel special, important. so i see you dont care if any of it is real it does not matter if it is real, what matters is you come out feeling so important that god would die just for you. but not be smart enought to keep man out of the mess from the start.

Quote:
i wish you could be transported back to jesus's time and lived as a slave and seen how wonderfull that life was, and see if your oppion would change. i bet it wood.tiger
My opinion doesn't matter. I didn't write the texts. It's the writers' opinions that matter.

no it does, your opioion shapes your need , that shapes your god, the bible is just a pathway for you to make you feel inportant. you did not wright the text, but you can make the text say waht ever you want to belive, and at the same time claim any error was the editors, and that even with the errors is is the greasted book ever written, because it makes you feel special.


Quote:
there are somany diffrent christians, diffrent dogmas hell even diffrent bibles that there is no unitfited centeral dogma to attack.
First of all, modern Xian dogma doesn't matter any more to the writing of the Biblical texts than my opinion does. Second, why do you feel the need to attack any dogma? Xian dogma doesn't include advocating slavery.

no it does not include slavery, but it is one of many things that is wrong with the bible,christians, and you. there are key things the bible does not do, and one of them is it does not differ from the human minds of the time it was written. at the time the bible was written slavery was general accepted as a way of life, the bible was not written by slaves, because had it been they would have had jesus condeming slavery. just like the new testiment was not written by a jew, as they have jesus at the passover/last supper inform folks to eat his flesh and drink is blood. the whole mess was lifted from the mithros followers. the jews dont consume blood, nor would jesus as the jes ask his fellow man to do such, also god condems human sacrofice, and he is ok with jesus killing himself? this makes no sense, it is dishonest. your bible is dishonest, you are dishonest for beliveing it, even attempting to accept it as holy magic, jesus makes it all better kind of stuff, god can brake the rules he makes and still be holy, magic, and by magic i mean bs.

Quote:
yes i do belives it does
What you believe doesn't count since you're not part of the Church.

no i am not appart of the church, thank you jesus. i dont need the church to make me feel special. i am trying to help you out of the jam you are in.

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as most christians make there minds up on its implyed dogma.
Most Xians don't subscribe to sola scriptura.

i will play you for a second, " you know most xians" lol anyhoo most christians do sorry. and in truth most christians are told by other people what to belive, they dont read there bibles. they are so easly confused as to what any ot it really means. it really is sad.

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and interpited excatly like you did so everyone can be right like you. jesus loves you.
Hah! I didn't say that. You said that.
you implyed that you were more inlightened than most of the people around you. yet here you are arguing with a lost soul, and the only light i see shinning from you is the glee in your eyes from your selflove. the jesus you profess looks and acks like you, is you. you long for the holyness and special place of respect that jesus has, you pretent to be the son ofgod, to even be god, to look down on the lost, and implore them to follow you to freadom, and when you are rejested or rebuffed you brissel up an blame the lost, for being so damn lost.

I couldn't car less how people interpret the Bible, as long as they can back up their opinions with reasonable argument, and the actions derived from the interpretations don't hurt anyone.
and agree with you that you are special

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you have astablished that the bible is poorly written, yet you still call it holy
Again, I didn't say that. I didn't say it was "poorly-written."
no you implyed that there were errors and that it was edited, and that it was not clearly understood, i just felt that "poorly-written" summed it up nicely.

In fact, most of it is brilliant literature. I said it was not infallible with regard to its facts. That doesn't constitute "poorly-written."

it sure as hell does.

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i belive the concept that god in any form could take joy from man for anything man does or could do. i belive that if god were real that man could not come to this knollage. that any thing that exist outside mans understanding that is smarter than men could fool him. and at that level man would be hopeless against understanding a being as good or evil.
You have trust issues.

ok, i really have a beliveing bs issues.

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i belive that any religion that puts forth the ideal that god allowing man to sin and then punishing him for that fall is evil, and is an attempt to enslave man to a dept he could not been charged with. i belive the ideal that a good god would create an evil devil and then release him on man , shows that men are the maker and keeper of god. just to control the social group.
Your religious upbringing didn't teach you very much about the Church, did it!

it did it taught me that truth worth having should not have to be rapped in a lie.

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you could
But I don't, so what's the point of arguing the non-issue?

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but you do belive the bible"speacks to you" right? even if it is some internal diolog, surely that is god talking.

 

[sky cake]

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you are lieing, you are trying to cover it up, god created sin, god creates punishment, and god has forgiveness at a price. the christians have taught that man was born into sin, and that the wadges of sin is death, and faliure to belive is to spend all of eternity in hell, with wailing and nashing teath were the worm dies not. the centeral tenit of christendom is that jesus saves you from hell. a hell god created. for mans failure to profess with his mouth and belive in his heart. look mans sin was created for him, he did not choose it. if you understood even stupid, evil people would chouse not to die and go to hell. but to muddy the watter and then hide between the edited words of premordern wrighters of rome the very salvastion god requiers to set you free, is to say 'i love you this much" which is not reall all that much at all, maybe god is just that weak. you know ho to tell id a religious person is lieing? if there lips are moving.

I choose to respond to your vicious, misguided diatribe with love. I'm sorry you've been hurt by your experiences. Spewing venom here won't make the hurt go away. It'll just make it worse.
i am glad you have love, i am hopeing i can get you some truth now.
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look if man has a seeing problem did not god give it to him?

No.
sorry yes god did it,
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should it not then be god that ensured that man can clearly see him?

God did. WE ruined it.
no how could be sin before we ate of the tree? before the fall we were not accountable. as we did not know right from wrong. god did and yet he allowed satan /the serpant in the garden. god ruined it
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i am sorry but the jews were here before the christians and to belive as you do and to disregard what they belive. is wrong. you cant ever see god he is not real.

And the Sumerians were here before the Jews. So what?
so what, so what? the jews had already astablish a religion one with rules from there god, the christins hijacked there religion and changed it to a hybred jewish -pagan sun god pollythesitic sky cake job we have today./
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but you are right the fault is yours.

No. You just said:
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if man has a seeing problem did not god give it to him?

Therefore, you claim it's God's fault. Stop raging long enough to realize you're double-talking.

so i have a menisis now? should i take a midol?
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no need creats no action.

Desire creates action.
desire imply lack,or need, so paper covers rock
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you know when you find yourself in a hole maybe you should stop digging.

You keep projecting. it's not healthy.
healthy smealthy
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the problem is that the chrstians dogma likes to bite, and i aim to put it down for all that biting.

The problem is that you grossly misunderstand the basis and character of Xian dogma. Your quest is quixotic at best and toxic at worst. You're doing nothing more than tilting at windmills that are much, much bigger than you are. There are better ways for you to become a more productive member of society.
humm well i guess you right, how can i conter such such reason. come on man, look around you, you and the christians are not winning, your numbers are falling, you are not getting stronger your getting weaker. you illk are like the sroud of turin, one big poorly told lie. the truth is jesus saves at walmart like everybody elce.
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the christians have become like an ant hill, wance you stir them up there are allove the place with there dogma, most dont offer enought about there own belifes to make the debate a personal one, so it forces me to run down the line like little bunny foo foo boping the mice on the head.

No one's forcing you to do anything. You're the one who's on about Xy.
yes, yes i am
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faith to you is beliveing in magic.

No, it isn't.
yes it is
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jesus is magic.

No, he isn't.
yes he is
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first off lol, omg, how sad.

 

[mixond]

The Bible is both a history book and a story book wrapped into one.

 

[sky cake]

The Bible is both a history book and a story book wrapped into one.

and yet it is still full of holes

 

[Quagmire]

and yet it is still full of holes

Show me any 2000+ year old written source of history that isn't "full of holes".

I think it's funny that the people who are least likely to think God had a hand in writting this thing are the most likely to insist it be perfect.

 

[sojourner]

i am hoping in some small way to pull you out to the lie you are living.

Proselytization is prohibited here.

you dont belive that god is manifested, from one side of your face and from the othere side you belive jesus is god and walked and lived amounst us. twisted doubble talking *** of balolam, magic i tell you.

And 'round and 'round we go...

no he did not, a fact that sees to be dull to you, jesus had the oppertunity to wright somethind inportant, to clearly state, so not to be edited and muddled up, and did he? no, why because he is not real.

Jesus didn't write, because most folks in that culture didn't write. It was oral culture.

dishoniest you blaim the child for letting an adult force sex on them, and let the adult off because is just a kid and how could the adult lie

I have no ideas what you're talking about. This isn't about child abuse.

not obsessing, you clearly see that 1. jesus did not account for the editors of his holy book, 2. that if jesus was god he should have chossen better editors. 3. that if jesus failed to cleary state what should be correct that slabery is bad that maybe jesus left out other important things or maybe the editors cut out thingsand or added things that would have had they been in there may have made a diffrence in what you and all christians belive.

what gets me is you see all the oppertunity for wrongness with how the bible was collected, and you see holyness. magic prase jebus. you belive because you want to, it make you feel special, important. so i see you dont care if any of it is real it does not matter if it is real, what matters is you come out feeling so important that god would die just for you. but not be smart enought to keep man out of the mess from the start.
no it does, your opioion shapes your need , that shapes your god, the bible is just a pathway for you to make you feel inportant. you did not wright the text, but you can make the text say waht ever you want to belive, and at the same time claim any error was the editors, and that even with the errors is is the greasted book ever written, because it makes you feel special.no it does not include slavery, but it is one of many things that is wrong with the bible,christians, and you. there are key things the bible does not do, and one of them is it does not differ from the human minds of the time it was written. at the time the bible was written slavery was general accepted as a way of life, the bible was not written by slaves, because had it been they would have had jesus condeming slavery. just like the new testiment was not written by a jew, as they have jesus at the passover/last supper inform folks to eat his flesh and drink is blood. the whole mess was lifted from the mithros followers. the jews dont consume blood, nor would jesus as the jes ask his fellow man to do such, also god condems human sacrofice, and he is ok with jesus killing himself? this makes no sense, it is dishonest. your bible is dishonest, you are dishonest for beliveing it, even attempting to accept it as holy magic, jesus makes it all better kind of stuff, god can brake the rules he makes and still be holy, magic, and by magic i mean bs.

Vomit.

no i am not appart of the church, thank you jesus. i dont need the church to make me feel special. i am trying to help you out of the jam you are in.

Proselytization is prohibited here.

i will play you for a second, " you know most xians" lol anyhoo most christians do sorry.

"Most Christians" are members of the Roman, Orthodox, and Anglican bodies, none of which subscribe to sola scriptura.

you implyed that you were more inlightened than most of the people around you. yet here you are arguing with a lost soul, and the only light i see shinning from you is the glee in your eyes from your selflove. the jesus you profess looks and acks like you, is you. you long for the holyness and special place of respect that jesus has, you pretent to be the son ofgod, to even be god, to look down on the lost, and implore them to follow you to freadom, and when you are rejested or rebuffed you brissel up an blame the lost, for being so damn lost.
and agree with you that you are special
it sure as hell does.

More vomit.

i am hopeing i can get you some truth now.

Proselytization is prohibited here.

sorry yes god did it,
no how could be sin before we ate of the tree? before the fall we were not accountable. as we did not know right from wrong. god did and yet he allowed satan /the serpant in the garden. god ruined it

Yet more vomit.

so what, so what? the jews had already astablish a religion one with rules from there god, the christins hijacked there religion and changed it to a hybred jewish -pagan sun god pollythesitic sky cake job we have today./

the Jews didn't create their religion out of whole cloth either. Why don't you spew at them for a while?

healthy smealthy

Great, witty comeback! I'm completely undone!

humm well i guess you right, how can i conter such such reason. come on man, look around you, you and the christians are not winning, your numbers are falling, you are not getting stronger your getting weaker. you illk are like the sroud of turin, one big poorly told lie. the truth is jesus saves at walmart like everybody elce.

More vomit.

first off lol, omg, how sad.

You're projecting again. It's not healthy.

and yet it is still full of holes

Sos' my shirt, but it's the only way I can wear it properly.