Why do disbelieves hate the word disbelievers

[Robert Landbeck]

"because i will never believe in their doctrines."

All dogma and doctrine is no more than a human, theological product, so I share no belief in any existing religious tradition for the simple reason that I am unconvinced they have anything to do with God. In fact it proves to me that human nature itself exists in a profound ignorance of that possibility, however tradition may try and fill the void. But may believers and non believers, although rarely willing to admit it, have a faith or non-faith that is provisional. Provisional in the sense that it is unknown what the future holds and while in my mind religion is 110% false, God, if there is a God, my have other plans! I'm prepared to keep my mind open and to accept correction and to change it should a literal PROOF ever be revealed. I'll be the first to test it for myself.

 

[Tony Arthur]

1) I don't mind being called a disbeliever by someone else who disbelieves, or by someone who wants a debate about belief; I do mind when people take a dogmatic, "I am right and everyone who doesn't believe what I believe is wrong" stance, and from that standpoint call other people disbelievers.

2) trying to set up a dichotomy of believers/disbelievers is like the attempt within Christianity to create a debate between evolution and creationism, when none exists because evolution happened and creation didn't. There is no debate, since all evidence available to us supports evolution, and none - I repeat, none - supports creation. There is no debate, but trying to pretend there is one give some sort of authority to a patently ridiculous and invalid world view, that people then try to foist on innocent children.

To summarise, it's not being called a disbeliever per se that bothers me; it's the intentions behind the people who throw the term around.

The problems of the world will not be solved by a non-existent fantasy figure in the sky, and hey certainly won't be solved by people trying to create an exclusive "believers" club that refuses to countenance the point of view of anyone outside it.

 

[Tony Arthur]

And also, I don't think you'll find too many disbelievers throwing the word "hate" around; hating other people for their beliefs tends to be the domain of believers. I may hate someone for their actions, for what they do, if for instance they blow themselves and a whole load of innocent people up in the name of their imaginary friend, but I hate them for being a murderer, not for being a believer in something.

I may be wrong, but I think you will find religious wars have been fought against other religions since humans started inventing gods - I don't think you'll find that many instances of non-believers displaying that level of hatred. So, you (by which I mean believers, not Muslims, let's make that clear) may hate us; we don't hate you.

 

[Servant_of_the_One1]

Because it's used as hatefull word by many scholars.

As you used "polytheism" as hateful calling to Shia.

I use polytheism for shias because i really believe they are polytheists.


There are certain things that makes shias to be polytheists in my view.
Same as there reasons why i deem disbelievers to be disbelievers.

 

[columbus]

I use polytheism for shias because i really believe they are polytheists.


There are certain things that makes shias to be polytheists in my view.
Same as there reasons why i deem disbelievers to be disbelievers.

The world would be a better place if Muslims weren't so ignorant and mean to each other.
Tom

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Colour me "Kafir". I wouldn't know Allah if he were walking down the street. How can you recognise the existence of something you have not seen, heard, smelled, or touched?

You just have to open your heart. Or is that how you recognize Jesus? I can never quite remember what I'm supposed to be opening my cold, disbelieving heart to, to be honest.

 

[Satyamavejayanti]

"Servant_of_the_One1",

Namaste,

For example iam kafir in hinduism, i dont believe in their thousands of gods, i dont believe in their fastings, incarnations and so on.

Maybe you did not get my previous post, but there is no concept similar to Kafir in Hinduism, as i have said, it is respect that is important not belief.

You are using a Islamic term in relation to Hinduism to infer that the term is also available in Hindu Dharmah, which is not correct.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Because it's usually used as an insult with judgemental connotations. Duh.

 

[LuisDantas]

One of my main difficulties in dealing with Muslims is understanding why it is such a big deal for them whether a person believes in no, one or several deities.

It is such a minor, inconsequential thing.

 

[JeremK]

It makes no sense why they hate it.

They dont believe in it so why does it bother them?



Personaly iam proud kafir/disbeliever in judaism/christianity/hinduism/buddhism/atheism because i will never believe in their doctrines.


Correction title: why do disbelievers hate to be called Disbelievers

It is simply that atheism is not a faith, but a lack thereof. Disbelieving implies that someone knows a concept to be true, but still rejects it. Your non-belief in Christianity, for example, is just that; non-belief. If you had proof that Christianity was true and didn't believe it, it'd be disbelief.

Atheism also lacks any sort of doctrine. It is solely the absence of belief in gods.

 

[Tony Arthur]

Here's something else for you to think of; let's assume, for the sake of argument, that I believe in a god that nobody else believes in, that in fact humanity has managed to move beyond fairly completely. Let's say I believe in Thor. Now, if I say to you, "you don't believe in Thor", you would probably say "no, you're right, I don't". But if I then go on to say "so, you're a disbeliever", you would probably say "don't call me a disbeliever; I believe in Allah".

Are you getting it? What is offensive about your use of the term is that it attempts to appropriate "right" with "belief in my God". To any sane and fair mind, if two people are having the following argument

1. "I'm a believer, because I believe in God A, but you're a disbeliever because you don't"

2. "No, I'm the believer here, because I believe in God B. You're the disbeliever, because you don't"

1. "Don't you insult me by calling me a disbeliever; I believe in God A - you're the one who doesn't"

2. "But God A doesn't exist, only God B does, and you don't believe in him, so you're the dirty disbeliever here"

1. "Don't you dare call me a disbeliever; God A commands me to behead people who don't believe in him"

2. "Oh yeah? Well God B commands us to burn people who believe don't believe in him at the stake".

Can you not see that the terms in which you want to use this word are offensive to anyone who doesn't agree with you? Not just "God B" followers, who are as bad as "God A" followers, but to everyone who refuses to be drawn into a belief structure that is so immature? But then again, since I suspect you believe that anyone who doesn't believe in your God is wrong, and if you follow your particular "holy book" to the letter, should probably be killed, I don't expect the level of nuanced thinking from you that would prove me wrong.

And just to make it clear, I live in a Muslim country, I have Muslim friends here, I play in a band with Muslims and non-Muslims; this isn't about anti-Muslim feeling, I love it here. It's about anti-divisive feeling.

 

[MD]

And just to make it clear, I live in a Muslim country, I have Muslim friends here, I play in a band with Muslims and non-Muslims; this isn't about anti-Muslim feeling, I love it here. It's about anti-divisive feeling.

You live in England?

 

[Blastcat]

It makes no sense why they hate it.

They dont believe in it so why does it bother them?

Personally, I hate bad spelling

 

[QuestioningMind]

It makes no sense why they hate it.

They dont believe in it so why does it bother them?



Personaly iam proud kafir/disbeliever in judaism/christianity/hinduism/buddhism/atheism because i will never believe in their doctrines.


Correction title: why do disbelievers hate to be called Disbelievers

They don't. Who told you that they do?

 

[dianaiad]

I've never heard anyone who claims to be a 'disbeliever.'

However, I would consider that 'non-believer' would be more accurate for most. "Disbeliever" has the connotation of deliberate refusal to believe, whereas 'non-believer' is simply a statement of, well, non-belief. Now me, I'm a non-believer in pretty much anything I've never heard of, because it's not possible to believe in a concept of which I am ignorant.

but don't mind me...I'm simply being picky. I AM a believer in many things, and a non-believer of many things. I don't know of many things that I deliberately disbelieve, but as I said, that's my own personal perception of the deliberate intent implied by the word 'disbelief' as opposed to 'non-belief.'

Unless perhaps it's Calvinism in any form. I may truly be a disbeliever in that.

 

[Mary Blackchurch]

You just have to open your heart. Or is that how you recognize Jesus? I can never quite remember what I'm supposed to be opening my cold, disbelieving heart to, to be honest.

I know nothing of Jesus either, so, I am not sure where you draw your conclusions. According to you I have a cold heart because I disbelieve what some primitive desert dweller said 1500 years ago before there was penicillin. But then you precede to add the pragmatic ending of "to be honest" when nothing you said is remotely ingenuous at all. You can't possibly know anything about me. No, in fact I find you utterly disingenuous. Here's the truth: You don't know anything about Mohammed either. Fact.

 

[LuisDantas]

You live in England?

I take it that you are among the (apparently many) people who feel that the expansion of Islaam in England is both dangerous and well beyond any reasonable parameters?

 

[lewisnotmiller]

I know nothing of Jesus either, so, I am not sure where you draw your conclusions. According to you I have a cold heart because I disbelieve what some primitive desert dweller said 1500 years ago before there was penicillin. But then you precede to add the pragmatic ending of "to be honest" when nothing you said is remotely ingenuous at all. You can't possibly know anything about me. No, in fact I find you utterly disingenuous. Here's the truth: You don't know anything about Mohammed either. Fact.

Sorry...we need some sort of sarcastic tag here to make things clearer. On another board I frequent, we colour text green where it's sarcastic/ironic.

In any case, I'm an atheist. My point was that I've been told more than once that the way to recognise <insert deity> is not by the 5 senses, but instead by 'opening your heart'. Which always makes me laugh, since each person saying it assumes that would lead you to the same deity they have decided is 'the truth'.

So, apologies again. Didn't mean to confuse you, just used to most people around here being aware I'm an atheist, and also being aware that my sense of humour is a little...err...different?

 

[MD]

I take it that you are among the (apparently many) people who feel that the expansion of Islaam in England is both dangerous and well beyond any reasonable parameters?

Lol yes, but that post was made in jest

 

[vijeno]

They dont believe in it so why does it bother them?

I don't hate it, it's a rather apt description of me.

I don't know whether it has a bit of a derogatory meaning though. In my own language, "Ungläubiger" sounds a bit like an insult: "infidel", if you know what I mean. A bit too close to "infidelity".

Ultimately, I think it has to do with the ambivalence and connotations of the words belief and faith.