Fair would be Natural Laws and natural processes determine what is fair If God is the Creator.
We flap our arms and jump off the 10 story building. We cannot fly.
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Why "God does not exist" is a positive claim
- Thread starter firedragon
- Start date
We flap our arms and jump off the 10 story building. We cannot fly.
Logically possible??? Needs explanation. Logical arguments are dependent on the assumptions which limits them.
Respond to post #700 concerning the Contingency Argument,
Logically possible things do not determine Natural Laws.
Redneck Mystic
Active Member
Never said I can fly, but I do have a love piece or art, entitled, “When pigs fly” and I once knew he artists and how it came about that she did the painting, and its hilarious. God has a terrific sense of humor, but sometimes it is not be laughing when it happens. I had a very religous girffirned one, who has a “We plan, God laughers” magnet on her refrigerator door. I kept telling her God had her put it there, and she heard me, but she kept making plans, and she kept trying to change me, even though she said God kept telling her to leave me alone, I was doing what God wanted me to do, and I told her if she kept it up, God would break us up, and when she finally spent the night with me, I had sty
Redneck Mystic
Active Member
fled. I was all torn up inside, because I really loved her, and our passion was not of this world, and when we were alone and getting along, we went to a place together, which was not of this world, and it was so wonderful, there are no words to describe it, and it happened many times, and she called it “the space”, but I never felt it that way after that night when we talked, nor did I feel it with later women in that way,, whom God or an angel had brought to me, and they knew God had brought them to me, and me to them, and they heard from God, or an ange all the time, and, well, you have much to look forward to someday, if not on this world, then in the afterlife. I’m not going to tell you any more of which you know nothing, but if you get visited and want to take about it, I will talk with you then.
Redneck Mystic
Active Member
I’m old, by eyes aiint that great, and this platform’s format for discussing is lousy, compared to many other platforms where I discuss stuff with people.
Here’s what I tried to write and it kept sending before I was ready.
Never said I can fly, but I do have a love piece or art, entitled, “When pigs fly” and I once knew he artists and how it came about that she did the painting, and its hilarious. God has a terrific sense of humor, but sometimes it is not be laughing when it happens. I had a very religous girffirned one, who has a “We plan, God laughers” magnet on her refrigerator door. I kept telling her God had her put it there, and she heard me, but she kept making plans, and she kept trying to change me, even though she said God kept telling her to leave me alone, I was doing what God wanted me to do, and I told her if she kept it up, God would break us up, and when she finally spent the night with me, I had stayed over at her home many times, I woke up in the middle of the night and she was gone, and I ran outside in my sock feet and caugher her at her car and she said God had told her in her sleep, “You are not the one”, and she was terrified and fled.fled. I was all torn up inside, because I really loved her, and our passion was not of this world, and when we were alone and getting along, we went to a place together, which was not of this world, and it was so wonderful, there are no words to describe it, and it happened many times, and she called it “the space”, but I never felt it that way after that night when we talked, nor did I feel it with later women in that way,, whom God or an angel had brought to me, and they knew God had brought them to me, and me to them, and they heard from God, or an ange all the time, and, well, you have much to look forward to someday, if not on this world, then in the afterlife. I’m not going to tell you any more of which you know nothing, but if you get visited and want to take about it, I will talk with you then.
Redneck Mystic
Active Member
I’m old, by eyes aiint that great, and this platform’s format for discussing is lousy, compared to many other platforms where I discuss stuff with people.
Here’s what I tried to write and it kept sending before I was ready.
Never said I can fly, but I do have a love piece or art, entitled, “When pigs fly” and I once knew he artists and how it came about that she did the painting, and its hilarious. God has a terrific sense of humor, but sometimes it is not be laughing when it happens. I had a very religous girffirned one, who has a “We plan, God laughers” magnet on her refrigerator door. I kept telling her God had her put it there, and she heard me, but she kept making plans, and she kept trying to change me, even though she said God kept telling her to leave me alone, I was doing what God wanted me to do, and I told her if she kept it up, God would break us up, and when she finally spent the night with me, I had stayed over at her home many times, I woke up in the middle of the night and she was gone, and I ran outside in my sock feet and caugher her at her car and she said God had told her in her sleep, “You are not the one”, and she was terrified and fled.fled. I was all torn up inside, because I really loved her, and our passion was not of this world, and when we were alone and getting along, we went to a place together, which was not of this world, and it was so wonderful, there are no words to describe it, and it happened many times, and she called it “the space”, but I never felt it that way after that night when we talked, nor did I feel it with later women in that way,, whom God or an angel had brought to me, and they knew God had brought them to me, and me to them, and they heard from God, or an ange all the time, and, well, you have much to look forward to someday, if not on this world, then in the afterlife. I’m not going to tell you any more of which you know nothing, but if you get visited and want to take about it, I will talk with you then.
Redneck Mystic
Active Member
I’m old, by eyes aiint that great, and this platform’s format for discussing is lousy, compared to many other platforms where I discuss stuff with people.
Here’s what I tried to write and it kept sending before I was ready.
Never said I can fly, but I do have a love piece or art, entitled, “When pigs fly” and I once knew he artists and how it came about that she did the painting, and its hilarious. God has a terrific sense of humor, but sometimes it is not be laughing when it happens. I had a very religous girffirned one, who has a “We plan, God laughers” magnet on her refrigerator door. I kept telling her God had her put it there, and she heard me, but she kept making plans, and she kept trying to change me, even though she said God kept telling her to leave me alone, I was doing what God wanted me to do, and I told her if she kept it up, God would break us up, and when she finally spent the night with me, I had stayed over at her home many times, I woke up in the middle of the night and she was gone, and I ran outside in my sock feet and caugher her at her car and she said God had told her in her sleep, “You are not the one”, and she was terrified and fled.fled. I was all torn up inside, because I really loved her, and our passion was not of this world, and when we were alone and getting along, we went to a place together, which was not of this world, and it was so wonderful, there are no words to describe it, and it happened many times, and she called it “the space”, but I never felt it that way after that night when we talked, nor did I feel it with later women in that way,, whom God or an angel had brought to me, and they knew God had brought them to me, and me to them, and they heard from God, or an ange all the time, and, well, you have much to look forward to someday, if not on this world, then in the afterlife. I’m not going to tell you any more of which you know nothing, but if you get visited and want to take about it, I will talk with you then.
Ad pop?
No. Its evidence that the universe conforms to the laws of physics.
When have faith or intuition ever produced consistent, tested results?
Religion vs science? Which 'methodology' produces consistent, repeatable results? Which will stand up to testing?
We had religion for thousands of years, and it never produced an agreed upon or tested picture of
reality.
Can be. I'm convinced I'm unconvinced.
Q: How would we defend non-existence? How would we conclusively evidence it?
So belief in God isn't an ontological claim, but a psychotherapeutic modality?Well, as a form of psychology faith in God can have postive subjective results.
As for in effect the big one for what reallyworks?!! Well, we can observe that there are theists and they don't just die, but have lives. So in some sense it works.
So as in practice for how the world works, religion as per humans is a part of how the world works.
See, it depends on how "we" understand works.
What does "work for us" mean, exactly?
His 'faith' seems to serve a social or psychotherapeutic function, rather than paint an accurate picture of physical reality.
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Usually I find that "faith" refers to faith in the reality of God, and in some particular behavior or doctrine sourced from God.
Faith is unfounded belief; belief with insufficient evidence. Faith and intuition never "worked."
Belief is practice? Bees practice pollen harvesting. Tulips practice photosynthesis.. What are their beliefs?
No. A belief is an intellectual construct.
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What do you mean by "work?" What does faith do? It's certainly not consistent, like science.
You're preaching. You haven't even established that God is real.
mikkel_the_dane
My own religion
Well, yes.
In effect any claim to what objective reality is and not just a supernatural one has a psychological element of how to make sense of everything and how it matters.
I have posted it before, but here is an example of it for ontological materialism.
Qoute from site:
"...
Definitions
Atheism is the comprehensive world view of persons who are free from theism and have freed themselves of supernatural beliefs altogether. It is predicated on ancient Greek Materialism.
Atheism involves the mental attitude that unreservedly accepts the supremacy of reason and aims at establishing a life-style and ethical outlook verifiable by experience and the scientific method, independent of all arbitrary assumptions of authority and creeds.
Materialism declares that the cosmos is devoid of immanent conscious purpose; that it is governed by its own inherent, immutable, and impersonal laws; that there is no supernatural interference in human life; that humankind, finding the resources within themselves, can and must create their own destiny. It teaches that we must prize our life on earth and strive always to improve it. It holds that human beings are capable of creating a social system based on reason and justice. Materialism’s ‘faith’ is in humankind and their ability to transform the world culture by their own efforts. This is a commitment that is, in its very essence, life-asserting. It considers the struggle for progress as a moral obligation that is impossible without noble ideas that inspire us to bold, creative works. Materialism holds that our potential for good and more fulfilling cultural development is, for all practical purposes, unlimited."
Our Vision
We envision a world in which policies are made using the best evidence we have rather than using religious dogma.
www.atheists.org
mikkel_the_dane
My own religion
Well, can you establish that the universe is real?
As for work - work has 2 meanings relevant here - how to get something as things to work versus how to get a life to work.
What objective reality as real as independent of the mind is, is unknown.
That is how you ger methodological naturalism and this:
Philosophy of science - Wikipedia
"... According to Robert Priddy, all scientific study inescapably builds on at least some essential assumptions that cannot be tested by scientific processes; ..."
I can't help it that you are unaware of the philosophy behind science.
RestlessSoul
Well-Known Member
It’s not solipsism, it’s clarity. Whatever we may consider objective reality to be, our experience of it is necessarily subjective.
Failure to recognise this, is to deny one of the defining limitations of our human experience.
RestlessSoul
Well-Known Member
Here’s one I borrowed from two professors of particle and theoretical physics;
“The argument for a Creator appears to be bolstered by another remarkable aspect of the natural world: the laws of physics seem to be perfectly adjusted in order to produce a Universe that is hospitable to life. To apply the fundamental laws of physics, as encoded in the Standard Model and General Relativity, it is necessary to first specify the values of around thirty numbers, which include the strengths of the forces, the masses of the particles and the size of the cosmological constant…Changing these numbers, even by a few percent, gives rise to theoretical universes that have no chance of supporting life. It is very easy to end up with theories in which stars never form, or burn out in millions rather than billions of years, leaving no time for biological evolution…
…it appears to be extremely difficult to pick values for the strengths of the forces and the particle masses such that heavier elements including carbon and oxygen, are produced in stars and remain stable against radioactive decay. The expansion rate of the Universe is also ‘just so’…
…There would be no stars or galaxies if there were too little dark matter or too much light. Even the way that supernovae explode, scattering the heavy elements necessary for life across interstellar space, would be significantly affected if the weak nuclear force was just a little weaker or stronger than it is.”
- Prof Brian Cox, Prof Jeff Forshaw, “Universal - A Journey Through The Cosmos”
McBell
Admiral Obvious
“This is rather as if you imagine a puddle waking up one morning and thinking, 'This is an interesting world I find myself in — an interesting hole I find myself in — fits me rather neatly, doesn't it? In fact it fits me staggeringly well, must have been made to have me in it!'
~Douglas Adams
RestlessSoul
Well-Known Member
Okay, you’ve referenced the anthropic principle, a tautological argument often cited to refute the ‘fine-tuning problem’.
That doesn’t alter the fact that, in a universe increasingly shown to be probabilistic rather than deterministic in nature, our existence here is a statistical miracle.