Why is homosexuality a sin

[Smoke]

:sorry1: But you're not going to blame his life on me.

Oh, I am. You and those like you destroyed him. But don't worry, I wasn't expecting you to see it, much less repent.

 

[Autodidact]

That's right, we are to deaden our members upon earth.
The gay community has been trying to find loopholes in the Bible, wresting scriptures to justify their sin.
But our Scriptures are safe.
The gospel message is the same for all, to repent and turn from our sins and follow Jesus. Jesus said to follow him requires death to self.
If I am a thief then the thief must die. If I am a liar, the liar must die.
If I'm a murderer the murderer must die, and so on.
I must die to self and take up my cross and follow Christ.
A gay said he prayed, fasted, cried and waited for years for God to change him.
When it never happened, he foolishly assumed that since God didn't "change" him then it must be God's will for him to have sex with the same sex as he.
He failed to understand the gospel message.
God never promised to change anyone, he commands us to repent and die to self.
He doesn't promise to make us better, he wants to make us deader.
Jesus said we must take up our cross and follow him if we would be his disciples.

So I take it you have no answer to the arguments being made then?

 

[Crowley]

Autodidact;877541]

Wow, that's one sick religion you got there

.

Why because it doesn't cater to homosexuality? Because it doesn't agree with you? Yes that is why. You want a religion that sins and calls it holy.

Why, when you talk about homosexuals, do you always use the word lust, but not for heterosexuals?

It is lust that causes men or women to cheat on their spouses. Love will never cheat on anyone. Paul said love never fails. Sex is an expression of love within marriage, but if this sex brought on by lust is found outside the marriage bed, it incurs the wrath of God.

Homosexuals are no more or less lustful than heterosexuals.

I disagree. Nothing personal but gays do things that are disgusting. Having sex anywhere anytime with complete strangers is nothing short of abominable

The only difference is the object of their love or lust, as the case may be.
I love my sweetheart with all my heart.

I cannot imagine how anyone can experience such a thing as what you just said if you refer to same sex sex. Jeremiah the prophet said the heart you mentioned "is deceitful above all things and desperately wicked."

I express my love for her many different ways, most of them quite mundane, but important to us, and including physically, which she appreciates as well.

It is not love, but could be many things, but it is not love.

I believe this is pretty much what a few lucky happily married heterosexuals do, no?

I don't discuss my life with Dan with anyone.

Maybe you should deal with the arguments actually being made, rather than the one's you like to answer. The argument has been made, not by me, that you are incorrect in your translation and context, and that male homosexuality is not an abomination according to the OT.

You may say what you will, but it doesn't change what God said that homosexuality is a sin and those who pracice it are reprobate. A reprobate mind cannot distinguish good from evil, but thinks evil is good and good is evil. The sane civilized world knows it is wrong. God turned then over to a reprobate mind because they refused to retain God in their knowledge but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

The argument has been made by me that lesbianism is only mentioned once in the entire Bible, which is pretty amazing, and never prohibited. Not once. Eating weasels is prohibited. Grabbing your husband's wrestling opponent's testicles is prohibited. Gathering sticks on Saturday. Trimming your beard. Removing parapets from your roof. Wearing clothing of mixed fibers. Making stone images of things. Enslaving brother Hebrews. (But not people from neighboring countries.) Lots and lots of commandments and prohibitions. But none, not one, prohibiting women from loving each other or expressing that love. Zip. Bupkus. Yet I'll take a wild guess that you consider it a sin anyway, while happily doing many things expressly prohibited by what you claim to be the source of your morality, the Bible. You have replaced the holy word of God with your own narrow prejudices. Is that a sin?

Well, you go right ahead and pracitice your homosexuality.
But we Christians know our Scriptures are safe
and what you practice is sin.

 

[Autodidact]

Autodidact;877541].
Why because it doesn't cater to homosexuality? Because it doesn't agree with you? Yes that is why. You want a religion that sins and calls it holy.

No, because it doesn't value our love for one another, the most important and valuable thing we have.

It is lust that causes men or women to cheat on their spouses. Love will never cheat on anyone. Paul said love never fails. Sex is an expression of love within marriage, but if this sex brought on by lust is found outside the marriage bed, it incurs the wrath of God.

What does this have to do with homosexuality?

I disagree. Nothing personal but gays do things that are disgusting. Having sex anywhere anytime with complete strangers is nothing short of abominable

Ah, the truth comes out; it's not about God's word at all; it's about Crowley's personal distaste. Why are you talking about sex with strangers? I thought we were discussing homosexuality? I've never had sex with a stranger in my life. I thought I told you what my life was about, my love for my partner, V.

I cannot imagine how anyone can experience such a thing as what you just said if you refer to same sex sex. Jeremiah the prophet said the heart you mentioned "is deceitful above all things and desperately wicked."

Well, you're wrong. I realize it disturbs your worldview, but V and I share a wonderful, mutual, caring, respectful, fun, devoted love. Just the facts. Deal with it. No sex with strangers, no infidelity, just mutual, devoted, ecxlusive love.

It is not love, but could be many things, but it is not love.

*restrains self from returning insult with insult* You're wrong. And I assure you, I'm in a much better position to judge than you.
Are you by chance a fundamentalist Christian? Because your relationship with reality reminds me of theirs--look it right in the face and deny it.

You may say what you will, but it doesn't change what God said that homosexuality is a sin and those who pracice it are reprobate. A reprobate mind cannot distinguish good from evil, but thinks evil is good and good is evil. The sane civilized world knows it is wrong. God turned then over to a reprobate mind because they refused to retain God in their knowledge but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

That Bible verse again where lesbianism is prohibited? The Bible says nothing about my love for my dear beloved

Well, you go right ahead and pracitice your homosexuality.

But we Christians know our Scriptures are safe
and what you practice is sin.

1. Safe from what? What are you talking about
2. You realize that there is an entire gay Christian church, right?
3. You realize that I'm an atheist, right? So I really don't care what you consider to be sinful, as long as you don't try to control my life or deny my rights. However, you have so far said not a single word to demonstrate to anyone that lesbianism is sinful. As I said, it is mentioned a grand total of (1) one (1) time in either testament, and is never prohibited.

 

[Napoleon]

Yes it is. In any language it is a sin. Men poking, kissing, holding and lusting other men is a sin and that is all there is to it.

Sin and "abomination" are a far cry from each other.

???? what are you talking about? Jesus felt what way about women?

According to Paul, women have no place in the Church and are to dress and behave a certain way while in Church. Jesus indicated quite the opposite.

The only love the Bible recognizes as love is the love of God.

There's absolutely nothing in the Bible which declares that love between men is wrong. What is declared unacceptable is a physical relationship between men.

An argument used by gays is David and Jonathan, but that was God's love they had for each other, not lustful sexual attachment.

There are numerous passages which indicate that David and Jonathan had a romantic relationship.

It surpassed the love of women because it wasn't romantic attachment, like the love David had for Bathsheba or the love Jacob had for Rachel.

LOL. David lusted after Bathsheba so much so that he ordered the death of her husband so he could have her for himself. That is an example of lust not love.

 

[Autodidact]

For those who are concerned with facts, what the Bible really says about two women's love for one another:

And Ruth said, Intreat me not to leave thee, or to return from following after thee: for whither thou goest, I will go; and where thou lodgest, I will lodge: thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God:
Where thou diest, will I die, and there will I be buried: the LORD do so to me, and more also, if ought but death part thee and me.

 

[Blindinglight]

He failed to understand the gospel message.

Your God DID FAIL to act. It's no ones fault if they don't understand a mere book.

But our Scriptures are safe.

Then why does so much scientific evidence, which is hard, concrete evidence, fail to support it? Even as far as being gay, your Bible contradicts what modern science has discovered to be major factors at what determines if someone is gay or not.

The Bible does not recognize lust as love.

Being gay or bi doesn't mean you are in lust automatically. If you don't know something, don't pass judgement, for you obviously have the beam in your eye that your own Jesus talked about.

Shall we also say the Bible is wrong about bestiality and murder, adultery and the rest?

Yes, the Bible is wrong about adultry. Bestiality is rape, and murder is needlessly taking a life, and I will agree with the Bible that those two acts are wrong.
But saying "if we say homosexuality is right, then we must assume the other is right" is a very unintelligent argument that is compairing hate and harm to love and compassion.

They used homosexuality as an example of how the anal can be damaged if not properly viewed and understood.

I bet it didn't, since there are plenty of heterosexual couples that enjoy anal sex.

And being beaten to death by people who can't handle the gay life when it is presented to them.

Christians have been killed just for being Christian throughout time. By your own argument, you should not want to be a Christian because you might be beaten to death one day. But, "God said so" that that might happen, so I guess that makes it ok, huh?

 

[Phil Lawton]

This thread is like a little time machine...for a few seconds, I'm transported back into the days of the Inquisition.

Good thing we're all more enlightened now, isn't it?

 

[Smoke]

This thread is like a little time machine...for a few seconds, I'm transported back into the days of the Inquisition.

Good thing we're all more enlightened now, isn't it?

If only.

 

[MBones]

Wow your words to Autoadict or I may have spelled the name wrong, are disgusting and far from anthing that resembles truths to any religion in the world. You are on one side showing ignorance, that is it. ignorance, is not the way. The blind hate is not representative of any religion I am familiar with, especially not Christianity. That kind of unnacceptance is not worthy of any reply.

 

[MBones]

Are you really kidding? On a skateboard? What is the best trick I did on a skateboard? You must have known that I was a professional skateboarder for a brief time in my life. Well almost, I was watched by many companies back in the time. Yes I was a very good skateboarder. I originally skated with the Bones brigade back at Upland at one time or another. Wow that really freaks me out. I can still 50/50 to a backside disaster every now and again. Method air off of the big spine, that is what I liked most. Then I broke my ankle on a nice vert ramp in the valley. That was it. So what is the best trick I can pull now, well I bet it is better than your best trick on your best day. Independent rules..

 

[MBones]

Ah Mr. Phil. All fun aside I am going to give my two cents to your comments. And I will hope that you will read them and restrain yourself until I am finished. Not that I will know but as a gentlemen thing to do. Ok here I go, I am going to try and seperate your responses as you have so done so to mine. Here we go:

A station for conver?

Yes of course it is, that is why we are in a chat. If I wanted to be pickey I would have said "A station for conver? Wait, I just realized I spelled coversation wrong. Well done. You are are very well gifted in the English grammar or spelling for that matter. Did you win the Scripts spelling bee? Just a question. I like that you poke fun at other people's pronunciation. Or typing, I guess. Does that make you feel superior? OK enough of that. On to your responses.


Your style is reminiscent of that of residents of Bakersfield...you are in California, aren't you?

No I am not. But why did you say that? Is Bakersfield a bad place or for that fact a place to poke fun at? I have never been there and obviously you have and are an expert on that geographical place. You comment seems to me that you think less of people from there, and that is a bad flaw , to think bad of anyone because of where they are from. If not OK lets move on.


That wasn't my question, but what is it that you engineer the automation of?
What is that I engineer the automation of? That is a classified topic and I can't answer that one. But you of course being an engineer too you must know what automation engineering is?

[FONT=&quot]So...for you to listen to a claimant re his or her belief that his or her religion is greater than any other, you want DNA evidence? What...like sperm samples or something? And what, pray, would you do with them? Hmmm...is this just to help you in some strange hobby?

But why is it that you and you alone can confirm or deny the superiority of one belief over another with DNA? Is this part of your science knowledge?

Wow...you must have aced science at university

At a University, the correct term. Yes actually I am a Science [/FONT]genius.

[FONT=&quot]you want DNA evidence? What...like sperm samples or something? And what, pray, would you do with them? Hmmm...is this just to help you in some strange hobby?

That reply is not worth anything. Poor form Mr. Phil. Obviously you do not know that DNA can come from hair, fingernails, blood, skin, fingerprints, breath, cigarette butts, gum, soda cans, spit, etc... sperm, yes you are right DNA can come from that, but if there is no donor, then you are out of luck.
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot],[/FONT] I am a very science minded engineer
What does this mean?
I have explained above.

that has worked with biologics for an extended period of time.
Biologics? Is that a science term or an engineering term? Or is it a ninja term?

Biologics include a wide range of medicinal products such as vaccines, blood and blood components, allergenics, somatic cells, gene therapy, tissues, and recombinant therapeutic proteins. Biologics can be composed of sugars, proteins, or nucleic acids or complex combinations of these substances, or may be living entities such as cells and tissues. Biologics are isolated from a variety of natural sources - human, animal, or microorganism - and may be produced by biotechnology methods and other cutting-edge technologies. Gene-based and cellular biologics, for example, often are at the forefront of biomedical research, and may be used to treat a variety of medical conditions for which no other treatments are available.[1]...



D
I would hope that you hold the same regard for a lay person as you would someone who has no college background.
It depends...it they were talking a lot of crap about something they patently knew nothing about, it wouldn't matter what their qualifications supposedly were....they'd still be spouting crap.

Do you paint?
No I am sorry I am not gifted enough to paint. But I would hope the statement above would still be true. If not, I know a painter, or many painters, for that matter of fact that have no college background.

I work with people everyday who have not had any college classes in their life
Dependant on what branch of automation you and your uneducated colleagues are working together on, should we be worried about what systems we use?
I will not answer that arrogant and ignorant question.
and they are some of the most intelligent people I have ever worked with

Intelligence schmintelligence...I want someone qualified to be working on the automated systems these people are working on. Bertrand Russell was intelligent, but I wouldn't want him doing preventative maintenance on an elevator. What's the name of your company? I will write to them immediately.

Nice try... The answer is that all of the people I work with are qualified to do their jobs. Whether it is a degree or years of experience. Frankly I would want the years of experience guy. I work in a professional sector that it is really hard to break in without an advanced degree, yet some of the best answers and concepts I have seen have came from people who have been there for over 20 years and don't have an advanced degree. Explain that you recent college grad? Or no I could be wrong on that.

If the "high priced engineers" know what they're doing, I don't care how much they cost.

Tell me, what's the best trick you've ever done on a skateboard?

You will see my comment to that later on. And no sometimes the high priced engineers, and I am one of them, do not know what they are doing, but hey we have the credentials.

I have been on both sides and sometimes education credentials are ********. I rather take the guy with 20 years of experience.

 

[rocka21]

we're all more enlightened

thats what we call it , in todays world.

 

[Blindinglight]

Good thing we're all more enlightened now, isn't it?

I only wish. I pray for many that the average American citizen doesn't blindy allow America to slip back into the Dark Ages.

 

[Darkness]

It is not love, but could be many things, but it is not love.

Aren't Christians supposed to be humble? There are few Christians I meet who actually are. You are so arrogant that you actually believe you know what people feel.

"Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres." -- Paul of Tarsus

 

[Papersock]

.
It is lust that causes men or women to cheat on their spouses. Love will never cheat on anyone. Paul said love never fails. Sex is an expression of love within marriage, but if this sex brought on by lust is found outside the marriage bed, it incurs the wrath of God.

It may not always be lust. Someone could genually love someone else, or even more than one person.
Love can indeed fail. If a couple fall out of love, where they never in love to begin with? Or are they actually still in love and they don't know it?

I disagree. Nothing personal but gays do things that are disgusting. Having sex anywhere anytime with complete strangers is nothing short of abominable

Who says that all homosexual behave this way? And how is this any different from most heterosexuals?

It is not love, but could be many things, but it is not love.

How very presumptuous of you to say when someone else is or is not in love.

 

[MBones]

Yes..... Some intelligent responses. EVeryone give their opinion. That is what is great about this. Speak up and be heard....

 

[MBones]

Well what about that research? It proves that some are genetically bound to a life that is unacceptable to you. But the other ones,,, they are sin... Is that what you are saying? How about ignorance of the subject as you have already admitted would be fine. Just acknowledge it like many have.

 

[MBones]

Rasor,

Of course everyone has their right to speak their opinion, but when people post lies and BS then it is not right. Homosexuality is here today, and will have a place in society in the future. If that scares you then you need to refoucus your life and think. Jesus did not say that homsexuality was wrong. And if he did tell me the verse. For that matter, no religion can tell you what is right and what is wrong in life, you have to decide for yourself, and please go about this in the best interest of the human world.

 

[Smoke]

For those who are concerned with facts, what the Bible really says about two women's love for one another:

And Ruth said, Intreat me not to leave thee, or to return from following after thee: for whither thou goest, I will go; and where thou lodgest, I will lodge: thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God:
Where thou diest, will I die, and there will I be buried: the LORD do so to me, and more also, if ought but death part thee and me.

That's the way it is in my Bible, too. I would have preferred the spelling aught but death.

It's notable that lesbianism is not forbidden in the Old Testament and is only obliquely disparaged in one passage of the New. The Bible has much worse things to say about wearing jewelry and doing your hair.