Why it's confusing us more than guiding us?

[Desert Snake]

Why? Some of us actually speak the truth.

You aren't really saying anything. Your ''theology'', is vague, by necessity; you also don't understand the nature of Scripture.

 

[Neo Deist]

You aren't really saying anything. Your ''theology'', is vague, by necessity; you also don't understand the nature of Scripture.

LOL...yeah, ok.

I guess my 30 years as a Baptist prior to thinking for myself, is meaningless. Everything about every religion is man made. Deal with it.

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

I feel that people ask these questions, look for these answers, and come up with their own versions in order to protect themselves from the real thing that scares (and therefore drives) them in this avenue of contemplation - that being that, in the end, there may never actually be any answers - not even once you "pass on".

The fear that you don't get to know - you no longer exist - there is no consciousness - no more light - no more dark - no "more". That is there, among (and in stark contrast to) all the other "possibilities", and to most people it is disheartening to think on such.

Unfortunately, all the other "possibilities" are just that - "possible"... not "probable". And I am of the belief that that particular distinction is the scariest of them all to people of faith.

 

[ThePainefulTruth]

I feel that people ask these questions, look for these answers, and come up with their own versions in order to protect themselves from the real thing that scares (and therefore drives) them in this avenue of contemplation

Yeah, and those people who will do anything to justify what they "want" to believe, give those of us who work very hard not to lie to ourselves and actually seek the Truth, a bad name. But the worst of it is, they give the vast majority in the middle an easy excuse to dismiss the whole endeavor.

- that being that, in the end, there may never actually be any answers - not even once you "pass on".

The fear that you don't get to know - you no longer exist - there is no consciousness - no more light - no more dark - no "more". That is there, among (and in stark contrast to) all the other "possibilities", and to most people it is disheartening to think on such.

Unfortunately, all the other "possibilities" are just that - "possible"... not "probable". And I am of the belief that that particular distinction is the scariest of them all to people of faith.

Not sure how this ties into the first (there might be nothing therefore just forget about it?). Fact is, death is there waiting for us all, and taking this route looks a lot like just keeping your head in the sand. Do you have something against hope?

 

[LuisDantas]

Everyone here is trying to convince you that their beliefs are the right ones.

Everyone shares their thoughts and their beliefs.

they impose their thought into others while embracing their own beliefs.

What is right and what is wrong.

Is there a God or two or three? To which God we belong?

At some point its getting confusing.

Expecting people to somehow share conceptions of matters that are so utterly personal is indeed confusing.

Frankly, lending much significance to the minor concept that people call "deity" does not help any, either.

Anyway my point is, lots of thoughts, lots of ideas, lots of religions, lots of beliefs ,it feels like its diverting our attention from the one reality . We want to see something but our attention is heading toward something else. We want to believe in something but some people are saying it's good and some people are saying it's bad. You get confuse along the way and in the end of the road you lose your way. It's just getting too confusing.

Not sure I agree with "we want to believe in something" part. Religion often works better without belief for the sake of belief.

There is no "a one policy" or one "goal" to target and to focus on but lots of things going on and on every where it feels like a mess .

I mean why we enter a forum to debate and compare? To end up with one- the best conclusion right? But instead I'm getting more confused why?

There is value in learning of other people's perspectives and attaining whatever degree of mutual understanding one can reasonably achieve. Convincing others is often a very distant second, or even not a goal at all.

For example, some asks who is God. The answer suppose to be one simple answer, but NO, every answer is different than the other. It's not suppose to be like this. Where is the conclusion? Where is the answer? No one can find an answer.

I fear that is just not a good example. The concept of God is supposed to be vague and to allow for conflicting understandings.

There is a God but if we just put our ideas and our thoughts from every religion, from ever region, from every single human being mind, the outcome will be a mess.

There is a God but God have some specific features we can't just add and subtract as we wish, can we?.

Actually... I doubt there is any God beyond those that we do create, and we should accept and embrace the responsibility of shaping them as we see fit. Or let go of them entirely if it suits us.

(...)

There are lots of possibilities of religions that is right, but there is one answer, one truth. At the end, only the religion that answered right will pass and the rest will fail, because there is only one answer is right and there is a defiantly an end to everything like the end of every human's life.

Uh, no. Religion is unavoidably and necessarily diverse. It must be if it is to have any worth. It must acknowledge, respect and cooperate with individual traits of various people.

If you put your own ideas and your own thoughts it doesn’t make it the "TRUTH". We have to think that is why we have a brain, we can't just read and believe every line we go through. Because not everything is the truth only one truth is there.

What worth would religious truth have if we do not put our ideas and thoughts in it? None. Religion is supposed to be validated by the people who adhere to it, not the other way around.

I suspect you use a model of "religion" that is somewhat more restricted than mine.

So no more new thoughts or new stuff added to the list we had lots and it is confusing as it is. We want to focus and to see the straight line to the " good end".

Why it's confusing us more than guiding us?

Perhaps because people expect to find ready-made recipes to that which has ever, always been our personal duty to enunciate in our own words and according to our own personal needs and talents?

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

Not sure how this ties into the first (there might be nothing therefore just forget about it?). Fact is, death is there waiting for us all, and taking this route looks a lot like just keeping your head in the sand. Do you have something against hope?

To be brutally honest, I feel that most belief in the supernatural of any form ultimately ends up being an attempt to "bury your head in the clouds". That is - to imagine a better version of the end, eternity or of circumstances in general because you know that you can't know the reality. I never said anything against having hope. Do I hope that there is some form of afterlife, or existence beyond death? As much as anyone, I assure you! However, am I prepared for the possibility that there is nothing? Of course I am. Is that "burying my head in the sand?" I don't see it that way at all. I would hazard a guess that I've thought more on the topic of the end than most people - contemplated what it means to be living and what it means to be dead. And I have to say that in all the thinking I have done, in all the conversation I have had, in all the examining of "evidence" from belief to fact, not once have I felt that anything supernatural will end up being the workings behind all of this. I try to keep an "open mind" - but no explanation or story of the supernatural has ever moved me closer to belief, and based on what I have seen so far, none may ever do so.

 

[RedDragon94]

Everyone here is trying to convince you that their beliefs are the right ones.

Everyone shares their thoughts and their beliefs.

they impose their thought into others while embracing their own beliefs.

What is right and what is wrong.

Is there a God or two or three? To which God we belong?

At some point its getting confusing.


Anyway my point is, lots of thoughts, lots of ideas, lots of religions, lots of beliefs ,it feels like its diverting our attention from the one reality . We want to see something but our attention is heading toward something else. We want to believe in something but some people are saying it's good and some people are saying it's bad. You get confuse along the way and in the end of the road you lose your way. It's just getting too confusing.

There is no "a one policy" or one "goal" to target and to focus on but lots of things going on and on every where it feels like a mess .

I mean why we enter a forum to debate and compare? To end up with one- the best conclusion right? But instead I'm getting more confused why?

For example, some asks who is God. The answer suppose to be one simple answer, but NO, every answer is different than the other. It's not suppose to be like this. Where is the conclusion? Where is the answer? No one can find an answer.

There is a God but if we just put our ideas and our thoughts from every religion, from ever region, from every single human being mind, the outcome will be a mess.

There is a God but God have some specific features we can't just add and subtract as we wish, can we?.



At the end, we change our religions from one to another like changing our outfit to the one that suits us and fit our mentality and our thinking, how come?

Why parents are strict? Because there are lines between right and wrong, we can't just change the "right" to be" wrong" and change the "wrong" to be" right". There must be some rules some borders and some lines that shouldn’t be crossed. There are some things we need to know and some things we need not to know.


Again what I'm saying that there is something wrong when everyone conflict about the right religion, thoughts, beliefs . it's just a mess, there must be a one right answer, it can't be that every religion in this world is right.

There are lots of possibilities of religions that is right, but there is one answer, one truth. At the end, only the religion that answered right will pass and the rest will fail, because there is only one answer is right and there is a defiantly an end to everything like the end of every human's life.

If you put your own ideas and your own thoughts it doesn’t make it the "TRUTH". We have to think that is why we have a brain, we can't just read and believe every line we go through. Because not everything is the truth only one truth is there.

So no more new thoughts or new stuff added to the list we had lots and it is confusing as it is. We want to focus and to see the straight line to the " good end".

Why it's confusing us more than guiding us?

This is probably why I have a hard time sticking with Christianity. It gets to be too much about the ideology. If we all realized that God cannot truly be figured out completely then why do we hold to our ideologies so close?

There were times throughout last week where I wasn't satisfied with the conclusions Christianity brought me. If God restores all things, why doesn't he restore me? Why doesn't God perform a miracle in my life like he could, he's all powerful isn't he?

I come to the conclusion sometimes, maybe he doesn't want me.

Either what the religions claim to know about God is false on purpose or maybe it's just that we can't know anything about God.

*edit* I often go through crises like this. *edit*

 

[URAVIP2ME]

This is probably why I have a hard time sticking with Christianity. It gets to be too much about the ideology. If we all realized that God cannot truly be figured out completely then why do we hold to our ideologies so close?
There were times throughout last week where I wasn't satisfied with the conclusions Christianity brought me. If God restores all things, why doesn't he restore me? Why doesn't God perform a miracle in my life like he could, he's all powerful isn't he?
I come to the conclusion sometimes, maybe he doesn't want me.
Either what the religions claim to know about God is false on purpose or maybe it's just that we can't know anything about God.
*edit* I often go through crises like this. *edit*

Of course He wants You. Remember the illustration about the one missing sheep out of 100 ?_______
What did Peter write that we should do and why at 1 Peter 5:7 ?

God can restore all of us - Revelation 22:2. Under Christ's coming 1,000-year governmental rulership over earth there will be healing for earth's nations.
Jesus will fulfill God's promise to father Abraham that ALL families of earth will be blessed, and ALL nations of earth will be blessed - Genesis 12:3; Genesis 22:18

We are nearing the soon coming ' time of separation ' on earth - Matthew 25:31-33,37 - when humble ' sheep'-like people can remain alive on earth, and continue to live on earth, right into the start of Jesus' millennium-long day of governing over earth when Jesus will usher in global Peace on Earth among people of goodwill.

 

[RedDragon94]

Of course He wants You. Remember the illustration about the one missing sheep out of 100 ?_______
What did Peter write that we should do and why at 1 Peter 5:7 ?

I remember it, it's just that I've gone a ways.

We are nearing the soon coming ' time of separation ' on earth - Matthew 25:31-33,37 - when humble ' sheep'-like people can remain alive on earth, and continue to live on earth, right into the start of Jesus' millennium-long day of governing over earth when Jesus will usher in global Peace on Earth among people of goodwill.

I think I'm on the left in this equation. But I don't think there's anything I can do to change that.

 

[Aupmanyav]

I never said anything against having hope. Do I hope that there is some form of afterlife, or existence beyond death? As much as anyone, I assure you! However, am I prepared for the possibility that there is nothing? Of course I am. Is that "burying my head in the sand?" I don't see it that way at all.

There is certainly a form of afterlife and existence beyond death. What constitutes you does not ever get destroyed. That is against the law of physics/chemistry, law of the universe. It is chemically recycled. "I am" is the real problem. One who gets over "I am", will really know.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

There is certainly a form of afterlife and existence beyond death. What constitutes you does not ever get destroyed. That is against the law of physics/chemistry, law of the universe. It is chemically recycled. "I am" is the real problem. One who gets over "I am", will really know.

It seems as if most people think they are Not mortals, and will be more alive after death than before death.
Even the clergy of Christendom teach an immortal soul, although the Bible teaches the soul can die and the soul be destroyed - Ezekiel 18:4; Acts of the Apostles 3:23
Can't atoms be destroyed ?_________
What constituted us before we were conceived ?
Adam had No pre-human existence. At death Adam simply ' returned ' to the dust of the ground - Genesis 3:19
Can a person ' return ' to a place he never was before ?
According to Scripture only the wicked will be destroyed forever ( annihilated ) - Psalms 92:7
That does Not mean the rest of the dead have No future life, they do. Life again via a resurrection back to life - Acts of the Apostles 24:15

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I remember it, it's just that I've gone a ways.
I think I'm on the left in this equation. But I don't think there's anything I can do to change that.

Remember the old adage: that where there is life there is hope. ' Hope ' is found through the teachings of Christ.
There is only No hope for those of Hebrews 6:4-6.
We have the opportunity to ' repent ' so as Not to ' perish ' (be destroyed) - 2 Peter 3:9
If errors were only what mattered to God then None of us could stand - Psalms 130:3-5
We can stand and be counted as righteous ones, Not because of any merit, but because Jesus died for us - Matthew 25:37

 

[Aupmanyav]

It seems as if most people think they are Not mortals, and will be more alive after death than before death.
Can't atoms be destroyed ?
What constituted us before we were conceived ?
Can a person ' return ' to a place he never was before ?
That does Not mean the rest of the dead have No future life, they do. Life again via a resurrection back to life.

People have all kinds of beliefs.
Atoms (as far as we know today) cannot be destroyed, they change their form to energy.
Physical energy, that turns into mass/material - before or after does not matter, 'we are that' ('Tat twam asi', that is what Hindu books said).
A person 'comes' to a place where he might never have been before (not 'returns').
Resurrection/rebirth/reincarnation is fiction. Beliefs. My beliefs may be different from yours.

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

There is certainly a form of afterlife and existence beyond death. What constitutes you does not ever get destroyed. That is against the law of physics/chemistry, law of the universe. It is chemically recycled. "I am" is the real problem. One who gets over "I am", will really know.

But therein lies the rub... I completely understand that "I am not". That what I think of as my consciousness, my sentience is merely a formless eidolon enclosed within a transient physical entity. So what if the material of my body goes on to become the stuff of trees and flowers and other animals? Is that the real "meat" of my existence as I, the transient being that I am, understand it? No, it is not. Therefore what propagates into eternity has nothing to do with the "me" that I know and love. And that is entirely because "I am not".

 

[Aupmanyav]

You love that "I" too much, though you are aware that it is an illusion. Why love reflections? Your real essence is what constitutes the universe. What is wrong in being a part of a trees, flowers or animals? Your essence will permeate a billion things, a billion things. You will stop being just you but will become omnipresent. "Tat twam asi" (You are that). In Hinduism, Buddhism and Sikhism, we are advised to recognize our true essence.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

People have all kinds of beliefs.
Atoms (as far as we know today) cannot be destroyed, they change their form to energy.
Physical energy, that turns into mass/material - before or after does not matter, 'we are that' ('Tat twam asi', that is what Hindu books said).
A person 'comes' to a place where he might never have been before (not 'returns').
Resurrection/rebirth/reincarnation is fiction. Beliefs. My beliefs may be different from yours.

Yes, all kinds of beliefs.
Yes, atoms change form to energy.
According to scriptural beliefs that would be the case because material creation comes from God's ' power and strength (His energy ) ' - Isaiah 40:26
Isn't No resurrection, no rebirth or reincarnation then No hope after death ?

 

[Aupmanyav]

Haha, keep hoping. There was a mendicant at Jodhpur railway station who blessed all soldiers going for fighting in Second World War. Asked whether his blessings work? He said 'those who die will not come to ask me, those who survive will think that it was due to my blessings'. So, anyone can promise anything after death. What is the proof? Sage Brihaspati was a 'Charvak' philosopher in India around 500 BC. He said:

'Yāwad jiwet sukham jiwet, rinam kritwā ghritam pibet, bhasmibhūtasya dehasya punarāgamanam kutah'
Live happily till you are alive. borrow money and drink ghee. once you are dead and your body is burnt, where is the return?

 

[RRex]

Everyone here is trying to convince you that their beliefs are the right ones.

Everyone shares their thoughts and their beliefs.

they impose their thought into others while embracing their own beliefs.

What is right and what is wrong.

Is there a God or two or three? To which God we belong?

At some point its getting confusing.


Anyway my point is, lots of thoughts, lots of ideas, lots of religions, lots of beliefs ,it feels like its diverting our attention from the one reality . We want to see something but our attention is heading toward something else. We want to believe in something but some people are saying it's good and some people are saying it's bad. You get confuse along the way and in the end of the road you lose your way. It's just getting too confusing.

There is no "a one policy" or one "goal" to target and to focus on but lots of things going on and on every where it feels like a mess .

I mean why we enter a forum to debate and compare? To end up with one- the best conclusion right? But instead I'm getting more confused why?

For example, some asks who is God. The answer suppose to be one simple answer, but NO, every answer is different than the other. It's not suppose to be like this. Where is the conclusion? Where is the answer? No one can find an answer.

There is a God but if we just put our ideas and our thoughts from every religion, from ever region, from every single human being mind, the outcome will be a mess.

There is a God but God have some specific features we can't just add and subtract as we wish, can we?.



At the end, we change our religions from one to another like changing our outfit to the one that suits us and fit our mentality and our thinking, how come?

Why parents are strict? Because there are lines between right and wrong, we can't just change the "right" to be" wrong" and change the "wrong" to be" right". There must be some rules some borders and some lines that shouldn’t be crossed. There are some things we need to know and some things we need not to know.


Again what I'm saying that there is something wrong when everyone conflict about the right religion, thoughts, beliefs . it's just a mess, there must be a one right answer, it can't be that every religion in this world is right.

There are lots of possibilities of religions that is right, but there is one answer, one truth. At the end, only the religion that answered right will pass and the rest will fail, because there is only one answer is right and there is a defiantly an end to everything like the end of every human's life.

If you put your own ideas and your own thoughts it doesn’t make it the "TRUTH". We have to think that is why we have a brain, we can't just read and believe every line we go through. Because not everything is the truth only one truth is there.

So no more new thoughts or new stuff added to the list we had lots and it is confusing as it is. We want to focus and to see the straight line to the " good end".

Why it's confusing us more than guiding us?

I think it is a mistake to say a religion is right or wrong, and there are 7,000,000,000+ people on this planet who are all individuals, so there will be just as many interpretations of what is right and wrong.

Religion and faith are a very personal matter. We need to recognize that and practice our faith on our own and in our own way.

 

[Hawkins]

Why it's confusing us more than guiding us?

We humans get religious information from a document call the holy book. The Bible of Christianity serves 2 basic purposes;

1) to bring God's sheep to salvation
2) to filter those who are not His sheep

As a result, the Holy Book is a crucial book concerning the dead or alive of humans. God thus has to convey the same message today as He conveyed the message 2000 years ago.

The Bible of Christianity is the only book which is reconcilable. No other human book can be reconciled against its counterpart 2000 years ago.

The OT Bible is reconcilable because we have a whole library (the Dead Sea Scrolls) for us to tell that the OT Bible today is the same 2000 years ago, theologically speaking.

The NT Bible is reconcilable because we have 2 independent sources with the same theological contents, namely, the KJV and NIV streams of Bible. They are kept independently along history for us to reconcile that what we read theologically today remains the same as some 2000 years ago.

No another human document can be reconciled this way. That's actually why God has to choose a religion to convey His message of salvation. It is because a theology can only be brought forward this way across the timeline of more than 2000 years of human history.

 

[ThePainefulTruth]

I think it is a mistake to say a religion is right or wrong, and there are 7,000,000,000+ people on this planet who are all individuals, so there will be just as many interpretations of what is right and wrong.

Yet basically, except for some very small gray areas, there is only one objective moral truth. Without it, genocide, torture, murder, rape, theft, pedophilia, can be deemed moral on nothing more than a whim. Zieg Heil!

Religion and faith are a very personal matter. We need to recognize that and practice our faith on our own and in our own way.

All being personal means is that we can believe whatever we want no matter how unfounded.