Will Atheists & Polyheists burn in Hell according to Bible?

[jonathan180iq]

I've been to Hell. It's in Kufstein, Austria.
The glacial rivers there are beautiful!

 

[Vishvavajra]

The origianl commandment was to "sudue the earth and make it a paradise". That was never done and the bible when correctly understood strongly suggests that is still God's plan for His righteous followers.

Hmm... not sure about subduing the earth etc., if taken literally. The early Christian teaching was that the world would be perfected as people perfected themselves by manifesting their true, undefiled nature in Christ. This will naturally have external consequences that will transform the world, since the world is not separate from us, so the end result might well be seen as the same. But trying to change the external world without changing oneself isn't the right idea.

But maybe that's what you meant.

 

[jeager106]

Hmm... not sure about subduing the earth etc., if taken literally. The early Christian teaching was that the world would be perfected as people perfected themselves by manifesting their true, undefiled nature in Christ. This will naturally have external consequences that will transform the world, since the world is not separate from us, so the end result might well be seen as the same. But trying to change the external world without changing oneself isn't the right idea.

But maybe that's what you meant.

That works.

 

[Riverwolf]

No I just echoed what I read here.

History of the English language - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
he languages of Germanic peoples gave rise to the English language. The best known are the Angles, Saxons, Frisii, Jutes and possibly some people such as Franks, who traded, fought with and lived alongside the Latin-speaking peoples of the Roman Empire in the centuries-long process of the Germanic peoples' expansion into Western Europe during the Migration Period. Latin loan words such aswine, cup, and bishop entered the vocabulary of these Germanic peoples before their arrival in Britain and the subsequent formation of England.[1]

Hel - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The modern English word Hell is derived from Old English hel, helle (about 725 AD to refer to a nether world of the dead) reaching into the Anglo-Saxon pagan period, and ultimately from Proto-Germanic*halja, meaning "one who covers up or hides something".[2] The word has cognates in related Germanic languages such as Old Frisianhelle, hille, Old Saxonhellja, Middle Dutchhelle (modern Dutch hel), Old High Germanhelle (Modern German Hölle), Danish, Norwegian and Swedishhelvede/helvete (hel + Old Norsevitti, "punishment" whence the Icelandicvíti "hell"), and Gothichalja.[2] Subsequently, the word was used to transfer a pagan concept to Christian theology and its vocabulary[2] (however, for the Judeo-Christian origin of the concept see Gehenna).

from:Hel (being) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


The Prose Edda details that Hel rules over vast mansions with many servants in her underworld realm and plays a key role in the attempted resurrection of the god Baldr.
In Norse mythology, Hel is a being who presides over a realm..... from:Hel (being) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The word hel & hell, worked it's way into the Bible. Constintine ordered literalry works formed into a book in 325 A.D.
Hel came into use around 725 a.d.
I could well be wrong about the Druids use of the word hell...needs further research.

Wikipedia can be a good source, but it's better as a starting point for research, not an end point.

The traditional religion of the Anglo-Saxons, for example, is likely to have several differences from the Norse one, despite both being variants on the pan-European traditions. It should always be remembered that the idea of a singular religion for a group of peoples is very new; the Old Way was far more localized and syncretic. An Anglic village may have regarded Helle as the personification of Death, but a Saxon village just a few days' walk away may have personified Death in the figure of Orc.

Also, if you'll notice, there's nothing in these paragraphs that point to Hel the Wight being worshiped as a Goddess. Remember that in the modern Anglo-American conception we have the figure of the Grim Reaper. But I seriously doubt there are a significant number of people who actually worships this figure as a God.

 

[JustWondering]

Lots of things get badly out of context when one doesn't undertand the bible.
There was a literal "needles eye" and camels did have a tough time getting thru ti but it could be done if the
camel could be made to walk on it's knees to enter.
Look it up if you like.
hell = grave, nothing more.
Look that up if you care to.

The bible is quite clear about hell being a real place where people are punished forever. The only way you can deny this is to ignore what was plainly written in the bible and taught by Jesus himself. By saying there is no hell where eternal punishment is dished out is basically deviating from the scriptures and going into "Imma gonna make up my own religion" territory.

Matthew 25:46 “And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

Luke 16:22 "And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
23And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
24And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
25But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.
26And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.
27Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:
28For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.
29Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
30And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
31And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."

 

[Rick B]

The Bible is not unclear on this subject. Those who reject Christ are condemned to eternal punishment in the lake of unquenchable fire. Matt.25:31-46, Matt.3:12, Jn.5:28-29, Matt.13:41-42, 49-50, Mark 16:16, Rev.20:14-15, Rev.21:8. But God has provided the way of escape through repentance of our hostility towards Him and faith in Christ alone for salvation.

 

[JayJayDee]

The bible is quite clear about hell being a real place where people are punished forever. The only way you can deny this is to ignore what was plainly written in the bible and taught by Jesus himself. By saying there is no hell where eternal punishment is dished out is basically deviating from the scriptures and going into "Imma gonna make up my own religion" territory.

Not really. When something is said to be eternal, it simply means that it doesn't end.

What does the Bible really say about the fate of human kind at the end of their days?

In Eden, there was no death mentioned except as a punishment for disobedience. Taking that one step further...if Adam and his wife had not disobeyed the command to eat of the forbidden fruit, there was no other cause of death ever mentioned, so logically, taking Gen 3:19-24 into account....there was no reason for them ever to have died. The mandate to "fill the earth and subdue it would have been carried out.

Gen 3:19-24....God said to Adam..... "In the sweat of your face you will eat bread until you return to the ground, for out of it you were taken. For dust you are and to dust you will return.” 20 After this Adam named his wife Eve, because she was to become the mother of everyone living. 21 And Jehovah God made long garments from skins for Adam and for his wife, to clothe them. 22 Jehovah God then said: “Here the man has become like one of us in knowing good and bad. Now in order that he may not put his hand out and take fruit also from the tree of life and eat and live forever, —” 23 With that Jehovah God expelled him from the garden of Eʹden to cultivate the ground from which he had been taken. 24 So he drove the man out, and he posted at the east of the garden of Eʹden the cherubs and the flaming blade of a sword that was turning continuously to guard the way to the tree of life." (NWT)

Matthew 25:46

“And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

Who said the punishment had to be conscious? Everlasting death is the correct opposite of everlasting life. You assume that there is conscious existence after death.....where does it say that in the Bible?
There is no teaching of an immortal soul in the Bible. That was a later belief adopted from Platonic Greek teachings.

Luke 16:22

"And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
23And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
24And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
25But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.
26And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.
27Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:
28For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.
29Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
30And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
31And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."

This is a parable....not a literal account.

"Hell" here is what the Jews understood "Sheol" to mean, not what the Greeks taught "hades" to mean. Jesus was teaching Jews, not Gentiles.

Sheol to a Jew was the place where all the dead go....it was a place of unconscious inactivity. (Eccl 9:5, 10)

 

[JustWondering]

Not really. When something is said to be eternal, it simply means that it doesn't end.

What does the Bible really say about the fate of human kind at the end of their days?

In Eden, there was no death mentioned except as a punishment for disobedience. Taking that one step further...if Adam and his wife had not disobeyed the command to eat of the forbidden fruit, there was no other cause of death ever mentioned, so logically, taking Gen 3:19-24 into account....there was no reason for them ever to have died. The mandate to "fill the earth and subdue it would have been carried out.

Gen 3:19-24....God said to Adam..... "In the sweat of your face you will eat bread until you return to the ground, for out of it you were taken. For dust you are and to dust you will return.” 20 After this Adam named his wife Eve, because she was to become the mother of everyone living. 21 And Jehovah God made long garments from skins for Adam and for his wife, to clothe them. 22 Jehovah God then said: “Here the man has become like one of us in knowing good and bad. Now in order that he may not put his hand out and take fruit also from the tree of life and eat and live forever, —” 23 With that Jehovah God expelled him from the garden of Eʹden to cultivate the ground from which he had been taken. 24 So he drove the man out, and he posted at the east of the garden of Eʹden the cherubs and the flaming blade of a sword that was turning continuously to guard the way to the tree of life." (NWT)



Who said the punishment had to be conscious? Everlasting death is the correct opposite of everlasting life. You assume that there is conscious existence after death.....where does it say that in the Bible?
There is no teaching of an immortal soul in the Bible. That was a later belief adopted from Platonic Greek teachings.



This is a parable....not a literal account.

"Hell" here is what the Jews understood "Sheol" to mean, not what the Greeks taught "hades" to mean. Jesus was teaching Jews, not Gentiles.

Sheol to a Jew was the place where all the dead go....it was a place of unconscious inactivity. (Eccl 9:5, 10)

Sorry, but you are twisting/ignoring what scripture clearly says to suit what you WANT to believe. Jews may not believe in hell but Christians do. If the Jewish take on what the afterlife is like is more comforting to you and makes more sense to you why not just convert to Judaism and be done with it?

 

[JayJayDee]

The Bible is not unclear on this subject. Those who reject Christ are condemned to eternal punishment in the lake of unquenchable fire. Matt.25:31-46, Matt.3:12, Jn.5:28-29, Matt.13:41-42, 49-50, Mark 16:16, Rev.20:14-15, Rev.21:8.

This is "Gehenna" not hades. Do you understand what Gehenna meant to a Jew? It doesn't mean what you think it does.

Matthew 10:28: “Do not become fearful of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; but rather be in fear of him that can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.” (Erroneously translated "hell" in some Bibles)

Souls are not tortured in Gehenna...they are "destroyed". This was a reference to the city's garbage dump outside Jerusalem's walls where fires were kept burning day and night with the addition of brimstone (sulphur). The carcasses of dead animals and the bodies of executed criminals were cast into the flames for disposal....they were completely destroyed. What the flames missed...the maggots finished off. Nothing alive was ever cast in there. To a Jew it meant having no memorial tomb from which to be resurrected. They understood what Jesus meant.

The "lake of fire" mentioned in the Revelation was not a place of conscious torment either. It is rightly called "the second death" because unlike the first death, there is no way out of this place. It too means everlasting death.

God is not a fiend....he does not need to torture anyone. What would be the point? Punishment was always meant to lead to repentance...it was never meted out just for the sake of it.

But God has provided the way of escape through repentance of our hostility towards Him and faith in Christ alone for salvation.

Those who fail to comply with the commands of God and the teachings of his Christ, will undergo everlasting punishment....but it is everlasting death....nothing more. The highest penalty a person could suffer under the law was death. There was no torture or confinement under hard labor ever meted out to Jewish offenders under God's law. So why should we expect God to transgress his own standards of justice and punish the wicked eternally, for a short lifetime of sin? The punishment is contrary to Jehovah's perfect justice.

Those who stole worked to compensate their victims...those who committed capital offences, suffered the death penalty, regardless of how repentant they were. Their repentance was something that counted at their resurrection, when even the "unrighteous" are raised with the "righteous". (John 5:28, 29) The wicked can expect to sleep in death forever. Only Jehovah and his son know who they are. We are not their judges.

 

[JayJayDee]

Sorry, but you are twisting/ignoring what scripture clearly says to suit what you WANT to believe. Jews may not believe in hell but Christians do. If the Jewish take on what the afterlife is like is more comforting to you and makes more sense to you why not just convert to Judaism and be done with it?

Jesus was Jewish.....he did not teach about hell....sorry. The scriptures were twisted long before you or I were even born.

 

[JustWondering]

Jesus was Jewish.....he did not teach about hell....sorry. The scriptures were twisted long before you or I were even born.

So if the bible is twisted and cannot be trusted, how does anyone know what is truth and what is made up nonsense? Did the founder of JW's dig up golden plates with the real story on them that he translated using magic rocks like the founder of the Mormon Church?

 

[JustWondering]

Jesus was Jewish.....he did not teach about hell....sorry.

You're right, he taught that people should love him above all things and that if anyone including your own flesh and blood speak against him that you should denounce them and cast them aside. The typical stuff any cult leader would say really.

 

[shawn001]

Yes I agree. When I attended Geneva Univeristy I learned a great deal of biblical truth from some fine
professors who wern't afraid to step on the toes of established false doctrine.
God didn't create this planet for humans to die and go floating off someplace else, either in heaven or hell.
The origianl commandment was to "sudue the earth and make it a paradise". That was never done and the bible when correctly understood strongly suggests that is still God's plan for His righteous followers.

Except around five billion years from now the sun will go Red Giant and fry the Earth.

 

[shawn001]

"Maybe that's what hell is. You go mad, and all your demons come and get you just as fast as you can think them up.”
Anne Rice

 

[jeager106]

Except around five billion years from now the sun will go Red Giant and fry the Earth.

oooooooooooooooooooooo-kay?
Is there a point in there someplace?

 

[shawn001]

yes, the earth won't be around for ever no matter what, the sun is going to explode the moon is drifting away from us right now and at some point in the very distant future the Milky-way Galaxy is quite likely to collide with the Andromeda galaxy. In fact do to the second law of thermodynamics and the expansion of the universe its not looking good for any planets or stars at about 100 billion years.

 

[shawn001]

As far as I know this didn't actually happen but its pretty good anyway.

"Dr. Schambaugh, of the University of Oklahoma School of Chemical Engineering, Final Exam question for May of 1997. Dr. Schambaugh is known for asking questions such as, "why do airplanes fly?" on his final exams. His one and only final exam question in May 1997 for his Momentum, Heat and Mass Transfer II class was: "Is hell exothermic or endothermic? Support your answer with proof."

Most of the students wrote proofs of their beliefs using Boyle's Law or some variant. One student, however, wrote the following:

"First, We postulate that if souls exist, then they must have some mass. If they do, then a mole of souls can also have a mass. So, at what rate are souls moving into hell and at what rate are souls leaving? I think we can safely assume that once a soul gets to hell, it will not leave.

Therefore, no souls are leaving. As for souls entering hell, let's look at the different religions that exist in the world today. Some of these religions state that if you are not a member of their religion, then you will go to hell. Since there are more than one of these religions and people do not belong to more than one religion, we can project that all people and souls go to hell. With birth and death rates as they are, we can expect the number of souls in hell to increase exponentially.

Now, we look at the rate of change in volume in hell. Boyle's Law states that in order for the temperature and pressure in hell to stay the same, the ratio of the mass of souls and volume needs to stay constant. Two options exist:

1. If hell is expanding at a slower rate than the rate at which souls enter hell, then the temperature and pressure in hell will increase until all hell breaks loose.
2. If hell is expanding at a rate faster than the increase of souls in hell, then the temperature and pressure will drop until hell freezes over.

So which is it? If we accept the quote given to me by Theresa Manyan during Freshman year, "that it will be a cold night in hell before I sleep with you" and take into account the fact that I still have NOT succeeded in having sexual relations with her, then Option 2 cannot be true...Thus, hell is exothermic."

 

[wizanda]

Christians are more likely to be in hell, for following the anti-Christ's teachings Paul, John and Simon the stone (petros).

Many atheists are skeptical and question, thus they've got a higher chance of avoiding it.

 

[Rick B]

This is "Gehenna" not hades. Do you understand what Gehenna meant to a Jew? It doesn't mean what you think it does.

Matthew 10:28: “Do not become fearful of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; but rather be in fear of him that can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.” (Erroneously translated "hell" in some Bibles)

Souls are not tortured in Gehenna...they are "destroyed". This was a reference to the city's garbage dump outside Jerusalem's walls where fires were kept burning day and night with the addition of brimstone (sulphur). The carcasses of dead animals and the bodies of executed criminals were cast into the flames for disposal....they were completely destroyed. What the flames missed...the maggots finished off. Nothing alive was ever cast in there. To a Jew it meant having no memorial tomb from which to be resurrected. They understood what Jesus meant.

The "lake of fire" mentioned in the Revelation was not a place of conscious torment either. It is rightly called "the second death" because unlike the first death, there is no way out of this place. It too means everlasting death.

God is not a fiend....he does not need to torture anyone. What would be the point? Punishment was always meant to lead to repentance...it was never meted out just for the sake of it.



Those who fail to comply with the commands of God and the teachings of his Christ, will undergo everlasting punishment....but it is everlasting death....nothing more. The highest penalty a person could suffer under the law was death. There was no torture or confinement under hard labor ever meted out to Jewish offenders under God's law. So why should we expect God to transgress his own standards of justice and punish the wicked eternally, for a short lifetime of sin? The punishment is contrary to Jehovah's perfect justice.

Those who stole worked to compensate their victims...those who committed capital offences, suffered the death penalty, regardless of how repentant they were. Their repentance was something that counted at their resurrection, when even the "unrighteous" are raised with the "righteous". (John 5:28, 29) The wicked can expect to sleep in death forever. Only Jehovah and his son know who they are. We are not their judges.

This is "Gehenna" not hades. Do you understand what Gehenna meant to a Jew? It doesn't mean what you think it does.

Matthew 10:28: “Do not become fearful of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; but rather be in fear of him that can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.” (Erroneously translated "hell" in some Bibles)

Souls are not tortured in Gehenna...they are "destroyed". This was a reference to the city's garbage dump outside Jerusalem's walls where fires were kept burning day and night with the addition of brimstone (sulphur). The carcasses of dead animals and the bodies of executed criminals were cast into the flames for disposal....they were completely destroyed. What the flames missed...the maggots finished off. Nothing alive was ever cast in there. To a Jew it meant having no memorial tomb from which to be resurrected. They understood what Jesus meant.

The "lake of fire" mentioned in the Revelation was not a place of conscious torment either. It is rightly called "the second death" because unlike the first death, there is no way out of this place. It too means everlasting death.

God is not a fiend....he does not need to torture anyone. What would be the point? Punishment was always meant to lead to repentance...it was never meted out just for the sake of it.



Those who fail to comply with the commands of God and the teachings of his Christ, will undergo everlasting punishment....but it is everlasting death....nothing more. The highest penalty a person could suffer under the law was death. There was no torture or confinement under hard labor ever meted out to Jewish offenders under God's law. So why should we expect God to transgress his own standards of justice and punish the wicked eternally, for a short lifetime of sin? The punishment is contrary to Jehovah's perfect justice.

Those who stole worked to compensate their victims...those who committed capital offences, suffered the death penalty, regardless of how repentant they were. Their repentance was something that counted at their resurrection, when even the "unrighteous" are raised with the "righteous". (John 5:28, 29) The wicked can expect to sleep in death forever. Only Jehovah and his son know who they are. We are not their judges.

This is "Gehenna" not hades. Do you understand what Gehenna meant to a Jew? It doesn't mean what you think it does.

Matthew 10:28: “Do not become fearful of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; but rather be in fear of him that can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.” (Erroneously translated "hell" in some Bibles)

Souls are not tortured in Gehenna...they are "destroyed". This was a reference to the city's garbage dump outside Jerusalem's walls where fires were kept burning day and night with the addition of brimstone (sulphur). The carcasses of dead animals and the bodies of executed criminals were cast into the flames for disposal....they were completely destroyed. What the flames missed...the maggots finished off. Nothing alive was ever cast in there. To a Jew it meant having no memorial tomb from which to be resurrected. They understood what Jesus meant.

The "lake of fire" mentioned in the Revelation was not a place of conscious torment either. It is rightly called "the second death" because unlike the first death, there is no way out of this place. It too means everlasting death.

God is not a fiend....he does not need to torture anyone. What would be the point? Punishment was always meant to lead to repentance...it was never meted out just for the sake of it.



Those who fail to comply with the commands of God and the teachings of his Christ, will undergo everlasting punishment....but it is everlasting death....nothing more. The highest penalty a person could suffer under the law was death. There was no torture or confinement under hard labor ever meted out to Jewish offenders under God's law. So why should we expect God to transgress his own standards of justice and punish the wicked eternally, for a short lifetime of sin? The punishment is contrary to Jehovah's perfect justice.

Those who stole worked to compensate their victims...those who committed capital offences, suffered the death penalty, regardless of how repentant they were. Their repentance was something that counted at their resurrection, when even the "unrighteous" are raised with the "righteous". (John 5:28, 29) The wicked can expect to sleep in death forever. Only Jehovah and his son know who they are. We are not their judges.

The several verses that I referenced never mentioned Gehenna as a picture of the final state of the lost. What is clear from these verses is the tenses of the verbs are continuous and that the subjects in the context are conscious. Meaning that the duration of damnation is as everlasting as the duration of redemption and those are equally aware in both. The punishment is eternal because the sins of those condemned have not and will never be paid for before the Eternal, Holy, and Just God. Are souls annihilated (destroyed)? or forever asleep? It is neither. Your definition of death is incorrect. Physical death is separation of the soul from the body. Spiritual death (the second death) is separation of the soul from God. However you stated "There is no teaching of an immortal soul in the Bible." therefore according to your position the "Blessed hope" is that all, whether saved or not, will be evaporated.

 

[jeager106]

The bible is quite clear about hell being a real place where people are punished forever. The only way you can deny this is to ignore what was plainly written in the bible and taught by Jesus himself. By saying there is no hell where eternal punishment is dished out is basically deviating from the scriptures and going into "Imma gonna make up my own religion" territory.

Matthew 25:46 “And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

Luke 16:22 "And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
23And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
24And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
25But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.
26And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.
27Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:
28For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.
29Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
30And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
31And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."

Student of the Bible vs. people who read the Bible.
Bible students know how to recognize a lesson in parable and a lesson to be taken literally.

Take your time, read and digest this:
The Rich Man and Lazarus | Amazing Facts
You will come to understand HOW the Bible makes meaning.
What you quoted isn't at all a story about some rich dude and some poor guy.
Study, versus read.