Women Liberating Themselves from Liberation

[Alceste]

Nobody is imposing it on anyone. Neither will women rights ever be revoked or "voted out". You are all being paranoid. Yeah I am sure you do not want to deny them the right to live as they choose as long as it is a lifestyle you approve of? Sound familiar? Your no better than anyone who wants to deny equal rights to homosexuals.

Don't be stupid. If you'd read the thread you would be aware nobody has any problem with the way they choose to live: it is their mission to deny this freedom to others we all object to.

 

[Humanistheart]

Maybe you guys have moved on from this part of the discussion, but what is wrong with feminists advocating causes that will benefit them??

It's wrong when they adovate causes to the point that their rights are above others.

Why does supporting women's rights make a man emasculated or lose dignity?

It's the word feminists. Calling a man a word related to fiminine... put it together.

 

[Humanistheart]

A woman can't kill a child, either. They can terminate a fetus. Men can't, because they're incapable of carrying a fetus. When they get that figured out, they can get abortions, too.

Saying a fetus isn't a child is like saying an infant isn't a child. Their terms which reffer to age.

 

[Enoch07]

Don't be stupid. If you'd read the thread you would be aware nobody has any problem with the way they choose to live: it is their mission to deny this freedom to others we all object to.

You are just using that lame excuse to justify your argument. How could a handful of women deny or revoke the rights of others?

 

[Alceste]

You are just using that lame excuse to justify your argument. How could a handful of women deny or revoke the rights of others?

Whether they can or can't is immaterial: the fact is that this is their goal, which is why they are being criticized.

Besides, wackos like these vote. Their "movement" (that is, the wider fundie wacko movement of which they are a part) is responsible for legislation like Prop 8, which limits the freedom of others to live as they choose. So they are hypocrites.

 

[Enoch07]

Whether they can or can't is immaterial: the fact is that this is their goal, which is why they are being criticized.

If it is immaterial then why is it an issue. Call them hypocrites all you want, but don't say that they are trying to deny the rights of others when you know it is immaterial.

Besides, wackos like these vote. Their "movement" (that is, the wider fundie wacko movement of which they are a part) is responsible for legislation like Prop 8, which limits the freedom of others to live as they choose. So they are hypocrites.

So that is why you are against these women. Because some of them denied your rights. Yes some of them are hypocrites, but then so is anyone who wants equal rights for gays but opposes these women. Either you are for civil rights or you are not. Either everyone is equal or not.

 

[Alceste]

If it is immaterial then why is it an issue. Call them hypocrites all you want, but don't say that they are trying to deny the rights of others when you know it is immaterial.

It's not immaterial to them - they think they can do it, and they're going to try, and the way they vote and lobby has an impact on the freedom of others to live as they choose. Prop 8 is only one example. So, they're hypocrites.

So that is why you are against these women. Because some of them denied your rights. Yes some of them are hypocrites, but then so is anyone who wants equal rights for gays but opposes these women. Either you are for civil rights or you are not. Either everyone is equal or not.

Poppycock. 1. I live in Canada, where homosexuals already have equal rights. 2. I'm not gay. I'm against them because they're hypocrites: They want to demonstrate their freedom to live as they choose while denying the right of others to live differently. They're against civil rights. Therefore, I'm against them.

 

[Enoch07]

They want to demonstrate their freedom to live as they choose while denying the right of others to live differently. They're against civil rights. Therefore, I'm against them.

If that is how you truly feel then you are not better than they are. Equal rights for all sometimes means equal rights for people who disagree with you. If you cannot support the equal rights for the opposition then you do not believe in true equality.

 

[Alceste]

If that is how you truly feel then you are not better than they are. Equal rights for all sometimes means equal rights for people who disagree with you. If you cannot support the equal rights for the opposition then you do not believe in true equality.

Are you being thick on purpose? I do not support their efforts to attempt to curtail the rights of others. That's it, that's all.

I'm not replying any more unless your next post displays some grasp, however tenuous, of what I've just said.

 

[Nanda]

Nobody is imposing it on anyone. Neither will women rights ever be revoked or "voted out". You are all being paranoid.

I'm not paranoid about this. I can't really see it gaining any serious ground - too many women like being in control of their own lives. As for those who want to live that way, again, I don't really care, as long as they aren't imposing it on others.

Yeah I am sure you do not want to deny them the right to live as they choose as long as it is a lifestyle you approve of? Sound familiar? Your no better than anyone who wants to deny equal rights to homosexuals.

You have no basis for these comments based on anything I've said. In fact, I've said the opposite of what you're accusing me of several times in this thread - more evidence that you haven't really read it.

 

[Nanda]

It's wrong when they adovate causes to the point that their rights are above others.

You keep harping on that same point, for which you have no evidence. Why?

It's the word feminists. Calling a man a word related to fiminine... put it together.

"Feminist - of or relating to or advocating equal rights for women" (dictionary.com)

No reason why that can't be a man.

 

[Nanda]

Saying a fetus isn't a child is like saying an infant isn't a child. Their terms which reffer to age.

No. An infant can live outside of it's mother. A fetus can not. But this is really a different arguement for a different thread - there are plenty of abortion threads on RF already, so if you want to debate the point, you should take it there.

 

[Alceste]

"Feminist - of or relating to or advocating equal rights for women" (dictionary.com)

No reason why that can't be a man.

Actually, in the "are you a feminist" quiz thread I couldn't help noticing the men are generally scoring higher than the women. Higher than me anyway. I faltered on the "paying for dinner" question - that cost me points.

 

[Nanda]

I think men who call themselves feminists are secure enough in their own masculinity that they don't see the word itself as a threat to their identity.

 

[Papersock]

It's wrong when they adovate causes to the point that their rights are above others.

Ok. But feminists are not doing that. They promote equal rights. Male and female equality.

It's the word feminists. Calling a man a word related to fiminine... put it together.

Calling a man a feminist makes him feminine? Is that what you're saying? Since feminism is about promoting equal rights for women, I don't see how that follows. It doesn't really have anything to do with a man's masculinity. If a man believes that being masculine means being dominant over women, than it's the man who has a problem, I think.

 

[Alceste]

I think men who call themselves feminists are secure enough in their own masculinity that they don't see the word itself as a threat to their identity.

Yeah - I find it very hot, too. I don't think I've ever been attracted to a guy who did not believe in the equality of the sexes. Except one Irish guy who didn't think girls should swear, but he had other... attributes. Like that accent. :drool:

 

[Papersock]

Actually, in the "are you a feminist" quiz thread I couldn't help noticing the men are generally scoring higher than the women. Higher than me anyway. I faltered on the "paying for dinner" question - that cost me points.

Oh, neat. I am 98% feminist, according to that quiz.

 

[Nanda]

Yeah - I find it very hot, too. I don't think I've ever been attracted to a guy who did not believe in the equality of the sexes.

Yeah, that's a deal breaker. HUGE turnoff.

 

[Alceste]

Yeah, that's a deal breaker. HUGE turnoff.

Yep, just says "I've got some neurotic issues vis a vis my manhood" to me, loud and clear.

 

[Aquitaine]

Where's this quiz and how do I take it?