Would You Leave Christians to Go to Hell?

[Subhankar Zac]

A lot of effort.

No. Just roll up your sleeves and do it yourself with whatever people (humans, nonhumans, etc) are available. Much evil is here just because of the status quo, so the only way you might reach the hardcore evil people is to SHOW them the "kingdom", much like how the $15/hour debate is only useful if someone is actually doing it so that the results can be studied. Let those who thrive in more loving circumstances survive and let the evil status quo people die out.

Sometimes you just have to have the proverbial brick hit you in the head.

Wouldn't try to reach them all. I would focus on "grassroots" and change things from there. If you have a vat of blue liquid and need red to make it purple and can't afford red, just crowdfund red droplets and slowly but surely, you will get purple.


I think God invented youtube and social media to help weed out the Darwin Award nominees.


While context most likely refers to Jews not accepting Christianity, I think Christianity should do well to remember that God is more than willing to invite the "rabble" to the feast if everyone else treats Him like crap. I feel God is far more willing to have atheists, satanists, and others in heaven than self-righteous hypocrites.

"I can make butt kissers out of rocks" -- God, via John the Baptist


In the ancient world, most countries got large influxes of cash by warring. The military still seems to think that's profitable, when economic diplomacy is more profitable. Got to have living customers to buy stuff, after all.


It is said his sheep will know his voice, but I'm afraid they'll be the first to pop a cap in his head.


Alternatively, you could close access to the roof or window. That doesn't involve hitting anyone. There also ways to restrain that doesn't require hitting.


Cruelty is the sign of the intellectually lazy.


So you are saying he was too cowardly to strike her himself?

I didn't realize the Prophet Muhammad was no better than *shudders* Kirk Cameron.


Or you can man up and realize she may have a valid point and you don't bruise a woman who only bruised your fragile ego.

Seriously, Islam has no monopoly on arrogance and chauvinism to be sure, but it could use some classes in manhood. The rational have no such need of barbarism.

True, but only for a few times... If they do not wish to listen, then no point of speaking.
And as a friendly advice, talking to Jabar is making 30 loops at once.
He's the new assistant of Allah and the inly truthful person to exist on the planet. Apparently, Islam prohibits everything the Quran permits.
So, to save time try not to interact with him. A greater troll might not possibly exist on this forum.

 

[Pudding]

Say you're Christ, you come back and find the warnings you gave of the deception weren't clear enough; so when you come back, you find that Christianity is basically the same as the Pharisees were teaching, written by Pharisees, and they're not smart enough to recognize they're following the lie....

Now how far would you go trying to help a group of people who contradict what you said, claim to follow you, yet show themselves to be hypocrites, and basically are facing the other way....

• What effort would you put in?
• Is it worth it to get a load of people to understand, when they've chosen to go the other way?
  
• Even though the text doesn't allocate for you to go and change them all, would you for the sake of the greater good, that it is an unfair deception, and they're just naive in many ways?
• What method would you use to reach them all, when clearly you telling them all they're deceived, will cause animosity, and its doubtful many will even accept it?
• 

Cannot imagine the situation i'm Jesus christ who voluntarily follow or is a part of an immoral, illogical, egotistical dictator God.

If i'm christ, then i'll not follow that immoral God, maybe i'll preach to God and ask him to repent his sins as he commited according to the bible OT/NT, stop playing inappropriate religion test or heaven king or ambiguous revelation or prophet or eternity burning hell game, stop pestering/harming non-follower.

 

[ak.yonathan]

I don't think that it's because those who profess to be Christian cannot understand His message. Oh they can understand it alright, it's just that they can't accept it to be true so they make it into what they think it should be, not what it really is.

 

[wizanda]

Jesus didn't ever care about getting across a concise message to the upcoming generations.

We've got multiple accounts of some of his parables, his warnings are clear in all 3 of the synoptic gospels; the problem comes due to additional text that is easily noticeable as forgeries, yet people have followed the forgeries, rather then the account.

If this were to happen then wouldn't all the Christians just give up their false interpretations and listen to whatever Jesus said?

The problem is Christianity is built upon the false bits: John, Paul and Simon the stone (petros), and so many Christians don't believe in Yeshua; they believe in a Pharisaic ideology that he came as a sin sacrifice.

It is also possible that the reason the 3 testimonies in question are close is because one of them came first and the other two are derived from it.

That theory doesn't make sense, there are not all matching parables in all 3 gospels, each has different grammatical knowledge and wording; so they're clearly by 3 authors, with 3 different accounts.

If i'm christ, then i'll not follow that immoral God, maybe i'll preach to God

Tried that already, yet the snare has been set, the people have been snared; now it's your choice if you're going to do something useful with them being snared or wait for Judgement day.

I don't think that it's because those who profess to be Christian cannot understand His message. Oh they can understand it alright, it's just that they can't accept it to be true so they make it into what they think it should be, not what it really is.

Christianity is established on John, Paul and Simon the stone (petros), these 3 frogs are all false; so within it, Christians are just blind sheep who follow what they're told without questioning it first.

Wouldn't try to reach them all. I would focus on "grassroots" and change things from there.

Now that would sound a good suggestion; yet having been online the last 12 years speaking with grassroots, they seem to be a big part of the problem....

They're sheep who've been blindly led by wolfs, so when you try and show them true pastures, they've been taught that is a trap, whereas the rotten food they've been eating, they've been taught is the 'good food'.

So if we could make a larger group of reasoning people, then maybe they might listen to a consensus view.

While context most likely refers to Jews not accepting Christianity

Jews are closer to the truth, than Christians, at least they don't accept the iniquity; yet they're also idly standing by allowing Christians to fall in the pit, when they could act as a consensus view, and help over turn the lies, yet due to them prospering from it, not sure if they leave it there to suit their own agenda.

Which is where i try loads on the forum and other places, to get them to recognize what is going on; yet due to them feeling they're always persecuted, they fail to recognize that it is part of prophecy to make them priests unto the Gentiles, and not just eat their riches for free.

True, but only for a few times... If they do not wish to listen, then no point of speaking.

Thanks, Will try to take that on board, generally feel it is my fault, and haven't explained it well enough if people don't get it.

 

[Subhankar Zac]

Thanks, Will try to take that on board, generally feel it is my fault, and haven't explained it well enough if people don't get it.

It all depends what you preach.
True teachings ooze out of intelligence that is connected with the supreme and can bring peace, justice and could make one see that he himself is this indestructible, unborn and ever existing living being n not just the body.
Preaching about hell, heaven, true and false religion only advocates ego.
Often the actions we take, the results aren't according to them.
The best teaching for all mankind would be to revere his prescribed action without any expectation for the result or selfish motive.
That is the way to bring about bliss, removes ones evil qualities and see onself as one truly is.

 

[Koldo]

We've got multiple accounts of some of his parables, his warnings are clear in all 3 of the synoptic gospels; the problem comes due to additional text that is easily noticeable as forgeries, yet people have followed the forgeries, rather then the account.

If I had bothered to write my very own book none of this would have happened.
I have had nearly two thousand years to fix this mess, and yet I have done nothing meaningful.
I have only myself to blame.

 

[wizanda]

I have had nearly two thousand years to fix this mess, and yet I have done nothing meaningful.

Actually everything that was prophesied fits within that written context, the only issue is the hypocrites following the lies before truth....

Which was also all prophesied, so it is only the bit of it being fair on them; everything else is as expected by the prophets.

 

[The_Fisher_King]

That theory doesn't make sense, there are not all matching parables in all 3 gospels, each has different grammatical knowledge and wording; so they're clearly by 3 authors, with 3 different accounts.

I'm not saying they didn't have separate authors. The two later authors could quite easily have taken the earlier account and developed it further for their own ends, adding here or taking away there as they saw fit. An alternative possibility is that all three gospels were independently based on an earlier (unreliable) source, each having their own embellishments, which, together with their authors' different voices, would account for the differences between them.

 

[wizanda]

An alternative possibility is that all three gospels were independently based on an earlier (unreliable) source

Again it doesn't make sense, that would mean we have one much larger unreliable source, with bits taken out of it by all three...

The parables character match throughout the synoptic gospels, with the same style of cleverly interlinking passages with the Tanakh.

The problem is the gospel of John's 'jesus', which completely contradicts the synoptic gospels character of Yeshua.

 

[The_Fisher_King]

Again it doesn't make sense, that would mean we have one much larger unreliable source, with bits taken out of it by all three...

I don't see how what I've said doesn't make sense. Both of my suggestions are plausible. Whether or not they are true is a different matter, of course.

 

[wizanda]

I don't see how what I've said doesn't make sense.

It's the Q hypothesis, that i find doesn't make sense.

 

[The_Fisher_King]

It's the Q hypothesis, that i find doesn't make sense.

Well, as you may well know, there are a variety of possible solutions that have been put forward to solve the so-called 'Synoptic Problem'. Q is part of several of these. And of course 'Q', if it ever existed, may not even have been one source, but several. There may have been several sources on which the synoptic gospels drew, both oral and written, including of course each other. I should say that I am not arguing against Yeshua's existence or the truthful basis of a number of the stories that have been passed down; I would never argue such a thing. I was just curious to know your take on this.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

On second thought, if I didn't bother to correct things in 2000 years might as well see how things play out...

It has been more than 2,000 years since the first prophecy of Genesis 3:15
Jesus proved to be that Genesis promised ' seed ' (offspring) who will bring Peace on Earth among men of goodwill.
If God would have already acted sooner we would never have had the opportunity to be born.
God purposes that we all be descendants of Adam and Eve - Genesis 1:28
Things are playing out, so to speak, showing that mankind can Not successfully govern himself - Ecclesiastes 8:9; Jeremiah 10:23
We need someone to step in, and according to Scripture, God will have Jesus step in to usher in global Peace on Earth.
The words from Jesus' mouth will do away with the wicked - Isaiah 11:3-4; Revelation 19:14-16; Psalms 92:7
The righteous will remain on Earth - Proverbs 2:21-22; Psalms 37:11; Psalms 37:29; Matthew 5:5.
That is how things will play out as we will start to see at the soon coming ' time of separation ' on earth as mentioned at Matthew 25:31-33,37
We are nearing the ' final signal ', so to speak, of 1 Thessalonians 5:2-3 when ' they' (powers that be ) will be saying, "Peace and Security "
That will be the precursor to the coming great tribulation of Revelation 7:14 before Jesus ushers in global Peace on Earth among men of goodwill.

 

[BenTheBeliever]

Say you're Christ, you come back and find the warnings you gave of the deception weren't clear enough; so when you come back, you find that Christianity is basically the same as the Pharisees were teaching, written by Pharisees, and they're not smart enough to recognize they're following the lie....

Now how far would you go trying to help a group of people who contradict what you said, claim to follow you, yet show themselves to be hypocrites, and basically are facing the other way....

• What effort would you put in?
• Is it worth it to get a load of people to understand, when they've chosen to go the other way?
  
• Even though the text doesn't allocate for you to go and change them all, would you for the sake of the greater good, that it is an unfair deception, and they're just naive in many ways?
• What method would you use to reach them all, when clearly you telling them all they're deceived, will cause animosity, and its doubtful many will even accept it?
• 

It is all about salvation. If people don't believe in Christ and have salvation then they won't make it to Heaven. I would not change that if I was God. Just like God does I would let people chose to believe or not. Free will

 

[Sand Dancer]

Say you're Christ, you come back and find the warnings you gave of the deception weren't clear enough; so when you come back, you find that Christianity is basically the same as the Pharisees were teaching, written by Pharisees, and they're not smart enough to recognize they're following the lie....

That's assuming they would recognize Jesus anyway, which they probably would not. He couldn't be a brown guy wearing long hair and a robe.

 

[RedDragon94]

The problem is Christianity is built upon the false bits: John, Paul and Simon the stone (petros), and so many Christians don't believe in Yeshua; they believe in a Pharisaic ideology that he came as a sin sacrifice.

I think the Pharisees would've been on your side. After all, their view of salvation was entirely works based. Why do you think Jesus died?

If Jesus is God and he knows all things why would he choose people to write the Bible who didn't know what they were talking about?

 

[wizanda]

If people don't believe in Christ and have salvation then they won't make it to Heaven.

Sorry this is the point, the the text doesn't state that; Yeshua was saying simply by doing the work of God, you'd be following his teachings, and you'd be accepted in Heaven...

Believing in jesus comes from the false gospel of John, and Paul... So currently by doing so, you prove you don't believe in Yeshua, and are thus not accepted in Heaven.

That's assuming they would recognize Jesus anyway

You'd hope they'd recognize the character; yet due to the misrepresentation in the false texts, most people don't know him, and yet think they follow him.

I think the Pharisees would've been on your side. After all, their view of salvation was entirely works based.

Interesting point; yet whereas the Pharisees were basing there idea on works of the Law, as in fulfilling all parts of their traditions, Yeshua was emphasizing helping humanity, as being the work of God, and not religious ritual.

Whereas Paul the Pharisee dismantled Yeshua's teachings, and reestablished that religious ritualism is more important then doing works, as people might boast about being a righteous human being.

Why do you think Jesus died?

Yeshua died, because the Sanhedrin murdered him....

Then by this declaration it ended the Abrahamic covenant as explained in Zechariah 11, by them paying 30 pieces of silver for his head, and putting it into the potters field in the house of Israel.

By his death, the just shall live by his faith though everything is not as it seems; and it helps establish who the workers of iniquity are, so they can all be removed on Judgement day.

Because of fulfilling prophecy until death, Yeshua is given an inheritance to share with the strong in faith; basically he was given the guest list for the Messianic age.

why would he choose people to write the Bible who didn't know what they were talking about?

Because as the prophets state it is a snare to establish who the workers of iniquity are; so everything has been purposely written as a morality text, just most people assume the deception happens from elsewhere, and don't start by questioning within.

 

[BenTheBeliever]

Wizanda you are wrong. It is not by works we are saved. It's by grace. It also makes clear only way to heaven is through the only begotten son of God. Who is Christ.

 

[wizanda]

It is not by works we are saved.

According to Yeshua it is by works you're saved; Paul is Anti-Christ's teachings.

It also makes clear only way to heaven is through the only begotten son of God.

According to Yeshua those who do the work of the father, are his brothers and sisters, so there isn't only one son; the false gospel of John is misleading you with the 'only begotten son', and there being only one way to Heaven, etc.

 

[BenTheBeliever]

According to Yeshua it is by works you're saved; Paul is Anti-Christ's teachings.

According to Yeshua those who do the work of the father, are his brothers and sisters, so there isn't only one son; the false gospel of John is misleading you with the 'only begotten son', and there being only one way to Heaven, etc.

What you are saying not only makes no sense but sounds cultist. We are saved by grace. By the blood of Christ who sets us free