You don't show respect for my religion!

[FlyingTeaPot]

[youtube]tg0cGEUthxc[/youtube]
YouTube - Awkward Greeting

 

[Revoltingest]

Its like when you meet a girl at a bar, do you kiss her on the cheek or hug her or shake her hand? AWKWARD!

Just do what I'd do....look down....stare at shoes.....if you feel really brave, then stare at her shoes.
Then try a conversation starter....."So, are you as peeved as I am about Triumph using both British Standard & SAE standard fasteners on their 1970s machines?"

 

[FlyingTeaPot]

Just do what I'd do....look down....stare at shoes.....if you feel really brave, then stare at her shoes.
Then try a conversation starter....."So, are you as peeved as I am about Triumph using both British Standard & SAE standard fasteners on their 1970s machines?"

No faster way to get in a girls' pants! :yes:

 

[lunakilo]

Its like when you meet a girl at a bar, do you kiss her on the cheek or hug her or shake her hand? AWKWARD!

Right, men and women do act differently. And people from different cultures act differently.

Around here there would be no kissing. But since I am a woman I would be free to give a hug if I chose to. And I probably would unless it was a person I had never met before (or didn't like). A man probably has a bigger problem figuring out what is apropriate in a specific situation.

No its not, you just think so because you probably completely misunderstand why is that done.

Its supposed to be part of the modesty thing. Conservative people, or strict people sometimes think like that.

You may be right.

It is just that is it is the complete opposite of what is the cultural norm.
If you refuse to shake someones hand you are basically telling them that you are their enemy. Not a good starting point in most situations

 

[Revoltingest]

Right, men and women do act differently. And people from different cultures act differently.

Around here there would be no kissing. But since I am a woman I would be free to give a hug if I chose to. And I probably would unless it was a person I had never met before (or didn't like). A man probably has a bigger problem figuring out what is apropriate in a specific situation.

Easy....just avoid all physical contact.
Submit only if females insist upon invading personal space....then just remain motionless.
Works every time!

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Just do what I'd do....look down....stare at shoes.....if you feel really brave, then stare at her shoes.
Then try a conversation starter....."So, are you as peeved as I am about Triumph using both British Standard & SAE standard fasteners on their 1970s machines?"

The 1970s? I thought they all got rid of those by the mid 60s?

Fun fact: when I marshal at vintage race weekends, they tell us that if we find so much as a nut or bolt on track that weekend, instead of kicking it into the grass, we should pick it up and hand it in to race control, because the driver who lost it will be very, very happy to get it back.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

No faster way to get in a girls' pants! :yes:

Among the women I hang around with, that's probably right. :yes:

 

[Revoltingest]

The 1970s? I thought they all got rid of those by the mid 60s?
Fun fact: when I marshal at vintage race weekends, they tell us that if we find so much as a nut or bolt on track that weekend, instead of kicking it into the grass, we should pick it up and hand it in to race control, because the driver who lost it will be very, very happy to get it back.

I'm not sure of the year, since I had multiple Triumph bikes, but one year I needed
my British Standard, British Association, metric & SAE wrenches all on one bike!
Btw, Snap-On rules! But I also like Bedford, Williams & Blue Point (Snap-On brand).

Is all this gearhead talk turning on the gals in this thread?

 

[FlyingTeaPot]

Easy....just avoid all physical contact.
Submit only if females insist upon invading personal space....then just remain motionless.
Works every time!

That's what I do, too! :run:

 

[Badran]

You may be right.

It is just that is it is the complete opposite of what is the cultural norm.

It is indeed, thats why a lot of people will get offended by it, that doesn't mean they had a right to however.

If you refuse to shake someones hand you are basically telling them that you are their enemy. Not a good starting point in most situations

I agree that it usually wont' be a good starting point, however i don't think its telling them that you're their enemy, or anything along those lines.

You didn't refuse to greet them, you just refused to greet them in a certain way because of your religion. If they take it that way, that its a sign of enmity, thats their fault and their fault alone.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I agree that it usually wont' be a good starting point, however i don't think its telling them that you're their enemy, or anything along those lines.

You didn't refuse to greet them, you just refused to greet them in a certain way because of your religion. If they take it that way, that its a sign of enmity, thats their fault and their fault alone.

I agree.

There's a discrepancy of cultural language. It'd be like an Anglophone getting offended by a Francophone talking about seals.

 

[Penumbra]

I've also stopped bowing my head for grace at dinners with my wife's family. I'm sure that her sisters don't appreciate this - they've scolded their kids at the table before for not bowing their heads for grace, so I wouldn't be surprised if they consider me a bad influence, but I've arrived at a point where I don't really care. I figure that there's nothing wrong with me being an atheist, so why should I hide it? I don't push it on people, but I'm not going to mislead people that I'm something I'm not.

I do the same thing, and it can be awkward.

I was in a social situation once where, with people of a variety of religions at a meal, a person took it upon herself to tell everyone to say grace before the meal, asked everyone to bow their heads, and she led it by talking about Jesus and so forth. Most people bowed their head (generally being either Christian or agnostic-but-default-Christians, while me and the Hindu at the table just kind of looked at each other and smiled about the situation.

You are very good at saying things that make me remember stuff.

I had happily forgot about Asmaa Abdol-Hamid.
She is a danish politician from an immigrant family.
She became famous (in Denmark that is ) when she refused to shake a male colleague's hand, instead putting her hand on her heart in greetin.

People where VERY offended by this, myself included.
I am at this moment contemplating whether I had the right to be or not.

I'm curious- what about this offended you?

 

[lunakilo]

I'm curious- what about this offended you?

Well first of all, as I wrote in a previous post, not wanting to shake hands with someone is from my point of view basically telling them that you are their enemy. So not wanting to shake hands with someone and then expecting that person to sit down and talk with you about politics is just ... I don't know what it is, I lack words. I may find some when a find my jaw. I dropped it on the floor you see.

Second, not wanting to shake a persons hand because of that persons gender seems sexist to me. I generally don't like sexists.

 

[Penumbra]

Well first of all, as I wrote in a previous post, not wanting to shake hands with someone is from my point of view basically telling them that you are their enemy. So not wanting to shake hands with someone and then expecting that person to sit down and talk with you about politics is just ... I don't know what it is, I lack words. I may find some when a find my jaw. I dropped it on the floor you see.

Second, not wanting to shake a persons hand because of that persons gender seems sexist to me. I generally don't like sexists.

But if you know that in some cultures, it's considered inappropriate for people of different genders to touch each other, then wouldn't that dissolve your notion that they must necessarily think of the other as an enemy, or as sexist, if they are not shaking hands? The person may simply be following their culture.

I mean, I feel that the concept of not touching the other gender is rather ungrounded and unreasonable, but I don't see why it's something to get upset or offended over.

 

[lunakilo]

But if you know that in some cultures, it's considered inappropriate for people of different genders to touch each other, then wouldn't that dissolve your notion that they must necessarily think of the other as an enemy, or as sexist, if they are not shaking hands? The person may simply be following their culture.

Yes and no

At the time I actually had no idea that there where cultures like that.
Also she was not some tourist that happened to be passing by, she had lived in this country for many years and knew what the cultural norm was, but chose not to follow it.

Maybe I am ignorant for not knowing about her culture, but this was a totally unexpected action to me.
And, at the risk of sounding like a xenophobic nationalist, the culture of my country is not like this, why should I accept her culture over mine? Sould she not adapt to 'my culture'?

I mean, I feel that the concept of not touching the other gender is rather ungrounded and unreasonable, but I don't see why it's something to get upset or offended over.

Mostly I think it was the fact that it was so unexpected, and that the only reason most natives could see as a reason to act that way would be to show contempt.

 

[Penumbra]

Yes and no

At the time I actually had no idea that there where cultures like that.
Also she was not some tourist that happened to be passing by, she had lived in this country for many years and knew what the cultural norm was, but chose not to follow it.

Maybe I am ignorant for not knowing about her culture, but this was a totally unexpected action to me.
And, at the risk of sounding like a xenophobic nationalist, the culture of my country is not like this, why should I accept her culture over mine? Sould she not adapt to 'my culture'?

I don't think people should necessarily adopt to the culture they move to in all ways.

It's important for people moving to a new land to learn how to live in that culture, and to learn the language that people speak. But my opinion on this whole topic of religious respect is that I don't think people have a right to not be offended. We don't need to act in ways to ensure we don't offend anybody, although we should show good character as we see it at all times. It's up to others whether they are offended or not.

Mostly I think it was the fact that it was so unexpected, and that the only reason most natives could see as a reason to act that way would be to show contempt.

Then maybe this is a good exercise for the natives to understand the reasons behind the behavior, and to judge them for what they are rather than what they thought they were, and to avoid showing contempt if it is undue.

 

[lunakilo]

Then maybe this is a good exercise for the natives to understand the reasons behind the behavior, and to judge them for what they are rather than what they thought they were, and to avoid showing contempt if it is undue.

Maybe so.
Maybe the silly natives need some education

 

[Penumbra]

Maybe so.
Maybe the silly natives need some education

Well I'm not quite saying that, I'm just saying that it's usually best to judge things based on what they are rather than what they would mean to us.

 

[lunakilo]

Well I'm not quite saying that, I'm just saying that it's usually best to judge things based on what they are rather than what they would mean to us.

And I am saying that people have a tendency to think that everybody else think the same way they do. But that is not how the world works.

 

[Badran]

not wanting to shake hands with someone is from my point of view basically telling them that you are their enemy.

Well, if you think about it, everybody can make up their own interpretation of what a certain thing means and get offended as much as they like, or they can actually learn why its done, and react based on that. Which is better?

Second, not wanting to shake a persons hand because of that persons gender seems sexist to me.

Once again you certainly can keep on taking things based on what they seem to you, or you can actually know what they are instead. Why take things as what they seem and not what they actually are?

she had lived in this country for many years and knew what the cultural norm was, but chose not to follow it.

I'm pretty sure you're not one of the people who think that their cultural norms have some special value to it so that other people have to follow it.

She doesn't have to conform to the culture she lives in. A little is needed though no doubt, but this isn't necessarily one of those needed things.

And, at the risk of sounding like a xenophobic nationalist, the culture of my country is not like this, why should I accept her culture over mine?

You're not accepting her culture over yours. You're not asked to not shake men's hands as well.

Add to this, like i mentioned this is not just a cultural thing, and possibly not at all. I said its a religious thing from her point view, its supposed to be part of her modesty.

You disagree with that idea, so do i, but i don't get offended simply when people do things i disagree with. Or things i'm not used to.