Zionism

[Sha'irullah]

Ah, you must be one of those who think the genetic and scientific data is all a big Zionist conspiracy?

Tis true. Jews control everything because it is quite obvious a small community of 13 million control all 7.5 billion people in the world. It is very logical and you are denying it

 

[Shermana]

Tis true. Jews control everything because it is quite obvious a small community of 13 million control all 7.5 billion people in the world. It is very logical and you are denying it

Well.....when you're statistically the highest I.Q.-ranking people on Earth who dominate math and science, it's not that hard to pull off.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

Conquered the land and subjugated its inhabitants. I find it funny you find barbarism appropriate and your an atheist. Most atheist try placing themselves on a pillar of ethics so as not to be shot down but theists for the lack of divine morality.

I'm not most atheists, I'm my own man. I don't believe in morality; just individual principles, hence the I Self Lord And Master. I decide what I believe to be right or wrong; anything I want will only be attained through what I do to get it.

But getting back on topic why do you think Filistinians have a right to the land?

I don't, and I've said this more than once.

Would you not be complaining if your land was taken over and you forcefully removed?

I wouldn't complain, I would act when it happened and probably die in the process. I wouldn't support my descendants' claims to anything that belonged to me centuries ago but was taken by someone else either. If they want what was mine, they would have to fight for it. My possessions wouldn't belong to them by right any more than Israel belongs to the Jews by right.

Your lack of empathy is frightening and I myself am generally apathetic.

Not the first time I've heard this. Not the first time I've heard it this week...

Filistinian butchers have no right to Israel the same way I have no right to your property.

I agree with this statement, but I believe it applies to the Jews as well; they have no right to Israel either.

We do own land as human beings sadly and it is heavily regulated. We can own anything we maintain including geographical territories.

I agree with this statement as well. The Jews do currently own Israel, but that is because they conquered it, not because they had some God-given right to it.

You condoning of theft is bizarre.

You say theft, I say spoils of war. I respect supremacy in combat, not pretentious claims of entitlement.

 

[Shermana]

You say theft, I say spoils of war. I respect supremacy in combat, not pretentious claims of entitlement.

I agree 100%. What I think you don't understand however is that Zionism is not about being "entitled" to the land. It's a philosophy of cementing the taking of that land for the Jewish people, whether through legal and peaceful purchase or defending it and making gains with tanks and bullets.

If you want to talk about those who DO feel "entitled" to the land and have no respect for the reality of might makes right, look no further than the Palestinian nationalists.

 

[Agnostisch]

I don't think Jordan should have been give to the Palestinians, because native Jordanians still resent that move.

 

[Shermana]

I don't think Jordan should have been give to the Palestinians, because native Jordanians still resent that move.

Who cares what who resents? Fair is fair and what's right is right. If the majority don't respect what's fair and right, let them make right with might, and if they can't make right with might, that's fair and right.

Besides, why should Jordan be given to the Hashemites to rule as their private fiefdom? Especially when the population is 80% "Palestinian"?

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

That is not what i'm saying. We don't have any rightful rights to anything but ourselves, if you didn't think you was so superior then everyone or everything, then you would quickly figure that out

That's what I've been saying the whole time... Nobody has a right to anything. What's yours is yours only as long as you can keep it. If you're going to argue with me you shouldn't do it by agreeing with me.

This planet isn't owned by humans and it will never be owned by humans.

Have we been conquered by aliens and I just don't know it yet?

The funny thing is, money as in paper money is an illusion

Try that one next time the rent is due...

Yes it does, if you didn't build the house that you live in, it doesn't belong to you. technically speaking in today's societies all houses under real estate belongs to the bank.

Not if you pay it off... You didn't build the computer you're using to so poorly argue your point; does it belong to the factory?

 

[Agnostisch]

If the Palestinians didn't start wars against Israel, they wouldn't lose land when they lost the wars they started. Pretty simple.

PS The "Palestine" map in 1946 doesn't refer to "Palestinian held land", it refers to British held land that was called "Palestine", in which Jews and Arabs alike were "Palestinians", do try not to be misled by such blatant mischaracterizations.

soon they are going to outnumber you so you'll have a Jewish state with a Jewish minority. It will leave you with the only option to become undemocratic for Israel to continue as a Jewish state.

 

[Shermana]

soon they are going to outnumber you so you'll have a Jewish state with a Jewish minority. It will leave you with the only option to become undemocratic for Israel to continue as a Jewish state.

Who cares about Democracy? The eventual solution is going to be a Constitutional One-state Confederation of individual Districts with unchangeable rules that guarantees Jewish dominance. If they call that Apartheid, oh well. Not like it's going to matter when it comes to actual issues.

Besides, they are NOT going to outnumber the Jews thanks to the Charedim and their rabbit-like breeding.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

I agree 100%. What I think you don't understand however is that Zionism is not about being "entitled" to the land. It's a philosophy of cementing the taking of that land for the Jewish people, whether through legal and peaceful purchase or defending it and making gains with tanks and bullets.

You're the first Zionist I've conversed with to phrase it this way. The others I've met would argue that the conflict shouldn't be going on at all; that the Palestinians should surrender without a fight because Israel belongs to the Jews by right. I find this to be an extremely pretentious claim, and get accused of anti-semitism every time I say so.

 

[Sha'irullah]

You say theft, I say spoils of war. I respect supremacy in combat, not pretentious claims of entitlement.

Well then what is your argument against Zionism? If you respect barbarism then I recommend Jews to go about slaughtering every Filistinian in a 400 miles radius and exterminate them. Seems fair

 

[Shermana]

You're the first Zionist I've conversed with to phrase it this way. The others I've met would argue that the conflict shouldn't be going on at all; that the Palestinians should surrender without a fight because Israel belongs to the Jews by right. I find this to be an extremely pretentious claim, and get accused of anti-semitism every time I say so.

There are a few others like me who value reality, realpolitik and honesty over dishonest pretensiousness, but they usually get demonized and villified to the point of obscurity. It takes real guts to stick up for the facts.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

There are a few others like me who value reality, realpolitik and honesty over dishonest pretensiousness, but they usually get demonized and villified to the point of obscurity. It takes real guts to stick up for the facts.

I like you.

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

Well then what is your argument against Zionism? If you respect barbarism then I recommend Jews to go about slaughtering every Filistinian in a 400 miles radius and exterminate them. Seems fair

My argument is against the entitlement, not the conquering. Don't say the land is yours by right, say it's yours because you took it.

 

[Agnostisch]

Who cares about Democracy? The eventual solution is going to be a Constitutional One-state Confederation of individual Districts with unchangeable rules that guarantees Jewish dominance. If they call that Apartheid, oh well. Not like it's going to matter when it comes to actual issues.

Besides, they are NOT going to outnumber the Jews thanks to the Charedim and their rabbit-like breeding.

You can't make that last so you are digging your own grave. Hey but it's your country so you are free to try it.

 

[Shermana]

You can't make that last so you are digging your own grave. Hey but it's your country so you are free to try it.

By all means explain in detail why that can't last, thanks.

What are you, Naturei Karta or something?

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

You can't make that last so you are digging your own grave. Hey but it's your country so you are free to try it.

I beg to differ. Israel is backed by the US, so any invasion of the land wouldn't last long at all.

 

[Sha'irullah]

My argument is against the entitlement, not the conquering. Don't say the land is yours by right, say it's yours because you took it.

Well then I am all for conquering but Filistinians make no such claim as they must make their religion seem peaceful. Filistinians have no ethnic ties to the land period so why do they claim such? Well to answer that it is mostly because medieval Islam encourages bold faced lying.

So are you really OK with millions of women and children getting murdered?

 

[Shermana]

Well then what is your argument against Zionism? If you respect barbarism then I recommend Jews to go about slaughtering every Filistinian in a 400 miles radius and exterminate them. Seems fair

It seems most of the world has great respect for Barbarism as long as its not Jews doing it.

 

[Shermana]

Well then I am all for conquering but Filistinians make no such claim as they must make their religion seem peaceful. Filistinians have no ethnic ties to the land period so why do they claim such? Well to answer that it is mostly because medieval Islam encourages bold faced lying.

So are you really OK with millions of women and children getting murdered?

No need to murder them, just conquer the Hashemite-fiefdom-of-Jordan that no one cares is the Monarchy's personal fiefdom and set up new towns and villages for them! There are less bloody solutions you know! Less.