By the way -- if you claim to be a Christian...

[3rdAngel]

LOL! More denial. No actual argument And where did I call God a liar?

There is no denial my side because I believe and follow what Gods Word says. Denial is what you choose to do by not believing God's Word. This is the same as calling God a liar. According to the scriptures denying Gods Word is called unbelief which scripture calls sin in Romans 14:23 and no unbelievers will enter the kingdom of heaven *John 3:36.

You did. I explained how and why you did. I never made such a claim. You keep calling him one when you claim that certain parts of the Bible are literally true. And your abuse of Romans 3 4 is a terrible abuse of the Bible. I posted a much longer segment that showed that. You have lost. You have abused your own Bible. By your poor standards there is no God. Do you want to see "proof" 2 Samuel 7 22 "there is no god". There you go, I did exactly what you did I quoted the Bible and disproved God. I can do that again and again. Next time you have to guess..And yes, you did abuse Romans 3

The rest of your post has no truth in it and simply makes no sense and does not respond to or address the post content you are responding to or any of the scriptures provided that are in disagreement with you. So we will agree to disagree. Sorry dear friend but I do not believe you.

Take Care.

 

[Windwalker]

Is the God you talk about as being with you saying that homosexuality is ok?

I'm talking about the only God there is. What on earth does your question have to do with anything? Are you obsessed with homosexuality?

Just as one point. When you were born, did you know about God? Hardly.

Of course. All children know God. "Except you become as a little child, you shall in no way enter the kingdom of God". Children are born pure of spirit and heart. But when they grow up and culture programs them with their BS, that's when they are taught start to hate each other, like hating homosexuals, as one example.

We weren't even able to feed ourselves or know which food to eat, we didn't have teeth or know how to cook or gather food. So we had to be taught.

We need to be taught to see others as the enemy. That's what causes us to separate from God.

 

[Windwalker]

Do they know what the Bible says?

No. And yet they know God.

 

[YoursTrue]

No. And yet they know God.

i wonder how would they describe him.

 

[Subduction Zone]

There is no denial my side because I believe and follow what Gods Word says. Denial is what you choose to do by not believing God's Word. This is the same as calling God a liar. According to the scriptures denying Gods Word is called unbelief which scripture calls sin in Romans 14:23 and no unbelievers will enter the kingdom of heaven *John 3:36.

You abused the Bible. You failed in your argument. You have been refuted. If not then I am justified to quote the Bible to "prove" that there is no God. You would not accept that and yet you continue to argue in the same way. That is a hypocritical act on your part.

The rest of your post has no truth in it and simply makes no sense and does not respond to or address the post content you are responding to or any of the scriptures provided that are in disagreement with you. So we will agree to disagree. Sorry dear friend but I do not believe you.

Take Care.

Of course course there was "truth". You really should not try to treat facts that you cannot deal with as "not the truth". You only make yourself look like the dishonest one when you do that.

We should probably try to focus on one part of this at a time since you have trouble dealing with multiple thoughts in a post.

Let's us start with your definition of "scripture". What is scripture? What is your evidence that supports your definition? Are you aware of the history of the Bible at all? I am pretty sure that the answer is no.

 

[YoursTrue]

If you are married to someone, did you have to read a book written about them in order to know them and what works and doesn't work with them, or did that come through living with them and engaging with them personally?

Conversely, if you were to only have read their bio on dating.com, could you claim you know them because you read about them online?

In reference to marrying someone, I would hope that a person would know quite a bit about who they're marrying. Their background, their tastes, their dislikes, what they do for a living, how they feel about children, society, religion and other such things.

 

[YoursTrue]

No. And yet they know God.

Anyway, I like Mark Twain. So far. i don't KNOW him, only what I've heard, but I look forward to meeting him in the resurrection. That is Mark Twain the person. Not another person who WAS supposedly Mark Twain. But Mark Twain. Maybe his name will be changed, I don't know yet.

 

[3rdAngel]

You abused the Bible. You failed in your argument. You have been refuted. If not then I am justified to quote the Bible to "prove" that there is no God. You would not accept that and yet you continue to argue in the same way. That is a hypocritical act on your part.

Of course course there was "truth". You really should not try to treat facts that you cannot deal with as "not the truth". You only make yourself look like the dishonest one when you do that.

We should probably try to focus on one part of this at a time since you have trouble dealing with multiple thoughts in a post.

Let's us start with your definition of "scripture". What is scripture? What is your evidence that supports your definition? Are you aware of the history of the Bible at all? I am pretty sure that the answer is no.

Yes you always make these false claims and accusations then when challenged you are unable to prove anything you say and run away from the discussion so please forgive me if I choose not to believe you.

Take Care

 

[Subduction Zone]

Yes you always make these false claims and accusations then when challenged you are unable to prove anything you say and run away from the discussion so please forgive me if I choose not to believe you.

Take Care

Oh my, so backwards. I showed how you were wrong by posting the source of one of your quotes that provided the context that it was not about the Bible at all. Why do you say such abysmally foolish things? Anyone can see how I posted the start of Romans 3 which was about circumcision. The phrase was about how God kept his word for the Jewish people. It was not saying that the Bible is true.

This is why you need to concentrate on one point at a time. You simply ignore corrections when you try to sling a whole load of garbage.

You quote mined the Bible.. if you get to quote mine it and try to inaccurately reinterpret it, then I get to do so too. By your own poor standards the Bible refutes God. I used your tactics to show that.. Am I claiming that the Bible refutes God? No, I am claiming that using that sort of tactic is incredibly dishonest and self defeating.

 

[Windwalker]

i wonder how would they describe him.

Generally as loving, and not harsh and judgmental of others. I would think anyway. Usually an idea of God as hating your enemies is merely a projection of one's own ego trying to inflate itself and make itself bigger. No, I'd say those that experience God generally find God loving.

 

[Windwalker]

In reference to marrying someone, I would hope that a person would know quite a bit about who they're marrying. Their background, their tastes, their dislikes, what they do for a living, how they feel about children, society, religion and other such things.

Do you think they came to the conclusion that they love them by reading a book written about them? Would that really tell them enough about them that they would want to be married to them? Or does wanting to get married have more to do with getting to know them through actual personal relationship with them, in person?

 

[Windwalker]

Anyway, I like Mark Twain. So far. i don't KNOW him, only what I've heard, but I look forward to meeting him in the resurrection. That is Mark Twain the person. Not another person who WAS supposedly Mark Twain. But Mark Twain. Maybe his name will be changed, I don't know yet.

Yes that's not knowing Mark Twain. That's just knowing about Mark Twain. To know Mark Twain, you'd have to spend some personal time with him. Same thing with reading about God in a book. That's not knowing God.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Anyway, I like Mark Twain. So far. i don't KNOW him, only what I've heard, but I look forward to meeting him in the resurrection. That is Mark Twain the person. Not another person who WAS supposedly Mark Twain. But Mark Twain. Maybe his name will be changed, I don't know yet.

He might even say that his name is Sam. Though he was rather bright. He could see through the God bull****.

 

[3rdAngel]

Oh my, so backwards. I showed how you were wrong by posting the source of one of your quotes that provided the context that it was not about the Bible at all. Why do you say such abysmally foolish things? Anyone can see how I posted the start of Romans 3 which was about circumcision. The phrase was about how God kept his word for the Jewish people. It was not saying that the Bible is true.

This is why you need to concentrate on one point at a time. You simply ignore corrections when you try to sling a whole load of garbage.

You quote mined the Bible.. if you get to quote mine it and try to inaccurately reinterpret it, then I get to do so too. By your own poor standards the Bible refutes God. I used your tactics to show that.. Am I claiming that the Bible refutes God? No, I am claiming that using that sort of tactic is incredibly dishonest and self defeating.

Yes you always make these false claims and accusations then when challenged you are unable to prove anything you say and run away from the discussion so please forgive me if I choose not to believe you. Lets talk more dear friend when you can prove what you say. You are simply projecting what you do to others in your posts. I think most people can see through your dishonesty as they have called you out in other threads here. I have never once claimed that the bible refutes God. That is simply you being dishonest. I have only ever provided scripture in our conversations that refute what you say about God and His Word. You have already been provided scripture proving what you say is not truthful and it is you who refuses correction. So we will agree to disagree. I hope only the best for you, but according to the scriptures walking a path of unbelief and sin will only lead us away from God and His Word into darkness waiting for Gods judgements, according to the scriptures in Hebrews 10:26-31.

Take care.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Yes you always make these false claims and accusations then when challenged you are unable to prove anything you say and run away from the discussion so please forgive me if I choose not to believe you. Lets talk more dear friend when you can prove what you say. You are simply projecting what you do to others in your posts. I think most people can see through your dishonesty as they have called you out in other threads here. You have already been provided scripture proving what you say is not truthful and it is you who refuses correction. So we will agree to disagree. I hope only the best for you, but according to the scriptures walking a path of unbelief and sin will only lead us away from God and into darkness waiting for Gods judgements, according to the scriptures in Hebrews 10:26-31.

Take care.

It was not a false claim. It was not a false accusation. I quoted the first four or five verses. It showed what that verse was about. You cut off the one verse that you quoted in mid verse. That is quote mining. Perhaps you are copying an apologist site rather than going to the Bible. I have not seen a single apologist site that does not qualify as being a "Liar for Jesus".

By your standards, since I used the same technique as you did. The Bible repeatedly states:

"There is no God"

It makes that claim at least twelve times using your poor method of argumentation. That means that by your standard I can refute the existence of God. Tell me, why is it okay when you abuse the Bible but not okay when others abuse the Bible?

And according to the Bible you have sinned. You are walking away from the Lord.

 

[3rdAngel]

It was not a false claim. It was not a false accusation.

Then prove all your false claims and accusations. - All I see in return when asked is silence from you.

I quoted the first four or five verses. It showed what that verse was about.

Your not telling the truth. Show me a link to the five scriptures that prove your claims that ... whatsoever is not of faith is not sin? - Lets be honest you have not provided anything support anything that you have said here.

You cut off the one verse that you quoted in mid verse. That is quote mining. Perhaps you are copying an apologist site rather than going to the Bible. I have not seen a single apologist site that does not qualify as being a "Liar for Jesus".

Well none of that is true. Romans 14:23 says word for word that "whatsoever is not of faith is sin." That is what the scripture says. This is in agreement with Hebrews 11:6 that says "without faith it is impossible to please God" and again in the very words of Jesus in John 3:36 that says "He that believes on the Son has everlasting life: and he that believes not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God stays on him. Sorry I am not leaving you any wiggle room here. There is no salvation in unbelief and sin (see Hebrews 10:26-31). Only the judgements of God are provided to all those who choose to walk down that road. They are a part of the many that are called and not of the few that will be Gods chosen.

By your standards, since I used the same technique as you did. The Bible repeatedly states:"There is no God" It makes that claim at least twelve times using your poor method of argumentation. That means that by your standard I can refute the existence of God. Tell me, why is it okay when you abuse the Bible but not okay when others abuse the Bible? And according to the Bible you have sinned. You are walking away from the Lord.

Please forgive me if I choose not to believe you. I do not believe you because the scriptures I have shared with you show that what you post is against scripture. The bible says nowhere there is no God. In fact it talks directly about God creating the heavens and the earth in the very first chapter of Genesis 1 and then in every book of the bible. That is simply you being dishonest and twisting scripture trying to say what the scriptures do not say. You have already been provided scripture proving what you say is not truthful and it is you who refuses correction. So we will agree to disagree. Please forgive me but I do not believe you.

Take Care.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Then prove all your false claims and accusations. - All I see in return when asked is silence from you.

LOL! Try to think rationally. If my claims are false I cannot "prove" them. How can we have a discussion when you cannot even reason or discuss the topic honestly? Please try to not make false accusations against others.

Your not telling the truth. Show me a link to the five scriptures that prove your claims that ... whatsoever is not of faith is not sin? - Lets be honest you have not provided anything support anything that you have said here.

Why do you need a link? Why didn't you go and read the Bible yourself? But no problem, I will link and quote for you. As a Christian I thought that you had a Bible available:

Bible Gateway passage: Romans 3 - New International Version

God’s Faithfulness - What advantage, then, is there in being a Jew, or what value is there in circumcision? Much in every way! First of all, the Jews have been entrusted with the very words of God. What if some were unfaithful? Will their unfaithfulness nullify God’s faithfulness? Not at all...

www.biblegateway.com

" What advantage, then, is there in being a Jew, or what value is there in circumcision? 2 Much in every way! First of all, the Jews have been entrusted with the very words of God.

3 What if some were unfaithful? Will their unfaithfulness nullify God’s faithfulness? 4 Not at all! Let God be true, and every human being a liar. As it is written:

“So that you may be proved right when you speak
and prevail when you judge.”[a]"

There you go. I could have quoted more of it, but please note, you left off the last part of verse four. And we can see from verse one that this was about circumcision.

Well none of that is true. Romans 14:23 says word for word that "whatsoever is not of faith is sin." That is what the scripture says. This is in agreement with Hebrews 11:6 that says "without faith it is impossible to please God" and again in the very words of Jesus in John 3:36 that says "He that believes on the Son has everlasting life: and he that believes not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God stays on him. Sorry I am not leaving you any wiggle room here. There is no salvation in unbelief and sin (see Hebrews 10:26-31). Only the judgements of God are provided to all those who choose to walk down that road. They are a part of the many that are called and not of the few that will be Gods chosen.

I do not care what the Bible says. I merely get irritated when you misuse it. When the Bible says stupid things it is wrong. We were not discussing if the Bible is reliable or not. How would you prove that it is reliable? I know how I can show that it is not reliable.

Your words have no truth in them. The bible says nowhere there is no God. In fact it talks directly about God creating the heavens and the earth in the very first chapter of Genesis 1 and then in every book of the bible. That is simply you being dishonest and twisting scripture trying to say what the scriptures do not say. You have already been provided scripture proving what you say is not truthful and it is you who refuses correction. So we will agree to disagree. Please forgive me but I do not believe you.

Take Care.

Do not make such claims again. That is a violation of the rules here. Just because you cannot refute what I post does not mean that "there is no truth" in your words. That is a false claim on your part. One that you would have to prove and your book of myths does not count as evidence. And yes, by your standards, where a person quoting the Bible can leave off important parts of a quote the Bible does say "there is no God". I gave you an example. Why didn't you look it up?

And remember, I am playing your game. If there is "no truth" in anyone's serious claims it would be you. You left off the intro to a verse that you used and cut the end off of the verse that you used. I merely did the same thing.

 

[Aupmanyav]

But it isn't true. Only faith in Jesus can save us from ourselves, death, and the penalty of sin.

You are correct - it is not true. God will not take you on your own word. So, someone has to testify for you. God will look to the right where Jesus will be sitting before he decides your case. Therefore, it is wise to be on Jesus' side. Fake allegiance to Jesus will not work.

 

[3rdAngel]

LOL! Try to think rationally. If my claims are false I cannot "prove" them. How can we have a discussion when you cannot even reason or discuss the topic honestly? Please try to not make false accusations against others.

Thank you but I am not the one that is thinking irrationally. Try to think rationally. If you cannot respond to my posts and the scriptures shared with you that are in disagreement with you than the problem is your side not mine and your simply projecting what you are already doing.

Why do you need a link?

Because you were making false claim stating you provided scripture showing that not believing Gods Word is not sin. I know that claim has no truth to it and you provided no such scripture because there is no such scripture. So I challenged you to prove your false claims.

Why didn't you go and read the Bible yourself? But no problem, I will link and quote for you. As a Christian I thought that you had a Bible available: Romans 3" What advantage, then, is there in being a Jew, or what value is there in circumcision? 2 Much in every way! First of all, the Jews have been entrusted with the very words of God. 3 What if some were unfaithful? Will their unfaithfulness nullify God’s faithfulness? 4 Not at all! Let God be true, and every human being a liar. As it is written: “So that you may be proved right when you speak and prevail when you judge.”[a]" There you go. I could have quoted more of it, but please note, you left off the last part of verse four. And we can see from verse one that this was about circumcision.

Well yes you do have a problem. Lets discuss these scripture now that you linked and see if they say what you claim they are saying. You provided a link to Romans 3. Please now show us where does it say in Romans 3 that "whatsoever is not of faith is not sin" in disagreement with Romans 14:23 that says "whatsoever is not of faith is sin"? There is nothing in Romans 3 anywhere that says that unbelief is not sin. Lets be honest you have nothing do you which is why I asked you for the link. None of the scriptures you have provided support anything that you have said in our discussion now do they. Please be honest dear friend. Sorry I am not leaving you with any wiggle room now. You have nothing.

I do not care what the Bible says.

Yes that is what I have said to you from the beginning. We are in agreement here. If you do not care what the bible says why are you trying to have a discussion in a scripture forum.

I merely get irritated when you misuse it. When the Bible says stupid things it is wrong. We were not discussing if the Bible is reliable or not. How would you prove that it is reliable? I know how I can show that it is not reliable.

Yes I can see you are irritated. It is because you are being provided with scripture proving that you are the one misusing the scriptures which is why you are unable to respond to the posts, scriptures and questions asked of you that are in disagreement with you. I was never discussing is the bible reliable or not. I beleive according to the scriptures that it is your unbelief that is the problem not the bible which has been pointed out to you from the very beginning.

3rdAngel said: Your words have no truth in them. The bible says nowhere there is no God. In fact it talks directly about God creating the heavens and the earth in the very first chapter of Genesis 1 and then in every book of the bible. That is simply you being dishonest and twisting scripture trying to say what the scriptures do not say. You have already been provided scripture proving what you say is not truthful and it is you who refuses correction. So we will agree to disagree. Please forgive me but I do not believe you.

Your response here...

Do not make such claims again. That is a violation of the rules here. Just because you cannot refute what I post does not mean that "there is no truth" in your words.

The only claims I have made is telling you the truth by providing scripture that proves what you say is not truthful. In response you make false claims and accusations you are unable to prove when challenged. I think we have traveled down this path before. You simple will not address the posts and scripture content that are in disagreement with you that have only been sent in love as a help to you. Instead of receiving Gods correction through His Words and being blessed you turn away in unbelief. So we will agree to disagree dear friend.

That is a false claim on your part. One that you would have to prove and your book of myths does not count as evidence. And yes, by your standards, where a person quoting the Bible can leave off important parts of a quote the Bible does say "there is no God". I gave you an example. Why didn't you look it up?

I have not made any false claims. I have only provided scripture that is in disagreement with you. They are Gods Words not mine and they disagree with your words that are not Gods. Everything else in your post here is not truthful do does not need a response. I already asked you to prove what you say your just continuing with false allegation that when challenged you cannot prove. For example here prove to me that when Romans 14:23 says word for word that "whatsoever is not of faith is sin" in agreement with Hebrews 11:6 that says "without faith it is impossible to please God" and again in the very words of Jesus in John 3:36 that says "He that believes on the Son has everlasting life: and he that believes not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God stays on him. You have no scripture to prove any of your claims now do you. Lets be honest dear friend you have nothing to support anything you have said. Sorry I am not leaving you any wiggle room here. There is no salvation in unbelief and sin (see Hebrews 10:26-31). Only the judgements of God are provided to all those who choose to walk down that road. They are a part of the many that are called and not of the few that will be Gods chosen.

And remember, I am playing your game. If there is "no truth" in anyone's serious claims it would be you. You left off the intro to a verse that you used and cut the end off of the verse that you used. I merely did the same thing.

Sorry dear friend, I do not believe you and the reasons why I do not believe you have already been provided throughout our conversation proving why with scripture that is in disagreement with you that you are unwilling to address. Sadly the only thing you are doing is everything you are falsely accusing me of and projecting because you are unable to respond to all the scripture content that is in disagreement with you. So we will agree to disagree.

Take Care.

 

[2ndpillar]

We know that things like fornication were considered wrong in the Bible. Are they ok now in your opinion?

I am not sure as to what you are saying, really. Can you please elaborate about your reference to the "last part of the gospel of Matthew" not being in line with the oldest version?

The earliest version of the last parts of the last chapter of Matthew did not exist. In plain language, it was added on, but appears to be the mountain you make your battle on, although with respect to the "kingdom", in Mt 24:14, the "kingdom" was to be "preached as a witness to all the nations". The "gospel of the kingdom" has nothing to do with the false gospel of grace, presented by the false prophet Paul, and is antithetical to it.
What was referred to in the Commandments was that one was not to "commit adultery". As for your false prophet Paul and his minions telling his followers that they should not to eat things sacrificed to idols, eat/drink blood, or fornicate. Paul simply got around not eating meat sacrificed idols by saying idols/gods are not real for those with his expressed "faith". On the other hand, Paul's followers seem mostly just to ignore the "blood" thing and seem to "fornicate" with little or no restraint, apparently with the knowledge that they can kill the unborn at will with the help of Joe, Dr. Jill Biden, and Governor Newsom. The true Scripture had a different approach. It said don't be too wise, but don't be too foolish and die before your time.