A big invisible man who created the universe

[Truth_Faith13]

Again I can see what you POW is, and where you are coming from, however your theory of an imaginery friend still does not work. Let me provide another situation for you to see if you can see where I am coming from....

You are holding a kids bday party! There are lets say 20children playing in the garden, when a cat runs across the garden. They are all excited about this cat and come running in to tell you. 19 of the kids say the cat was black. 1 child say the cat was blue - who would you believe to be correct (not crazy)? not colour blind (or in your example crazy)?

Only YOU see the imaginery friend, millions see the existences of God.

 

[Truth_Faith13]

I meant POV (point of view!) lol! You not a prisoner of war!! dont worry!

 

[Gentoo]

People who belive in God, basically belive a big thing created the universe, performs miracles and talks to us in mysterious ways, isn't it?

I don't believe that my god created the universe, performs miracles or talks to me in myserious ways, but I'm not your normal theist either

They sit and they pray to something that, in their mind is 100% real.

Perhaps, yes.

However if i started walking along and talking to an imaginary friend and i believed she(lets face it if i have an imaginary friend she'll be attractive lol) was 100% real i would be put away for being crazy.

That depends.

Well isn't this the same as religious people praying to some invisible thing? If not how is it different from me talking loads of crazes about my invisible friend?

The difference I see between the two is that some believe that God is a creator being, while you nor your imaginary friend insist that she is a creator as well (assuming your friend is female). That might not be a big deal, but to theists, it is. Most theists can agree that the gods are above us on some level, (be spiritual planes, heaven, what have you) while your imaginary friend is right there next to you.

God is also a very subjective thing, no two people will have the same experiences. If you believe that your imaginary friend is God, I'm not going to tell you otherwise. If you want to believe in the Flying Spaghetti Monster, Odin, the Christian God, Allah, Shiva or none at all, who am I to tell you that you're wrong?

A believe or disbelief in God is only as good as one makes it. You may not see a difference between your imaginary friend and God, but that doesn't mean that there isn't a difference.

 

[Nanda]

No because only you yourself can "see" her! the only way to get people to believe you, would for other poeple to "see" her as well!

Like the emperor's new clothes?

What about those heaven's gate people? They believed enough to commit mass suicide, and there were a bunch of them, too. Were they not crazy? How about the Manson family?

 

[Panda]

haha i was getting worried there, was looking out my window for soldiers

I would ask the 1 child who said the cat was blue if the cat really was blue, if he says "Yes" then i would believe that that child honestly believes the cat to be blue. The fact that the cat is black is irrelevant to the question. Just like the amount of people that believe in God is irrelevant. How many people murder other humans? Does the shear number of them make it right? No of course not. Just because millions agree with something doesn't make it right, i am not claiming to be right because we can never know with a question of this magnitude.
What i am saying is there is no difference between someone who 100% believes God influences their lives and someone who believes an imaginary friend influences their lives. Both are influenced by this other presence they both perceive as real. Hypothetical me is influenced by my imaginary friend, the theist is influenced by God. Both are only 100% true and fact in that person's mind, just like my beliefs are only 100% true in my mind. Only once we try to see things objectively do we get confused because at that point we become lost as their is no way to prove God is real or not real past the confines of ourselves. In this respect the hypothetical me who believes 100% in my imaginary friend is the same as everyone else here, including the real me.

 

[Mister_T]

Yes but see that is merely your belief right or wrong it is yours, and you belive it effects you. The hypothetical me would tell you that my friend has helped me through difficult times, and that no matter what you say she is just as real to me in my mind as God is to you in your mind. In my mind my imaginary friend does effect my surroundings, that is why i belive she is real. However everyone else will see this as my own actions. God does the same thing to every theist, you believe He is real so you believe he effects your surroundings in the same way the hypothetical me's imaginary friend effects my surroundings. To the outside observer who does not believe in your God they see only your actions influencing the world, to the outside world observing the hypothetical me they see only my actions influencing the world. But both the theist and the hypothetical me will say an outside force (God or the imaginary friend) effected their life.

You're still limiting the God experience to the mind of the person. When I'm talking about God interacting with people, I'm talking about something that the outside observers can experience as well.

God could appear in front of a people and say "Hi I'm real" and some people would still dismiss it as a "trick" of the mind. A person has to consider God a possibilty otherwise it's like telling a person to prove to them you can make a cherry pie only they can't use cherries.

 

[Panda]

A person also has to consider God is not a possibility or it is like making cherry pie without the pie

 

[Truth_Faith13]

OK, its a tricky question! Im on the fence with this one, like I am most things! but hey, after all, the sky is orange!

 

[sandy whitelinger]

People who belive in God, basically belive a big thing created the universe, performs miracles and talks to us in mysterious ways, isn't it? They sit and they pray to something that, in their mind is 100% real. However if i started walking along and talking to an imaginary friend and i believed she(lets face it if i have an imaginary friend she'll be attractive lol) was 100% real i would be put away for being crazy. Well isn't this the same as religious people praying to some invisible thing? If not how is it different from me talking loads of crazes about my invisible friend?

God has a longer and more credible history than you imaginary girl friend.

 

[Mister_T]

A person also has to consider God is not a possibility or it is like making cherry pie without the pie

Who says theists don't? That is something many theists have considered. They are not as willfully ignorant as you're portraying them.

 

[Panda]

A longer history doesn't make it more credible.

 

[Panda]

Mister T i didn't say you hadn't. Yet i have also considered that God could be real, i merely asked the reverse of the question you asked me.

 

[Mister_T]

Mister T i didn't say you hadn't. Yet i have also considered that God could be real, i merely asked the reverse of the question you asked me.

And I wasn't talking about me specifically. I was merely pointing out that a lot of theists know the difference between imaginary and something that is mentally created.

 

[Panda]

What is the difference? Both are made in the mind by the mind?

 

[Jistyr]

I think too many people are neglecting Panda's real question and that they are just beating around the bush at small mistakes in his whole idea. He's just trying to say that there is nothing that makes a theist's God any more real than his imaginary friend.

And as for 'evidence', I think if over 2 billion people believed in his imaginary girlfriend, then they too would be able to come up with things that prove her.

And even then, however many people believe in something doesn't make it any more true; people once thought the world was flat. For further reference to that point, read my signature.

 

[Gentoo]

What is the difference? Both are made in the mind by the mind?

Just curious, but did you read my post? I sorta go into that... post number 23

 

[Runlikethewind]

What i am saying is there is no difference between someone who 100% believes God influences their lives and someone who believes an imaginary friend influences their lives. Both are influenced by this other presence they both perceive as real.

I think there is a huge difference here from my perspective. Your imaginary friend is a particular being, God is being itself. If your imaginary friend exists then it is because it takes its existence from existence which is God. There is a world of difference in the belief of the existence of a particular invisible friend and the belief that existence is God. Not everyone will have the same concept of God or the concept of an imaginary friend. But in my mind, my concept of God is so totally opposite from the idea of an imaginary friend that the two beliefs do not even compare.

 

[Panda]

I still see mentally created things and imaginary as the same thing, mentally created might perhaps be a stronger belief in it but that is the only difference i can take in meanings.

And Jistyr thank you for clearing up my point

 

[Jistyr]

More people are missing his idea. If he just said that he believed his imaginary girlfriend was the creator of the world, then it would nullify all the arguments that the imaginary friend is very different from a God.

He's just trying to say if he believed in something different from your view, what makes yours anymore right?! Quit trying to scratch at little things in his argument and just take the general theme and debate it.

 

[Panda]

Runlikethewind, your key phrase their "But in my mind" that is what i have been talking about. In your mind God is totaly real and is everything, in my mind it is not. In hypothetical me's mind the girl is totaly real, in my actually mind she is not.