a question for those who still support bush

[Feathers in Hair]

Actually, reports have shown that Bush had taken funding and research away from anti-terrorism projects, ones that Clinton had put in place. He actually made this country less safe.

 

[FFH]

ARRRRRRGHHH!!!! :banghead3 Terrorists, based in Afghanistan, attacked the WTC and Pentagon. We went to war against Afghanistan and toppled that govt, yet never found bin Laden. THEN, we went to war against Iraq. There is no evidence that Iraq had anything to do with the attack on 9/11. NO EVIDENCE. NONE. The war in Iraq is not the war on terror! Mr. Bush started the war against Iraq, not the terrorists. The only way that anyone could equate the war on terror with the war in Iraq is if they believed that all Muslims/Arabs are terrorists, and that is absolute BULL!!

Why do Muslims, and the rest of the world, believe that Bush invaded a country with no justification? Because he did!

The highest concentration of terroists are located in Iraq Lilithu....This should be apparent with the highest number of terrorist attacks coming out of Iraq. Terrorists occupy all territories of the world NOT JUST AFGHANISTAN

Quote from Bush went something like this "We would rather fight the terrorists on their own turf than on ours"

The war will be fought, it is just a matter of where.... It is better to go where the terrorists are the most concentrated than to stay in Afghanistan and wait for them to attack when it seems like that country is fine for now.....Pleny of military occupation there...THAT WAS ONLY ONE AREA WHERE TERRORISTS WERE BEING TRAINED....THERE ARE MANY AREAS WHERE TERRORISTS LIVE AND TRAIN FOR WAR.

 

[Sunstone]

The highest concentration of terroists are located in Iraq Lilithu....This should be apparent with the highest number of terrorist attacks coming out of Iraq. Terrorists occupy all territories of the world NOT JUST AFGHANISTAN

Quote from Bush went something like this "We would rather fight the terrorists on their own turf than on ours"

The war will be fought, it is just a matter of where.... It is better to go where the terrorists are the most concentrated than to stay in Afghanistan and wait for them to attack when it seems like that country is fine for now.....Pleny of military occupation there...THAT WAS ONLY ONE AREA WHERE TERRORISTS WERE BEING TRAINED....THERE ARE MANY AREAS WHERE TERRORISTS LIVE AND TRAIN FOR WAR.

Iraq didn't have terrorists in it before we invaded. After we invaded, they flocked to it. But we certainly didn't invade Iraq to "take the war to the terrorists". On the contrary, our government was so sure there were no terrorists in Iraq that it made no provisions or plans to combat them after the invasion, and we were caught off guard by them.

 

[lilithu]

The highest concentration of terroists are located in Iraq Lilithu....This should be apparent with the highest number of terrorist attacks coming out of Iraq.

You're lack of logic is making my head hurt. (Or maybe it's the pounding my head against the wall in frustration.) Before we invaded Iraq, Iraq had one of the lowest rates of terrorism in the world. Now mind you, I'm not saying it was a nice place. Saddam was a ******* and govt sponsored torture against its own citizens was common place. BUT, in terms of terrorists, it had one of the lowest rates in the world. After we invaded Iraq, terrorist attacks in Iraq is now common place. Our invasion of Iraq brought terrorists and resistance fighters from all over the world to fight us. Our own govt has documented the influx of extremists pouring across the borders into Iraq. Our invasion of Iraq is the reason why the highest number of terrorist attacks are now coming out of Iraq. If we had invaded Iran instead, it would be Iran. If we had invaded Syria instead, it would be Syria. Heck, if we had invaded one of our supposed allies, Saudia Arabia or Kuwait or Turkey, that country would now be the country with the highest number of terrorist attacks. They are attacking because we are there.

You think invading Iraq made the world safer? Read this:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/04/26/AR2005042601623.html

Terrorists occupy all territories of the world NOT JUST AFGHANISTAN

Well in that case I guess we're just going to have to go to war against the whole world then, huh?

 

[lilithu]

GOD WILL

Convenient. Well why doesn't God just stop the terrorists then?

 

[FFH]

if it is true that the terrorists are flocking to Iraq then it will make the rest of the world much safer thats for sure.. Like I said Bush wants to fight them on their own turf, not here in Americaa which would put us all at risk. Why not fight them in one specific area like Iraq....better yet why not go to an open desert or an open territory with no civilians and fight them there....Sounds like Armagedon or the Land of Miggido (a place where the last war will be fought, as stated in Revelation in the Bible),

 

[FFH]

Convenient. Well why doesn't God just stop the terrorists then?

God will eventually put an end to the fighting in the world but for now he allows us our free agency (the right to choose between good and evil) God is no a tyrant and he allows us to kill and be killed but at some point according to Revelation in the Bibile this will all come to and end and there will be true peace again on the earth for a 1000 years......The period called the Millenium....This so called Millenium is being ussured in now by what we do....

Bush is helping to usher in the Millenium by preparing the Earth for the coming of Jesus Christ.....Bush truely is a servent of God as are we with the things we do to usher in the Millenium by stopping terrorism at its very root.....

Every area of the world must submit to God and accept Jesus Christ or at least be at peace with each other in there individual religions or suffer being involved in some kind of war.......There is no way around this and God will allow us to work things out for ourselves......

But there will be a time when God will say enough is enough....

We can all do our part by electing people who will keep the world safe by fighting terrorism in any form......God wants us to make the world a better place and then He will do the rest....Those things that we cannot do....We cannot expect God to do everything for us... only those things that we cannot do for ourselves....

 

[Aqualung]

Here's something I've noticed when talking to people about the Iraq war. People always yell at Iraqi war supporters for supporting a war that isn't doing any good (and kills our own soldiers and "innocent" iraqis for nothing, and isn't doing anybody any good whatsoever), and then turn around and yell at us for not going to war against regimes such as North Korea. Weird.

 

[lilithu]

I agree that WMD was a major reason for us going into Iraq, but it is misleading to state that the administration didn't care or start talking about the liberty of the people there until they couldn't find the weapons.

In the months leading up to the war against Iraq and after its start, the Bush administration has spoken hundreds of times about why we need to go into Iraq. I cannot find the documentation online now (and if anyone can I would be forever grateful!) but people have tallied how many times he and his talking heads mentioned Al Qaeda, how many times they mentioned imminent threat, how many times they mentioned democracy, etc over those months. I remember that the total number of different justifications used was about two dozen. It is clear when they added up the frequency with which each justifcation was cited that that the overwhelming message that was being fed to the American people in the beginning was WMDs and preemptive strike, self-defense. That was the justification. The president had the luxury of speaking high-mindedly and noblely about human rights and such on a few key high-profile occasions because his administration - Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, Powell, etc - were talking about WMDs all the rest of the time - talk shows and press releases and interviews and testimonies.

Honestly, if someone can find the stats I'll give frubals and coins. The thing is, if you give two dozen reasons to do something in the beginning, and then most of them turn out to be wrong, you can still point to the ones that weren't disproven and say you were right. That's what they're doing and for some reason we don't call them on it. They say something enough times and we believe it's true. 1984 may have taken a few more years to arrive than Orwell predicted, but arrive it has.

 

[Scuba Pete]

Here's something I've noticed when talking to people about the Iraq war. People always yell at Iraqi war supporters for supporting a war that isn't doing any good (and kills our own soldiers and "innocent" iraqis for nothing, and isn't doing anybody any good whatsoever), and then turn around and yell at us for not going to war against regimes such as North Korea. Weird.

Interesting. I surely wouldn't clamor for a war in N Korea. No one that I know would ever clamor for that. We might use it to show that HERE is a country that really IS a threat to our national security (but they don't have oil). But I would never yell at ANYONE for not going to war there. Perhaps you just missed the point?

 

[Scuba Pete]

Bush is helping to usher in the Millenium by preparing the Earth for the coming of Jesus Christ.....Bush truely is a servent of God as are we with the things we do to usher in the Millenium by stopping terrorism at its very root.....

Stop it! You're making me laugh! Your thinking that a WAR MONGER is anything but the anti-Christ is killing me! I am sure he even has 666 tattooed on his butt! He is Satan's white knight, willing and able to crush the innocents in his quest to become the "war president". But hey, that's only my opinion and ONE DAY, I'll loosen up a bit and tell you what I really feel about the man!

 

[Aqualung]

Interesting. I surely wouldn't clamor for a war in N Korea. No one that I know would ever clamor for that. We might use it to show that HERE is a country that really IS a threat to our national security (but they don't have oil). But I would never yell at ANYONE for not going to war there. Perhaps you just missed the point?

Naw. I was just making an observation about what I've seen people do.

 

[lilithu]

Bush is helping to usher in the Millenium by preparing the Earth for the coming of Jesus Christ.....Bush truely is a servent of God as are we with the things we do to usher in the Millenium by stopping terrorism at its very root.....

Every area of the world must submit to God and accept Jesus Christ or at least be at peace with each other in there individual religions or suffer being involved in some kind of war.......There is no way around this and God will allow us to work things out for ourselves......

Let me get this straight. The second coming of Christ will not happen until everyone is either Christian or there is no more war. So Bush is serving God by helping to usher in the second coming of Christ by waging war. Waging war for what? To create peace by killing everyone who opposes us? To convert everyone to Christianity? And where do you get this from? Where in the bible does it say that we need to stop terrorism in order for Christ to come again?

 

[Mr Spinkles]

From your previous post:
"I support the war in Iraq in the same way that I would have supported an incompetent and/or deceptive President invading Hitler before he became a threat to us.

You were talking about a preemptive strike and that's what I was reacting to.

No, I was not. I said "before he became a threat to us" because I was talking about taking action over the fact that one man was causing so much misery to others, not because he was a threat to us. Sorry for the confusion.

As for intervening when someone is terrorizing the defenseless, I already said that I agree with that.

Great, then we agree.

 

[lilithu]

Here's something I've noticed when talking to people about the Iraq war. People always yell at Iraqi war supporters for supporting a war that isn't doing any good (and kills our own soldiers and "innocent" iraqis for nothing, and isn't doing anybody any good whatsoever), and then turn around and yell at us for not going to war against regimes such as North Korea. Weird.

They're not clamoring for war in N.Korea, Aqualung. Most of these people that you're talking about are against war in general. And not even Bush is stupid enough to take on a war with N.Korea. The people who bring up N.Korea, as I myself have done in the past, are asking why we are going to war with Iraq and not N.Korea. They're pointing out the logical inconsistency in claiming that we're warring with Iraq because Iraq is a threat to our security when everybody knows that N.Korea is a much bigger threat. Everyone knows that N.Korea has nukes. It's not a matter of speculation like in Iraq. Everyone knows that N.Korea is ruled by a crazy nut job. Saddam was a cruel and greedy tyrant but he wasn't insane. N.Korea is the scariest country on the planet, the biggest threat to global security, and yet we say we're going after Iraq in order to make the world safer.

 

[jonny]

In the months leading up to the war against Iraq and after its start, the Bush administration has spoken hundreds of times about why we need to go into Iraq. I cannot find the documentation online now (and if anyone can I would be forever grateful!) but people have tallied how many times he and his talking heads mentioned Al Qaeda, how many times they mentioned imminent threat, how many times they mentioned democracy, etc over those months. I remember that the total number of different justifications used was about two dozen. It is clear when they added up the frequency with which each justifcation was cited that that the overwhelming message that was being fed to the American people in the beginning was WMDs and preemptive strike, self-defense. That was the justification. The president had the luxury of speaking high-mindedly and noblely about human rights and such on a few key high-profile occasions because his administration - Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, Powell, etc - were talking about WMDs all the rest of the time - talk shows and press releases and interviews and testimonies.

Honestly, if someone can find the stats I'll give frubals and coins. The thing is, if you give two dozen reasons to do something in the beginning, and then most of them turn out to be wrong, you can still point to the ones that weren't disproven and say you were right. That's what they're doing and for some reason we don't call them on it. They say something enough times and we believe it's true. 1984 may have taken a few more years to arrive than Orwell predicted, but arrive it has.

I agree that WMD was the main reason that we went, but your claim that they cooked up the democracy thing after they couldn't find the WMDs isn't true. I personally could have cared less about the WMDs. I just wanted Sadaam out of there. That's why I supported the war. That doesn't mean that I have supported everything that has happened since.

 

[jonny]

Iraq didn't have terrorists in it before we invaded. After we invaded, they flocked to it.

Are you sure about that? I agree that more flocked to it to join in the fight, but I think it is a little naive to believe that there were no terrorists in Iraq before the war. I would consider Saddam a terrorist.

 

[jonny]

Let me get this straight. The second coming of Christ will not happen until everyone is either Christian or there is no more war. So Bush is serving God by helping to usher in the second coming of Christ by waging war. Waging war for what? To create peace by killing everyone who opposes us? To convert everyone to Christianity? And where do you get this from? Where in the bible does it say that we need to stop terrorism in order for Christ to come again?

Don't try to get this straight. You'll make yourself sick. :biglaugh:

 

[jonny]

The people who bring up N.Korea, as I myself have done in the past, are asking why we are going to war with Iraq and not N.Korea.

I think that Bush would have liked to go to war in Iraq, Iran, and North Korea. Iraq was the easy one so he figured that he'd get it out of the way first.

 

[FFH]

Stop it! You're making me laugh! Your thinking that a WAR MONGER is anything but the anti-Christ is killing me! I am sure he even has 666 tattooed on his butt! He is Satan's white knight, willing and able to crush the innocents in his quest to become the "war president". But hey, that's only my opinion and ONE DAY, I'll loosen up a bit and tell you what I really feel about the man!

GO TO WWW.MICHAELSAVAGE.COM AND LOOK THE YOUNG SWEET INNOCENT CHRISTIAN INDONESIAN GIRLS HEAD LAYING BESIDE HER BODY AND THEN TELL ME WE SHOULD STOP THE WAR ON TERRORISM WHERE EVER IT MAY BE....IT IS EVERYWHERE NOW JUST LOOK AT THIS PAGE.....IT IS NOT JUST IN IRAQ ITS ALL OVER NOW.....

GEORGE BUSH IS DOING A GREAT JOB AND HE WILL CONTINUE TO FIGHT TERROR WHEREVER IT MAY BE......AND FREE ALL THE OPPRESSED AREAS OF THE WORLD