An Issue Of Valuing The Lives Of Others

[Revoltingest]

I’m sure the pigeon is winning

Boldly proclaims the pigeon.

 

[Kenny]

If you want to justify Israel's oppression of & war upon Palestinians
by finding fault with Arabs, you've plenty of ammunition.
But this is inhuman bigotry.
And worse, it will continue & even escalate the violence.

Think of how to solve the problem.
Not how to perpetuate it.

I think oppressions starts when all foods are taxed by Hamas at 12.5%. Oppression is when Hamas has a lot of money while Gazans are in poverty.

Gazans squeezed by triple taxes as Hamas replaces lost income

For Palestinians in the Gaza Strip, the cost of living is rising as they face three lots of taxes, says the BBC's Rushdi Abu Alouf.

www.bbc.com

Most of Gaza is poor, but Hamas has cash. Where does it come from?

Hamas has an investment portfolio of real estate and other assets worth $500 million, say experts, and an annual military budget of as much as $350 million.

www.nbcnews.com

Oppression starts when Hamas forces their way into authority. Oppression starts when tunnels are more important than infrastructure and food for your citizens.

 

[Kenny]

Boldly proclaims the pigeon.

I’m a pretty good chess player, not a master, but pretty good.

 

[Kenny]

That's the smoking gun.
Israel is for a two state solution.

Unfortunately most Arabs, driven by fundamentalist countries want it all.
They want all the land.

BINGO!

 

[Lyndon]

Problem is you consider Palestinian civilians to be pawns

 

[Revoltingest]

Problem is you consider Palestinian civilians to be pawns

They keep deflecting from my well supported theme
in this thread, ie, that Palestinian lives do not matter,
relative to to Christian & Jewish lives. The massive
death, injury, & misery toll is just "Israel has the
right to self defense."

 

[Bthoth]

I agree.
Threaten to end financial & military
support if they continue this evil path.
This would get their attention.

Threaten? NO.

That will only work if they want to change.
Israel will have to be forced somehow to
obey international law, & end the oppression.

Force? NO. Neither side does well with the use of force. Help the people on both sides to put civility above wants.

 

[Father Heathen]

The Ukrainians are also killing civilians as collateral casualties.

Their own? How many?

 

[Revoltingest]

Threaten? NO.

Israel must see that there is a potentially
high cost...more than just public image...
to denying Palestinians human rights.

Force? NO. Neither side does well with the use of force. Help the people on both sides to put civility above wants.

Force might end up coming from outside
Israel & its apologists. We don't know how
long US military supremacy will last with China
on the rise, & seeing opportunity in the ME.
And Muslim countries just might tire of seeing
their fellows treated this way decade after decade.
Israel is setting the stage for justifiable intervention
by hostile powers.

 

[Bthoth]

Israel must see that there is a potentially
high cost...more than just public image...
to denying Palestinians human rights.

Absolutely but then samson option is also a MAD solution

Force might end up coming from outside
Israel & its apologists.

Again, the MAD option still exists

And Muslim countries just might tire of seeing
their fellows treated this way decade after decade.

How do you think HAMAS began?

Israel is setting the stage for justifiable intervention
by hostile powers.

I agree and have very little doubt that some rogue org will blow a fuse.

 

[Revoltingest]

Absolutely but then samson option is also a MAD solution

Explain?

Again, the MAD option still exists

That outcome concerns me.

How do you think HAMAS began?

As a reaction to Israel's policies,
especially towards Palestinians.

I agree and have very little doubt that some rogue org will blow a fuse.

Escalation because of emotion & religious hostility.
Nuking Muslims would be just too easy.

 

[Bthoth]

Explain?

https://en.wikipedia.org › wiki › Samson_Option



The Samson Option is the name that some military analysts and authors have given to Israel's deterrence strategy of massive retaliation with nuclear weapons ...

That outcome concerns me.

Mutually assured destruction (MAD)

As a reaction to Israel's policies,
especially towards Palestinians.

That's what i referred

Escalation because of emotion & religious hostility.
Nuking Muslims would be just too easy.

1.5 billion of easy

 

[Shaul]

Their own? How many?

Yes, but I didn't write which nationality of civilians they had killed. Both the Russians and the Ukrainians are killing both ethnic Russian civilians and ethnic Ukrainian civilians as collateral casualties while the Ukrainians are fighting the Russian forces. The numbers killed vary according to the reporting source. Do you have a point?

 

[Father Heathen]

Yes, but I didn't write which nationality of civilians they had killed. Both the Russians and the Ukrainians are killing both ethnic Russian civilians and ethnic Ukrainian civilians as collateral casualties while the Ukrainians are fighting the Russian forces. The numbers killed vary according to the reporting source. Do you have a point?

You made a claim. I'm merely asking for you to substantiate it. What civilians, when, where, and how many? This conflict has been well documented, so it should be easy to find an example.

 

[Orbit]

I don't have a news story link for this yet, but it was posted by a news outlet with a photo on twitter:

BREAKING: Israel's ambassador to the UN wears Nazi-era yellow star while addressing the UN Security Council, says that 'when Jewish babies were burned in Auschwitz the world was silent, today Jewish babies were burned in Bari and the southern settlements by the Nazi Hamas and the world is silent again. I will make you remember the shame of your silence every time you look at me'.

I will refrain from opining.

Edited to add: Found a related story here UN Security Council meets on Israel-Palestine crisis; no place is safe in Gaza says UNRWA chief

 

[InChrist]

I agree.
Threaten to end financial & military
support if they continue this evil path.
This would get their attention.

That will only work if they want to change.
Israel will have to be forced somehow to
obey international law, & end the oppression.

Let’s just say Israel agreed to lay down arms, extend a peaceful olive branch, remove border barriers, offer humanitarian aid and economic opportunities for the Palestinians; what do you think would happen?

 

[Revoltingest]

Let’s just say Israel agreed to lay down arms, extend a peaceful olive branch, remove border barriers, offer humanitarian aid and economic opportunities for the Palestinians; what do you think would happen?

A frubalworthy question in tesety times.

It would be a slow & messy process to achieve peace.
I'd expect some violence that risks derailing the process.
There are so many variables that I can't be more specific.
But I can't think of a better use for my tax dollars than
to aid it.....which would ultimately reduce the tax burden.

 

[Bthoth]

Let’s just say Israel agreed to lay down arms, extend a peaceful olive branch, remove border barriers, offer humanitarian aid and economic opportunities for the Palestinians; what do you think would happen?

You dont know israel:

The Uprooting of Life in Gaza and the West Bank​

The New Yorker
https://www.newyorker.com › News › War



5 days ago — Since 1967, more than eight hundred thousand Palestinian olive trees have been illegally uprooted by Israeli authorities and settlers.


Why is Israel cutting down olive trees?


The destruction and restriction of Palestinian olive trees acts as a method of economic control leveled by Israel. By clearing out groves of trees, Israel has access to more acres of land for further expansion of occupation

That apartheid is beyond just rude.

The next monstrocity will be getting US to take down Iran.

Why? Because the ayatollah set a 'red line' decades ago; thou shalt not touch that mount! And that is the ultimate goal/target for the dross.

 

[idea]

That is literally the opposite of how it works. The more impoverished a nation or region is, the higher the birth rate and infant mortality rate are.
The poorest nations on earth, have the highest birth rates and infant mortality rates.

Meanwhile in Syria... in the Congo... but no one talks about the largest problems that are currently happening.

While the world focuses on Israel & Ukraine, unprecedented funding shortages and shrinking migration pathways leave Africans stranded.

The number of forcibly displaced people – which includes internally displaced persons (IDPs), asylum seekers and refugees – surpassed 100 million globally in May 2022. African refugees have fewer options with less support than ever. According to the United Nations Refugee Agency’s (UNHCR) 2023 planning figures, 44 million people in sub-Saharan Africa are displaced, up from 38.3 million at the end of 2021. Most (60%) are IDPs. Africa hosts three-quarters of all new internal displacements.

 

[InChrist]

You dont know israel:

The Uprooting of Life in Gaza and the West Bank​

The New Yorker
https://www.newyorker.com › News › War



5 days ago — Since 1967, more than eight hundred thousand Palestinian olive trees have been illegally uprooted by Israeli authorities and settlers.


Why is Israel cutting down olive trees?


The destruction and restriction of Palestinian olive trees acts as a method of economic control leveled by Israel. By clearing out groves of trees, Israel has access to more acres of land for further expansion of occupation

That apartheid is beyond just rude.

The next monstrocity will be getting US to take down Iran.

Why? Because the ayatollah set a 'red line' decades ago; thou shalt not touch that mount! And that is the ultimate goal/target for the dross.

Yeah, well I’ve read that olive trees belonging to Jewish farmers have also been cut down. Either way, I think cutting down olive trees belonging to farmers, be they Palestinians or Israelis, is wrong.