An Issue Of Valuing The Lives Of Others

[Revoltingest]

Yet another unevidenced mythological belief. Wow.

It's commentary on their behavior towards each other.

What do you actually know about Judaism? No, renting to Jewish college students doesn't count.

I observe what people of various faiths actually do.
Morality is what's practiced, not what's preached.
Behavior is the gold standard for judging the faiths.
Not what God told someone to do, which one
betrayed another, who betat whom, etc, etc.

 

[dybmh]

It's commentary on their behavior towards each other.

Who? What are you talking about? What behavior? These sound like the mechanations of a crazy delusional mind.

Palestinains attack because a Jewish politician went to the Dome on the Rock and then they (Palestinains) cause death and destruction for decades. A blockade results.

What in the world does that have to do with Jew or Muslim?

Why not just admit the prejudice, Rev. Just say it? You hate Jews and you don't trust us. We're lawyers and bankers. We're the powerful elite? You hate all of that, right? Come on. Honesty is all I'm asking for. None of this makes any sense without the bigotry.

I observe what people of various faiths actually do.
That is the gold standard for judging the faiths.

Like what? What have you actually observed?

 

[Revoltingest]

Who? What are you talking about? What behavior? These sound like the mechanations of a crazy delusional mind.

Palestinains attack because a Jewish politician went to the Dome on the Rock and then they (Palestinains) cause death and destruction for decades. A blockade results.

What in the world does that have to do with Jew or Muslim?

Why not just admit the prejudice, Rev. Just say it? You hate Jews and you don't trust us. We're lawyers and bankers. We're the powerful elite? You hate all of that, right? Come on. Honesty is all I'm asking for. None of this makes any sense without the bigotry.



Like what? What have you actually observed?

Goodness gracious....where's that
claimed tolerance & reason, eh.

 

[Brickjectivity]

There are tunnels all under Gaza, and it is known that at least some hostages are kept deep down in these tunnels which have many, many exits. Bombing the buildings closes exits, which potentially helps when getting the hostages out. Turning off the water and electricity also is strategic and can help locate the hostages, depending. It may also cause Hamas to move them above ground. Its all about getting the hostages.

 

[Sargonski]

There are tunnels all under Gaza, and it is known that at least some hostages are kept deep down in these tunnels which have many, many exits. Bombing the buildings closes exits, which potentially helps when getting the hostages out. Turning off the water and electricity also is strategic and can help locate the hostages, depending. It may also cause Hamas to move them above ground. Its all about getting the hostages.

Simply not True -- laying waste to the region makes it more difficult for Israel to fight Hamas .. and has nothing to do with getting the hostages. the Massive bombing going on and leveling of buildings full of people has everything to do with collective punishment and cleansing of the land.

 

[dybmh]

Israel's actions by allowing and promoting settlements in the East Bank speak for themselves.

Let's read about it. What can you bring to the discussion that is unbiased? Or, perhaps bring something that is known to be biased and we can read it and discuss it granting that it's biased.

Even when it comes to words, offered/refused is overly simplistic. “Netanyahu has never wanted a Palestinian state,”

It has nothing to do with Netanyahu. Those were offered while Ben Gurion and Rabin were prime ministers. In both instances the Palestians would not recongize Israel as a state nor roll back their aspirations to push all the Jews into the sea. Lovely, right?

The Ottomans ruled with an iron fist. The League of Nations / UN comes in and tries to institute something else. Share the land? Israel says yes, the Palestinians and the Arab nations? Nope. If the "might=right" mentality pre UN was maintained, then Israel has won the right to rule that land. But, they've tried repeatedly to work with their neighbors.

They [Smotrich and Ben Gvir] are really changing the reality on the ground, blurring the Green Line [the pre-1967 demarcation line] and bringing us closer to a one-state solution, with the backing of Netanyahu. Even if there comes a point when Israel will seek to separate itself from the Palestinians, it will not be doable. We are closer and closer to the point of no return,” Milstein said.

The Palestinians ( and actually the surrounding arab nations ) had their chance, Multiple chances. The terrorism is not going to stop. Yes, it was a mistake to stop fighting the war for independence before obtaining a peace treaty that firmly and undeniably established defensible borders.

Are you proposing to repeat the same mistake again and again? The fighting should end prematurely, before a defensiblle border has been established by a peace treaty? That is only going to lead to more and more conflict. It needs to be finished. And I don't think Israel should stop, until its finished.

Defensible borders, undeniably established, in writing, via a treaty with the Palestinians. If they won't agree, then push them into Jordan. They attacked first. They made a huge mistake attacking the way they did. That's it. It's war.

 

[Brickjectivity]

Simply not True -- laying waste to the region makes it more difficult for Israel to fight Hamas .. and has nothing to do with getting the hostages. the Massive bombing going on and leveling of buildings full of people has everything to do with collective punishment and cleansing of the land.

So they are destroying tunnels to make it more difficult to fight Hamas? How stupid they must be to throw away all of their academy training and the lessons from previous fighting. There's no such thing as a strategy with IDF. They're just sealing those hostages in with no plan to get them out?

'Cleansing the land' sounds so weird and ritualistic, like something cooked up by El Ron Hubbard. The tunnels have too many exits, and the exits are hidden in buildings. Its strategy.

 

[Sargonski]

So they are destroying tunnels to make it more difficult to fight Hamas? How stupid they must be to throw away all of their academy training and the lessons from previous fighting. There's no such thing as a strategy with IDF. They're just sealing those hostages in with no plan to get them out?

'Cleansing the land' sounds so weird and ritualistic, like something cooked up by El Ron Hubbard. The tunnels have too many exits, and the exits are hidden in buildings. Its strategy.

They are not destroying the tunnels by leveling buildings .. you are misinformed or making things up.

Ethnic Cleansing --- weird and ritualistic perhaps -- but this is not Sci Fi mate

 

[dybmh]

"the Massive bombing going on and leveling of buildings full of people"

This is the closest I can find to this claim. There is a palestinian reporting that a building was bombed with people in it. Is it true? Who knows. They're just reporting something they "heard" that happened. There's a refuge camp that was bombed, but it sounds like it was sheltering Hamas.

The death toll according to the article is around 1500 palestinans. The death toll of Israelis on the Oct. 7th attack was approx 1400.

The source is "TheGuardian" which is left wing. There should not be a pro-Israel bias to its reporting. The Israeli death toll comes a different article.

‘The buildings are now ashes’: nowhere feels safe from Israeli bombs in Gaza

Hundreds of thousands displaced as even conflict-weary Palestinians fear they are in uncharted territory

www.theguardian.com

Israel-Hamas War: What You Need To Know

At 6:30 a.m. on October 7, 2023, Hamas, the Iran-backed terror group controlling Gaza, launched an unprovoked and vicious surprise attack on over 20 communities in Israel. Using rockets, paragliders, boats, motorcycles, other vehicles, and whatever other means they could, terrorists infiltrated...

www.ajc.org

 

[Orbit]

"the Massive bombing going on and leveling of buildings full of people"

This is the closest I can find to this claim. There is a palestinian reporting that a building was bombed with people in it. Is it true? Who knows. They're just reporting something they "heard" that happened. There's a refuge camp that was bombed, but it sounds like it was sheltering Hamas.

The death toll according to the article is around 1500 palestinans. The death toll of Israelis on the Oct. 7th attack was approx 1400.

The source is "TheGuardian" which is left wing. There should not be a pro-Israel bias to its reporting. The Israeli death toll comes a different article.

‘The buildings are now ashes’: nowhere feels safe from Israeli bombs in Gaza

Hundreds of thousands displaced as even conflict-weary Palestinians fear they are in uncharted territory

www.theguardian.com

Israel-Hamas War: What You Need To Know

At 6:30 a.m. on October 7, 2023, Hamas, the Iran-backed terror group controlling Gaza, launched an unprovoked and vicious surprise attack on over 20 communities in Israel. Using rockets, paragliders, boats, motorcycles, other vehicles, and whatever other means they could, terrorists infiltrated...

www.ajc.org

You really need to look at the news, because you seem to be behind. Suggestions: BBC, CNN, Al Jazeera, Times of Israel, and twitter is where the journalists are. I also suggest checking with human rights organizations and the U.N. websites.

 

[Revoltingest]

The death toll according to the article is around 1500 palestinans. The death toll of Israelis on the Oct. 7th attack was approx 1400.

The source is "TheGuardian" which is left wing. There should not be a pro-Israel bias to its reporting. The Israeli death toll comes a different article.

Afternoon Update: Australia toughens stance as Gaza death toll soars; woman found dead at Bendigo home; and Australians eat too much salt
Excerpted...
The civilian death toll in Gaza has soared to more than 8,000, according to the local Hamas-run health ministry. Save the Children says the number of children killed in Gaza in the last three weeks has surpassed the annual number of children killed in war zones since 2019.

 

[Brickjectivity]

They are not destroying the tunnels by leveling buildings .. you are misinformed or making things up.

Ethnic Cleansing --- weird and ritualistic perhaps -- but this is not Sci Fi mate

They are destroying exits not tunnels. It is strategy. The exits are hidden in buildings. There are a million or more people in Gaza, and contrary to what you say they are not being removed. Nobody has kicked them out. Nobody has slaughtered them. This is about getting the 200 hostages back and is legitimate.

 

[dybmh]

You really need to look at the news, because you seem to be behind. Suggestions: BBC, CNN, Al Jazeera, Times of Israel, and twitter is where the journalists are. I also suggest checking with human rights organizations and the U.N. websites.

or you could post something to share and discuss

 

[dybmh]

8,000, according to the local Hamas-run health ministry

This is clearly a biased source. That needs to be considered. Did you consider that? Why would you trust this number?

 

[Orbit]

or you could post something to share and discuss

I've posted so much stuff in different threads over the last three weeks; I've been researching the history of the situation since then. I've found survey research on what Palestinians think of Hamas; on what Israelis think of the situation and of Israeli leaders, what Americans think of a ceasefire. I've posted links about the history, timelines, attacks on American Jews and Muslims, and West Bank attacks on Palestinians by settlers as the IDF looks on, and explainers. But it's late now. I'll try to post some stuff to catch you up sometime tomorrow.

 

[Lyndon]

Let's read about it. What can you bring to the discussion that is unbiased? Or, perhaps bring something that is known to be biased and we can read it and discuss it granting that it's biased.



It has nothing to do with Netanyahu. Those were offered while Ben Gurion and Rabin were prime ministers. In both instances the Palestians would not recongize Israel as a state nor roll back their aspirations to push all the Jews into the sea. Lovely, right?

The Ottomans ruled with an iron fist. The League of Nations / UN comes in and tries to institute something else. Share the land? Israel says yes, the Palestinians and the Arab nations? Nope. If the "might=right" mentality pre UN was maintained, then Israel has won the right to rule that land. But, they've tried repeatedly to work with their neighbors.



The Palestinians ( and actually the surrounding arab nations ) had their chance, Multiple chances. The terrorism is not going to stop. Yes, it was a mistake to stop fighting the war for independence before obtaining a peace treaty that firmly and undeniably established defensible borders.

Are you proposing to repeat the same mistake again and again? The fighting should end prematurely, before a defensiblle border has been established by a peace treaty? That is only going to lead to more and more conflict. It needs to be finished. And I don't think Israel should stop, until its finished.

Defensible borders, undeniably established, in writing, via a treaty with the Palestinians. If they won't agree, then push them into Jordan. They attacked first. They made a huge mistake attacking the way they did. That's it. It's war.

A jew proposing ethnic cleansing of the palestinians, and he doesn't consider then less than human, just not worthy of their land, not to mention food and water

 

[sun rise]

Let's read about it. What can you bring to the discussion that is unbiased? Or, perhaps bring something that is known to be biased and we can read it and discuss it granting that it's biased.

Israel's settlement policy? Quoting Israeli sources - this is an old one https://www.btselem.org/publications/summaries/200205_land_grab Behind a paywell but Settlers are trying to drag Israel into war in the West Bank | Editorial and I can find other sources.

It has nothing to do with Netanyahu.

Netanyahu’s New Government to Settle All Biblical Lands of Israel - Israel Today

“The Jewish people has an exclusive and inalienable right to all parts of the Land of Israel.”

www.israeltoday.co.il

 

[Shadow Wolf]

This is the closest I can find to this claim

 

[Harel13]

They are not destroying the tunnels by leveling buildings

No, they are blocking the entrances. That's another way to handle a tunnel.
See here (particularly the section I highlighted):

Israel targets Hamas’s labyrinth of tunnels under Gaza

Palestinian militants are thought to have built hundreds of kilometres of tunnels underneath Gaza.

www.bbc.com

 

[Lyndon]

No, they are blocking the entrances. That's another way to handle a tunnel.
See here (particularly the section I highlighted):

Israel targets Hamas’s labyrinth of tunnels under Gaza

Palestinian militants are thought to have built hundreds of kilometres of tunnels underneath Gaza.

www.bbc.com

Good way to kill the hostages, IDF Would rather kill more Palestinians than protect the hostages