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Another irrefutable proof that God created all things using mathematical induction. And a proof that The Bible is the word of God.

SavedByTheLord

Well-Known Member
If you are asking if evolution theory address the origins of, say, planets or stars or the cosmos itself, the answer is no.
Yeah they do hide the unanswerable questions by breaking it into pieces.

But they must PROVE from nothing to the universe with chemicals to the firs living thing and all livings things and what they are made of.
 

joelr

Well-Known Member
One, the laws of nature are indeed laws, even the evolutionists call them that.
We call them laws to make it easier to notate. Reality can be described by mathematical rules, they are not laws.


Of course all those nobodies are nobody, except Yahweh the God of the Bible.
And of course, the Bible is the actual true record.
The Bible has been shown to be incorrect in many ways. You can read one single interview by archaeologist William Dever to see how archaeological digs show it's not correct.
There are internal contradictions and borrowed myths from other cultures. All of this can be demonstrated. All you are doing is making a claim without backing it up.

William Dever: From the beginnings of what we call biblical archeology, perhaps 150 years ago, scholars, mostly western scholars, have attempted to use archeological data to prove the Bible. And for a long time it was thought to work. [William Foxwell] Albright, the great father of our discipline, often spoke of the "archeological revolution." Well, the revolution has come but not in the way that Albright thought. The truth of the matter today is that archeology raises more questions about the historicity of the Hebrew Bible and even the New Testament than it provides answers, and that's very disturbing to some people.



 

TagliatelliMonster

Veteran Member
Yeah they do hide the unanswerable questions by breaking it into pieces.

Of all the things you've said since joining this forum, this has to be one of the most stupid / ignorant statements.
It's on par with complaining that your car mechanic doesn't cook and sell meatloaf.

But they must PROVE from nothing to the universe with chemicals to the firs living thing and all livings things and what they are made of.
No.
 

joelr

Well-Known Member
Exact timing of the prophecies from the Bible explained.



The Bible predicts many things that must happen in the last days. All these are predicted to happen from about 2000 to 3500 years ago. Not only were they predicted to happen in some inde
/Then let's look at things tyhat did not come to pass that Yahweh said

  1. Genesis

  2. "But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die."
    God says that if Adam eats from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, then the day that he does so, he will die. But later Adam eats the forbidden fruit (3:6) and yet lives for another 930 years (5:5). 2:17
  3. As a punishment for killing Abel, God says Cain will be "a fugitive and a vagabond." Yet in just a few verses (4:16-17) Cain will settle down, marry, have a son, and build a city. This is not the activity one would expect from a fugitive and a vagabond. 4:12
  4. How long was the Egyptian captivity? This verse says 400 years, but Exodus 12:40 and Galatians 3:17 say 430 years. 15:13
  5. "In the fourth generation they [Abraham's descendants] shall come hither again." But, if we count Abraham, then their return occurred after seven generations: Abraham, Isaac (Gen 21:1-3), Jacob (Gen.25:19-26), Levi (Gen 35:22-23), Kohath (Ex 6:16), Amramn (Ex 6:18), and Moses (Ex 6:20). 15:16
  6. God promises to make Isaac's descendents as numerous as "the stars of heaven", which, of course, never happened. The Jews have always been, and will always be, a small minority. 22:17-18, 26:4
  7. God promises Abram and his descendants all of the land of Canaan. But both history and the bible (Acts 7:5 and Hebrews 11:13) show that God's promise to Abram was not fulfilled. 13:15, 15:18, 17:8, 28:13-14
  8. God renames Jacob twice (32:28, 35:10 ). God says that Jacob will henceforth be called Israel, but the Bible continues to call him Jacob anyway (47:28-29). And even God himself calls him Jacob in 46:2. 32:28, 35:10
  9. God calls Jacob Jacob, though he said in Gen.32:28 and 35:10 that he would no longer be called Jacob but Israel. 46:2
  10. God promises to bring Jacob safely back from Egypt, but Jacob dies in Egypt (Gen.47:28-29) 46:3
  11. The tribe of Judah will reign "until Shiloh," but Israel's first king (Saul) was from the tribe of Benjamin (Acts 13:21), and most of the time after this prophecy there was no king at all. 49:10
  12. "He washed his garments in wine ... His eyes shall be red with wine."
    Did Judah really wash his clothes in wine? Were his eyes bloodshot from drinking too much? Or is this a prophecy of Jesus? (I didn't know Jesus had a drinking problem.) 49:11-12
  13. Contrary to the prophecy in 48:21, Joseph died in Egypt, not Israel. Gen.50:24
  14. Exodus

  15. God promises to cast out many nations including the Canaanites and the Jebusites. But he was unable to keep his promise. 33:2
  16. In this verse God says he will write on the stone tablets, but in 34:27 he tells Moses to do the writing. 34:1
  17. Numbers

  18. Eldad and Medad began to prophesy on their own. A young man ran and told Moses, saying, "Eldad and Medad prophesy in the camp." Joshua said to Moses, "Moses, forbid them!" But Moses said, "Heck, I wish everyone was a prophet!" 11:26-29
  19. "If there be a prophet among you, I the LORD will ... speak unto him in a dream." Now there's a reliable way to communicate with someone! 12:6
  20. "There shall come a Star out of Jacob"
    This verse is called the "star prophecy" and is sometimes claimed to be a prophecy of the star of Bethlehem (Matthew 2:2). But this seems unlikely, since the verse refers to Moab, and the kingdom of Moab didn't exist in New Testament times. Jesus didn't smite Moab or kill the children of Sheth. ("Sheth" here refers to Seth -- the son of Adam, from whom Noah and, according to the Bible, all other humans descended. So if this is a prophecy about Jesus, then it prophesies that Jesus will someday kill everyone on earth.) 24:17
  21. Deuteronomy

  22. God's favorite people will never be infertile (neither will their cows!) and will never get sick. (God will send infertility and diseases on the other guys.) 7:14-15
  23. Prophets and dreamers are to be executed if they say or dream the wrong things. 13:1-5
  24. Who is the prophesied prophet? 18:18
  25. False prophets are to be (you guessed it) executed. How do you know who is a false prophet? By whether or not their predictions come true. (Watch out Jehovah's Witnesses!) 18:20
  26. Misquoted in Rom.10:8. 30:14
  27. Choose life (!) 30:19
  28. God says that the Israelites will destroy all of the peoples they encounter. But he was unable to keep his promise. 7:1, 7:23-24, 31:3
  29. Joshua

  30. This verse says that Ai was never again occupied after it was destroyed by Joshua. But Nehemiah (7:32) lists it among the cities of Israel at the time of the Babylonian captivity. 8:28
  31. God promises to give Joshua all of the land that his "foot shall tread upon." He says that none of the people he encounters will be able to resist him. But later we find that God didn't keep his promise, and that many tribes withstood Joshua's attempt to steal their land. 1:3-5, 3:10, 15:63, 16:10, 17:12-13, 17:17-18, 21:43-45
  32. Judges

  33. God promised many times that he would drive out all the inhabitants of the lands they encountered. But he failed to keep that promise 1:19, 1:21-27, 3:1-5
  34. 2 Samuel

  35. "Thy kingdom shall be established for ever."
    God says that Davids's kingdom will last forever. It didn't of course. It was entirely destroyed about 400 years after Solomon's death, never to be rebuilt. 7:13, 16
 

joelr

Well-Known Member
Exact timing of the prophecies from the Bible explained.



  1. 1 Kings

  2. "Men's bones shall be burnt upon thee."
    Although this prophecy was apparently fulfilled in 2 Kings 23:20, no credit should be given for it, since it was supposedly given during the reign of Jeroboam (ca. 900 BCE), yet it was actually made more than 300 years later. Evidence for the late date is found in verse 32, which refers to the the northern kingdom as Samaria, a term that wasn't used until after the Assyrians captured that kingdom in 721 BCE. And since the two books of Kings (which were originally one) were compiled after 566 BCE, while Josiah died in 609 BCE, the prophecy was made after the prophesied event, and was, therefore, not a prophecy at all. (Source: New Oxford Annotated Bible, OT:446; Oxford Companion to the Bible, 411) 13:2
  3. God puts a "lying spirit" in the mouth of his prophets. 22:22
  4. 2 Kings

  5. God promises Josiah that he will have a peaceful death. But Josiah's death was anything but peaceful. (2 Kg 23:29-30, 2 Chr 35:23-24) 22:20
  6. In Jeremiah (34:4) God tells Zedekiah that he will die in peace and be buried with his fathers. But this verse and Jer 52:10-11 say that he died a violent death in a foreign land. 25:7
  7. 2 Chronicles

  8. The trouble with prophets 18:5-34
  9. God puts lies into the mouths of his prophets and speaks evil about people. 18:21-22
  10. Josiah died from an arrow wound in battle, not "in peace" as is promised in 2 Kings 22:20. 35:23
  11. According to this verse, Jeremiah prophesied that King Cyrus would rebuild the temple in Jerusalem. But there is no such prophecy in Jeremiah. Maybe the author was thinking of Isaiah (44:28, 45:1) or Ezra (1:1-2, 4:3, 5:13-17, 6:3). 36:22
  12. Psalms

  13. "I have sworn unto David my servant, Thy seed will I establish for ever, and build up thy throne to all generations." But the Davidic line of Kings ended with Zedekiah; there were none during the Babylonian captivity, and there are none today. 89:3-4, 34-37
  14. Isaiah

  15. In the last days, God's house will be on the earth's highest mountain. 2:2
  16. In the last days, God's house will be on the earth's highest mountain. 2:2
  17. God told Isaiah to tell Ahaz, the King of Judah, not to be concerned about Rezin (the king of Syria) or Pekah (the king of Israel). But according to 2 Chr 28:5-6 "God delivered him [Ahaz] into the hand of the king of Syria; and they smote him, and carried away a great multitude of them captives, and brought them to Damascus. And he was also delivered into the hand of the king of Israel, who smote him with a great slaughter." 7:3-7
  18. God told Isaiah to tell Ahaz, the King of Judah, not to be concerned about Rezin (the king of Syria) or Pekah (the king of Israel). But according to 2 Chr 28:5-6 "God delivered him [Ahaz] into the hand of the king of Syria; and they smote him, and carried away a great multitude of them captives, and brought them to Damascus. And he was also delivered into the hand of the king of Israel, who smote him with a great slaughter." 7:3-7
  19. The King James Version mistranslates the Hebrew word "almah", which means "young woman" as "virgin". (The Hebrew word, "bethulah", means "virgin".) In addition, the young woman referred to in this verse was living at the time of the prophecy. And Jesus, of course, was called Jesus -- and is not called Emmanuel in any verse in the New Testament. 7:14
  20. The King James Version mistranslates the Hebrew word "almah", which means "young woman" as "virgin". (The Hebrew word, "bethulah", means "virgin".) In addition, the young woman referred to in this verse was living at the time of the prophecy. And Jesus, of course, was called Jesus -- and is not called Emmanuel in any verse in the New Testament. 7:14
  21. 9/11 was a divine act of terrorism. If we rebuild, God will force us to eat our own arms. (Or something like that.)
    (See WND for the exciting details) 9:10-20
  22. 9/11 was a divine act of terrorism. If we rebuild, God will force us to eat our own arms. (Or something like that.)
    (See WND for the exciting details) 9:10-20
  23. As a sign that he's getting ready to destroy the world, God will destroy the whole universe. 13:10-13
  24. As a sign that he's getting ready to destroy the world, God will destroy the whole universe. 13:10-13
  25. These verses falsely predict that Babylon will never again be inhabited. 13:19-20
  26. These verses falsely predict that Babylon will never again be inhabited. 13:19-20
  27. Dragons will live in Babylonian palaces and satyrs will dance there. 13:21-22
  28. Dragons will live in Babylonian palaces and satyrs will dance there. 13:21-22
  29. This verse prophesies that Damascus will be completely destroyed and no longer be inhabited. Yet Damascus has never been completely destroyed and is one of the oldest continuously inhabited cities. 17:1
 

joelr

Well-Known Member
A man names Henry Morris, a creation scientist, said that if you deny 6-day recent creation, you will also have to deny the worldwide flood in Noah’s day. The Atheistic Origin “Scientists” with there no God assumption will just not allow God, period. See the topic “Don’t be conned with the no God Assumption of Atheistic Origin Science”.

Almost all the sedimentary layers with their fossils are the result of the worldwide flood during the time of Noah, which occurred about 4500 years ago. A real scientific study of those layers proves it. There are many other scientific proofs of recent creation.
Yes, the flood is from Mesopotamian myths, as is most of Genesis. This is the consensus opinion in scholarhip.
But modern geology has also ruled out a world flood. The sedimentary layers are not from a world flood.



Modern geology and flood geology
Modern geology, its sub-disciplines and other scientific disciplines use the scientific method to analyze the geology of the earth. The key tenets of flood geology are refuted by scientific analysis and do not have any standing in the scientific community.[5][6][7][8][9] Modern geology relies on a number of established principles, one of the most important of which is Charles Lyell's principle of uniformitarianism. In relation to geological forces it states that the shaping of the Earth has occurred by means of mostly slow-acting forces that can be seen in operation today. By applying these principles, geologists have determined that the Earth is approximately 4.54 billion years old. They study the lithosphere of the Earth to gain information on the history of the planet. Geologists divide Earth's history into eons, eras, periods, epochs, and faunal stages characterized by well-defined breaks in the fossil record (see Geologic time scale).[111][112] In general, there is a lack of any evidence for any of the above effects proposed by flood geologists and their claims of fossil layering are not taken seriously by scientists.[113]



Sedimentary rock features[edit]


Phil Senter's 2011 article, "The Defeat of Flood Geology by Flood Geology", in the journal Reports of the National Center for Science Education, discusses "sedimentologic and other geologic features that Flood geologists have identified as evidence that particular strata cannot have been deposited during a time when the entire planet was under water ... and distribution of strata that predate the existence of the Ararat mountain chain." These include continental basalts, terrestrial tracks of animals, and marine communities preserving multiple in-situ generations included in the rocks of most or all Phanerozoic periods, and the basalt even in the younger Precambrian rocks. Others, occurring in rocks of several geologic periods, include lake deposits and eolian (wind) deposits. Using their own words, Flood geologists find evidence in every Paleozoic and Mesozoic period, and in every epoch of the Cenozoic period, indicating that a global flood could not have occurred during that interval.[118] A single flood could also not account for such features as angular unconformities, in which lower rock layers are tilted while higher rock layers were laid down horizontally on top.[119]


GeochemistryProponents of Flood Geology are also unable to account for the alternation between calcite seas and aragonite seas through the Phanerozoic. The cyclical pattern of carbonate hardgrounds, calcitic and aragonitic ooids, and calcite-shelled fauna has apparently been controlled by seafloor spreading rates and the flushing of seawater through hydrothermal vents which changes its Mg/Ca ratio.[117]


Erosion


The global flood cannot explain geological formations such as angular unconformities, where sedimentary rocks have been tilted and eroded then more sedimentary layers deposited on top, needing long periods of time for these processes. There is also the time needed for the erosion of valleys in sedimentary rock mountains. In another example, the flood, had it occurred, should also have produced large-scale effects spread throughout the entire world. Erosion should be evenly distributed, yet the levels of erosion in, for example, the Appalachians and the Rocky Mountains differ significantly


Geochronology

Geochronology is the science of determining the absolute age of rocks, fossils, and sediments by a variety of techniques. These methods indicate that the Earth as a whole is about 4.54 billion years old, and that the strata that, according to flood geology, were laid down during the Flood some 6,000 years ago, were actually deposited gradually over many millions of years.

Sedimentary rock features


Phil Senter's 2011 article, "The Defeat of Flood Geology by Flood Geology", in the journal Reports of the National Center for Science Education, discusses "sedimentologic and other geologic features that Flood geologists have identified as evidence that particular strata cannot have been deposited during a time when the entire planet was under water ... and distribution of strata that predate the existence of the Ararat mountain chain." These include continental basalts, terrestrial tracks of animals, and marine communities preserving multiple in-situ generations included in the rocks of most or all Phanerozoic periods, and the basalt even in the younger Precambrian rocks. Others, occurring in rocks of several geologic periods, include lake deposits and eolian (wind) deposits. Using their own words, Flood geologists find evidence in every Paleozoic and Mesozoic period, and in every epoch of the Cenozoic period, indicating that a global flood could not have occurred during that interval.[118] A single flood could also not account for such features as angular unconformities, in which lower rock layers are tilted while higher rock layers were laid down horizontally on top.[119]
 

Monty

Active Member
I agree. I do not believe a god spoke to the persons
And the ten commandments etc are only man-made since they didn't apply to Abraham and his ancestors, which is why it wasn't morally wrong for Abraham and Noah and Lot to have sexual relationships with their sisters or daughters, or for Cain to kill his brother, since his god even protected him from retribution.
 

SavedByTheLord

Well-Known Member
And the ten commandments etc are only man-made since they didn't apply to Abraham and his ancestors, which is why it wasn't morally wrong for Abraham and Noah and Lot to have sexual relationships with their sisters or daughters, or for Cain to kill his brother, since his god even protected him from retribution.
Actually Cain went to hell for killing Abel.
And the only sex allowed is for one man and one woman married for life.
 

Bthoth

Well-Known Member
And the ten commandments etc are only man-made since they didn't apply to Abraham and his ancestors,
Sure if a god made them, he would have put them to stone for adam and the whole lineage.

Maybe HE knew the people of israel would not follow them anyway.
which is why it wasn't morally wrong for Abraham and Noah and Lot to have sexual relationships with their sisters or daughters, or for Cain to kill his brother, since his god even protected him from retribution.
I dont think of a god as another sitting on a thrown.
 

Monty

Active Member
Actually Cain went to hell for killing Abel.
Wrong. The bible says that Cainan's god protected him from retribution and would punish anyone who harmed him 7 fold after he shacked up with one of the girls in Nod and lived happily ever after (Gen 4:15-16). Similarly Noah's father was also protected from retribution for killing a young bloke (4:23-24).
And the only sex allowed is for one man and one woman married for life.
Nonsense. Abraham's god didn't complain about him shacking up with his sister and her friend. And it was also OK for Noah to also have sex with his sister. And it was OK for Lot to sexually assault his daughters after he tried to pimp them.

And a biblical marriage is simply a personal agreement between two people to shack up together, and doesn't require a legally sign marriage contract, or a marriage celebrant, or witnesses, or any of the other wedding hoo ha.
 

Monty

Active Member
Sure if a god made them, he would have put them to stone for adam and the whole lineage.

Maybe HE knew the people of israel would not follow them anyway.

I dont think of a god as another sitting on a thrown.
Once upon a time gods used to drop around for a chat and have a drink or two and a snack (Gen 18).
 
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