Are crystals magic?

[jarofthoughts]

same page. i just mess around with psychological magic for the funz.
hmm lets change our title or what ever to empiricists?

Fair game. ^_^
Might confuse people, but what the hell.
That's their problem, right?

 

[Iti oj]

Fair game. ^_^
Might confuse people, but what the hell.
That's their problem, right?

people will be confused with or with out our help. lol and just changed mine =D

 

[jarofthoughts]

people will be confused with or with out our help. lol and just changed mine =D

Although, you did misspell it.

 

[Iti oj]

Although, you did misspell it.

just gotta add the the confusion? :yes::no::run:

 

[jarofthoughts]

just gotta add the the confusion? :yes::no::run:

Indeed.

 

[Iti oj]

Indeed.

soo do you think their might be some empirical reason to meditate with a crystal over just mediation?
idk why i quoted.

 

[jarofthoughts]

soo do you think their might be some empirical reason to meditate with a crystal over just mediation?
idk why i quoted.

Human psychology is complicated and it is arguably one of the weakest of the sciences when it comes to its empirical backing, not because it is particularily mystical, but because empirical data, until recently, was limited to statistical data. That is for the exception of purely physiological functions which of course gave us some idea of the various parts of the brain and their general function.
With the use of fMRI technology and other advances in science we are finally coming to a point where we can investigate the processes of the mind to a greater and more detailed extent and I think the next couple of decades will be very interesting in that respect.

As for the crystals, I think any focus will do as long as it is implemented properly. I've done some meditating myself (I studied Chado for some years) and brain scans have shown clear similarities between, say, Buddhist and Catholic meditation, so, no, I do not think that the crystals have any real importance. After all, as has been pointed out several times in this tread, when you get right down to it, they are just rocks.

 

[Iti oj]

Human psychology is complicated and it is arguably one of the weakest of the sciences when it comes to its empirical backing, not because it is particularily mystical, but because empirical data, until recently, was limited to statistical data. That is for the exception of purely physiological functions which of course gave us some idea of the various parts of the brain and their general function.
With the use of fMRI technology and other advances in science we are finally coming to a point where we can investigate the processes of the mind to a greater and more detailed extent and I think the next couple of decades will be very interesting in that respect.

As for the crystals, I think any focus will do as long as it is implemented properly. I've done some meditating myself (I studied Chado for some years) and brain scans have shown clear similarities between, say, Buddhist and Catholic meditation, so, no, I do not think that the crystals have any real importance. After all, as has been pointed out several times in this tread, when you get right down to it, they are just rocks.

indeed more of a catalysis/foci then anything else. I think it may help some people reach said state easier. some require it some do not. i personal like to do "dance meditation"

 

[jarofthoughts]

indeed more of a catalysis/foci then anything else. I think it may help some people reach said state easier. some require it some do not. i personal like to do "dance meditation"

Like I said earlier; each to his own.

I only have a problem with it when people start calling it something it ain't and claiming forces and energies and magic, and whatnot.
THEN they have made a scientific claim, which means that they are suddently subject to scientific evidence, and of course, they ALWAYS come up short.

As the old saying goes; "Better to keep one's mouth closed and be thought an idiot than to open it and remove all doubt".

 

[nnmartin]

Ezekiel28:13
You were in Eden, the garden of God; every precious stone adorned you: ruby, topaz and emerald, chrysolite, onyx and jasper, sapphire, turquoise and beryl. Your settings and mountings were made of gold; on the day you were created they were prepared.


Why would the Lord bedeck his chosen cherub in such magical ornaments if they were only pieces of rock? The fact that God chose the stones makes them magical for eternity.

The story goes on to say that this cherub turned into Satan which is often why Christians have little love for crystals and the New Age movement - however this is also acknowledging the power within the crystal.

 

[blackout]

... but I swear if I hear one more La Vey fan telling me how I just need to seek the mysteries of the ancients...

Is that something you've seen much/any of on this forum?

Generally LHPers don't care much what others do in general,
nevermind telling them what they NEED to do, or seek or anything.

I just can't see a "LaVey" 'fan' telling you any such thing at all really.
Seek the "mysteries of the ancients?"
Most "LaVey fans" are athiests.
Maybe telling you to get out of their face and go do your own thing,
in your own space......

I dunno. It seemed like such a bizarre comment,
I couldn't help comment on it.

PS-I'm no LaVey fan, so perhaps I've missed something.

 

[nnmartin]

I only have a problem with it when people start calling it something it ain't and claiming forces and energies and magic, and whatnot.

A fear of the unknown is another way of saying that.

If you can't prove it, then to you it must be false and up for ridicule.

No doubt you think anyone who believes in any religion is deluded.

There must be a lot of deluded people in your world - I guess it is your calling to put them right (note:sarcasm)

 

[dawny0826]

I'm quite into crystals and I'm interested to know why people who say they are tools of Satan etc.. think such things - is there any biblical reference that supports this idea?

How about other religions - Buddhism, Hinduism, Islam, mainstream Christianity etc.. is there any place for crystals with you or in your religion?

I am quite happy to have a crystal in one hand and a religious text in the other - there seems to be some kind of force coming out of the crystal - could be Jesus, Pagan Force or other - any views on this?

Are they magic?

Today, I feel like I've stepped into a new age-y type warp. And I don't mean that unkindly in any way. Father Heathen and I played with Lord of the Ring tarot cards. (My reading sucked!)

And I just commented on magic in another thread.

I don't believe that crystals have magic. I believe that magic comes from people. I don't believe that crystals are of Satan anymore than I believe that ouija boards or tarot cards are of Satan. Any power or "magic" comes from the person behind the "tool".

I believe the energy or magic behind it comes from whatever source you're channeling.

Christians, have healed sick, cast demons, etc. for years in the name of Christ. I believe very strongly in the miracles of the Holy Spirit. I believe very strongly that with good intentions and when it's the will of the Holy Spirit, one can do amazing things.

I think people should be cautious when playing with such toys and I think intention is an important thing to keep in mind.

 

[nnmartin]

that is similar to what I have been saying really.

Crystals are like magic channeling tools - similar to a radio receiver in the day to day world.

 

[nnmartin]

This guy arguing that crystals have magickal powers specifically said this:

it can enter into us temporarily through the crystal if you believe in it.

You see, he does understand that it is purely psychological and not mystical, but he has not fully accepted that. Once he does, he will get even more accomplished.

pure semantics here.

if you believe in it you can use it - if you don't believe you can't. It still exists either way though.

 

[dawny0826]

that is similar to what I have been saying really.

Crystals are like magic channeling tools - similar to a radio receiver in the day to day world.

I suppose I believe one can do "magical" things without the use of tools at all, really. I think you could accomplish the same thing through words...if you wanted to. Your words would have the same weight as a crystal would, if that makes any sense.

Anyway, I get what you're saying.

 

[nnmartin]

Living things have a magic in them - humans, animals , plants etc.. - some essence of the Lord/Force is present within.

The same is true of crystals - they are in a unique category though due to the fact that they are regarded as inanimate objects.

Nevertheless, the God-Force works in many ways.

 

[xkatz]

I don't see crystals as special or anything. At best, they are aesthetically appealing.

 

[Tiberius]

as for light sabers and Obi0ne Konobi etc.. it is really the word Force that you have an issue with.

if I were to change the word to Holy Spirit or Divine Energy I think you would be more accommodating.

semantics yet again.

Nah, not really. It's still a bunch of technobabble that has no real meaning and no way to test its validity.

No, because different crystals have different properties.

What they look and feel like is important.

Please go into greater depth with this. How does the different appearance lead to a change in the magical qualities?

People say there is no such thing as UFO's , I think they are wrong there too.

Of course. A UFO is just any object in the sky that is not identified. Doesn't mean it is aliens or anything.

Magic in regards to tricks etc.. I agree, but there is Earth Magic or Spirituality if you prefer.

Prove it.

That reasoning would have to equally apply to The Bible and Koran then, in fact to all other aspects of all religions or spiritual beliefs.

That would imply that all religions are equally true.

I've already said that God wishes to remain hidden.

Then why do you believe?

Ezekiel28:13
You were in Eden, the garden of God; every precious stone adorned you: ruby, topaz and emerald, chrysolite, onyx and jasper, sapphire, turquoise and beryl. Your settings and mountings were made of gold; on the day you were created they were prepared.


Why would the Lord bedeck his chosen cherub in such magical ornaments if they were only pieces of rock? The fact that God chose the stones makes them magical for eternity.

Why would a man give his wife a wedding ring if it is just a piece of metal? The fact that he chose the ring makes it magical for all eternity.

Oh, and if you take the Bible as just a bunch of stories written by people who thought crystals were magical, then their inclusion in the story becomes much clearer.

 

[Iti oj]

Like I said earlier; each to his own.

I only have a problem with it when people start calling it something it ain't and claiming forces and energies and magic, and whatnot.
THEN they have made a scientific claim, which means that they are suddently subject to scientific evidence, and of course, they ALWAYS come up short.

As the old saying goes; "Better to keep one's mouth closed and be thought an idiot than to open it and remove all doubt".

its better to say to much then to never say what you need too. besides if i wasn't constantly saying stupid things then people wouldn't be correcting me and i wouldn't learn new things.

it seem a good number of magic users on this forum only use magic/terms/etc symbolical,