Ask your questions about God here.

[Mike182]

Actually God did not send the bears, there is also no such thing as "miracles".(This is also explained in the book) All the things you hear about in the Bible that seems like a miracle is nothing more then atomic manipulation. It is like taking a microwave oven back to their time and putting food in it. They would claim it as a miracle as you push and few buttons and BOOM the food is heated. Yet we all know today that a microwave simply heats food by increasing the friction of molecules within the food. Mankind uses tools to cause atomic manipulation, however God can teach/show man how to manipulate atoms without the use of a tool. Jesus, Moses, many disciples, and obviously Elisha are all examples. There is actually a passage from the Qur'an that deals with the misues of this knowledge:

SURAH 2 – 102:

They followed what the evil ones gave out falsely against the power of Solomon: the blasphemers were, not Solomon, but the evil ones, teaching men magic, and such things as came down at Babylon to the angels Harut and Marut. But neither of these taught anyone such things without saying: “We are only for trial; so do not blaspheme.” They learned from them the means to sow discord between man and wife. But they could not thus harm anyone except by Allah’s permission. And they learned what harmed them, not what profited them. And they knew that the buyers of magic would have no share in the happiness of the hereafter. And vile was the price for which they did sell their souls, if they but knew!

I also am a little confused about where you feel God lied. I went over the story of Abraham again and cannot find it. Could you please state the verse where you feel God lied?

then we have no common ground or understanding for continuing this discussion.

thanks for chatting.
Mike.

 

[.lava]

We will disagree then. God gives men many Gifts so that man may understand Him and live by His Plan. I will not argue with your value of Muhammad, however I see it as error. All the Gifts that God provides man with, should be seen as equal. The Christians overvalued the Gift of Jesus and made Him an equal to God, was this not in error? Was not a primary reason that God gave the Gift of Knowledge and Wisdom to Muhammad to correct this error? Muhammad was truly a Gift to mankind from God, however so was Abraham, Moses, Jesus, David, and others.

loving a Prophet is loving God. not because they are equal. because prophet was chosen by God. so what's the error here? what's wrong with loving someone that God loves?

do you know what shirk is? during time of Muhammad(PBUH) there were idols and people were worshiping them. that is called shirk. basicly shirk is putting something else in -place- of God. there is also something called 'hidden shirk'. in todays world you maynot find shirk in Muslims but there might be hidden shirk. hidden shirk means putting your own ego in the -place- of God.

i guess that's your claim about me. i donot see Prophets equal to God, not at all. but i know they are chosen to be Prophets because they had stronger faith than ordinary people like me. they knew God better than me because they were definetly closer to God. i respect that. i naturally love them.
i find it very tricky if you think you are equal to a Prophet for that matter. you can't be. that's reason why they were Prophets. they were special men and God didnot pick them up among crowd of people randomly.

(4:69) All who obey Allah and the Messenger are in the Company of those on whom is the Grace of Allah, of the Prophets (who teach), the sincere (lovers of Truth), the witnesses (who testify), and the righteous (who do good): ah! what a beautiful Fellowship!

as you see, no creature could be equal to God but obeying Prophet is obeying God.

You must understand that this is another reason I will not join a religion. I cannot convince a Christian that Muhammad is equal to Jesus, just like I cannot convince a Jew that Jesus is equal to Moses. I refuse to be involved with man's struggle for dominance over each other through the use of religion. We are all Children of God, no race, color, religion, or any other form of seperation that mankind dreams up, will seperate us. On Judgement Day, God will Judge you no differently then He judges me. If God does not view different peoples through different eyes, why should we view each other through different eyes?

religion is not a social club. you'd still be an individual as you are now, someone who has his own personal perception. of course it is your life and you are responsible of your choices, not religious people who pushed you away. to earn heaven you've gotto surrender God. but how are you gonna do that? do you know?

that's true. we would be judged under the same rules. of course.

Another lesson taught in the book is that God wants us to mimic Him.(To our capacity) To give our neighbors love, compassion, free will, freedom from oppression, etc... The only tool that satan uses against man is temptation, to seperate us from God. What better way for satan to succeed, but to start by seperating us from ourselves, through mankind creating "groups" of men.(race, religion, money, language, etc...) God did not create religions, mankind did.

satan has ways as many as people.
God did creat religion with Adam (PBUH) but it is people who made different comment on the same stuff and therefor people separated. instead of the source, they followed men and instead of surrendering God they fought with each other. there is only one religion. just one, just like God.

You must understand that even in the end satan(Ibliss) will still bow to God:

SURAH 59 – 16:

Their allies deceived them like the Evil One, when he says to man, “Deny Allah”: but when man denies Allah, the Evil One says, “I am free of you: I do fear Allah, the Lord of the Worlds!”

yes, i know that.

I am afraid we have reached a glass ceiling here. As I do not wish to anger you by disagreeing with how you interpret, or were taught, the lessons of the Qur'an. I believe that you will see fault where no fault exists and therefore fault will be created. Study the Qur'an and listen to what God reveals, and do not let men lead you astray.

i say what i want to say and that is exactly what i want to do.
there are two kinds of verses in Qur'an. some need interpretion and some don't. i can't recall getting into explaining ones with inner meaning.

 

[billabong]

which God do you want us to ask about?

There is only One. And if you have to ask then you dont know Him.

 

[Willamena]

There is only One. And if you have to ask then you dont know Him.

Not necessarily. He could be asking to clarify if the other knows him.

 

[K.Venugopal]

yes, i know Qur'an in English is full of 'he' because of the nature of language. my teachers would use 'he' in case they're speaking in English. for the same reason.

no i don't know others who do. but i know religious people does not call Allah 'God'. since we have specific names for each; God, Goddess and Allah. i mean we have separate names for God & Goddess as well in our language.

Calling "It" Allah or God or Ishwar depends on which language you are using. Allah is an Arabic word, pure and simple. God is an English word. So your assertion that "religious people does not call Allah 'God" ought to be corrected to "Arabic speaking religious people ..." Otherwise it would appear that all who do not call "It" Allah are irreligious - which may be Islam's position but quite questionable by those who don't accept this narrow vision of Islam.

 

[TruthaboutGod]

loving a Prophet is loving God. not because they are equal. because prophet was chosen by God. so what's the error here? what's wrong with loving someone that God loves?

do you know what shirk is? during time of Muhammad(PBUH) there were idols and people were worshiping them. that is called shirk. basicly shirk is putting something else in -place- of God. there is also something called 'hidden shirk'. in todays world you maynot find shirk in Muslims but there might be hidden shirk. hidden shirk means putting your own ego in the -place- of God.

i guess that's your claim about me. i donot see Prophets equal to God, not at all. but i know they are chosen to be Prophets because they had stronger faith than ordinary people like me. they knew God better than me because they were definetly closer to God. i respect that. i naturally love them.
i find it very tricky if you think you are equal to a Prophet for that matter. you can't be. that's reason why they were Prophets. they were special men and God didnot pick them up among crowd of people randomly.

(4:69) All who obey Allah and the Messenger are in the Company of those on whom is the Grace of Allah, of the Prophets (who teach), the sincere (lovers of Truth), the witnesses (who testify), and the righteous (who do good): ah! what a beautiful Fellowship!

as you see, no creature could be equal to God but obeying Prophet is obeying God.



religion is not a social club. you'd still be an individual as you are now, someone who has his own personal perception. of course it is your life and you are responsible of your choices, not religious people who pushed you away. to earn heaven you've gotto surrender God. but how are you gonna do that? do you know?

that's true. we would be judged under the same rules. of course.



satan has ways as many as people.
God did creat religion with Adam (PBUH) but it is people who made different comment on the same stuff and therefor people separated. instead of the source, they followed men and instead of surrendering God they fought with each other. there is only one religion. just one, just like God.



yes, i know that.
[/i][/font]


i say what i want to say and that is exactly what i want to do.
there are two kinds of verses in Qur'an. some need interpretion and some don't. i can't recall getting into explaining ones with inner meaning.

As I have stated you will create fault where fault does not exist. You state that:
"i find it very tricky if you think you are equal to a Prophet for that matter." This has already been discussed and I have already denied being a prophet, what prophecy have I stated? I do not claim or even think of myself as equal to a prophet, the knowledge and wisom in the book was given by God, what then have I given you?

You have also stated: "they were special men and God didnot pick them up among crowd of people randomly." Yet how can you dictate how God picks a "special man":

SURAH 17 – 94 and 95:

What kept men back from Belief when Guidance came to them, was nothing but this: they said, “Has Allah sent a man like us to be His Messenger?” Say, “If there were settled on earth angels walking about in peace and quiet, We should certainly have sent them down from the heavens an angel for a Messenger.

SURAH 43 – 23 and 24:

Just in the same way, whenever We sent a Warner before you to any people, the wealthy ones among them said: “We found our father following a certain religion, and we will certainly follow in their footsteps.” He said: “What! Even if I brought you better guidance then that which you found your fathers following?” They said: “For us, we deny that you prophets are sent on a mission at all.”

SURAH 22 – 75:

Allah chooses Messengers from angels and from men for Allah is He Who hears and sees all things.

SURAH 35 – 24:

Verily, We have sent you in truth, as a bearer of glad tidings, and as a warner: and there never was a people, without a warner having lived among them in the past.

Honestly there is no more I can do to help you. You may ask questions, however you will not accept the answers. You are blinded by religion and close your eyes to the other Gifts of Knowledge and Wisdom that God has provided you. Let us go in peace:


SURAH 109 – 4 through 6:

And I will not worship that which you have been wont to worship,
Nor will you worship that which I worship.
To you be your Way and to me mine.

 

[TruthaboutGod]

Calling "It" Allah or God or Ishwar depends on which language you are using. Allah is an Arabic word, pure and simple. God is an English word. So your assertion that "religious people does not call Allah 'God" ought to be corrected to "Arabic speaking religious people ..." Otherwise it would appear that all who do not call "It" Allah are irreligious - which may be Islam's position but quite questionable by those who don't accept this narrow vision of Islam.

Speaking of Islam, I wonder if any know the Truth about it?

Islam is defined as: "submission" to God. If you agree with this definition, then you must also agree that every human is Islamic. You will, one way or another, submit to God.

 

[Mike182]

There is only One. And if you have to ask then you dont know Him.

i disagree, in my experience there are many. if you don't know that.... then you obviously disagree with me, and it's not my place to proselytise you. please show others on this forum the same respect.

 

[K.Venugopal]

Speaking of Islam, I wonder if any know the Truth about it?

Islam is defined as: "submission" to God. If you agree with this definition, then you must also agree that every human is Islamic. You will, one way or another, submit to God.

I would say it is egoistic of Allah to wish a mere mortal, a mortal whom He has created as per His wishes, to submit to Him. This is the greatest failing of Islam, that it teaches the purpose of mankind is to be a slave of Allah. There are religions which teach that the purpose of mankind is to discover its divinity and I think such religions are much more advanced than Islam.

 

[TruthaboutGod]

I would say it is egoistic of Allah to wish a mere mortal, a mortal whom He has created as per His wishes, to submit to Him. This is the greatest failing of Islam, that it teaches the purpose of mankind is to be a slave of Allah. There are religions which teach that the purpose of mankind is to discover its divinity and I think such religions are much more advanced than Islam.

This would GREATLY depend on your definition of "submit".

Definitions of submit on the Web:

• [SIZE=-1]
• refer for judgment or consideration; "She submitted a proposal to the agency"
• put before; "I submit to you that the accused is guilty"
• yield to the control of another
• present: hand over formally
• relegate: refer to another person for decision or judgment; "She likes to relegate difficult questions to her colleagues"
• submit or yield to another's wish or opinion; "The government bowed to the military pressure"
• take: accept or undergo, often unwillingly; "We took a pay cut"
• put in: make an application as for a job or funding; "We put in a grant to the NSF"
• render: make over as a return; "They had to render the estate"
• resign: accept as inevitable; "He resigned himself to his fate"
  wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

If God wanted us to be "slaves" we would then have no free will, which we do. Look over those definitions:

refer for judgment or consideration;
relegate: refer to another person for decision or judgment;

Again it depends on which definition you choose to accept, truly though, God does not expect you to be a slave.(I honestly feel you already know this)[/SIZE]

 

[.lava]

Calling "It" Allah or God or Ishwar depends on which language you are using. Allah is an Arabic word, pure and simple. God is an English word. So your assertion that "religious people does not call Allah 'God" ought to be corrected to "Arabic speaking religious people ..." Otherwise it would appear that all who do not call "It" Allah are irreligious - which may be Islam's position but quite questionable by those who don't accept this narrow vision of Islam.

hi,

i guess i am misunderstood. my bad.

ok, if we were talking about Greek Myths, i would not call Zeus 'Allah'. i would call it God. when i want to refer to the creator, i would say Allah, not God. in my daily life that is how it is.
when i say 'he likes to play God' i use the word God. i do not say Allah.

am i confusing more and more?

this has nothing to do with being religious or not. this is matter of language. as i said before, we have different name for the name God. i can say 'oh my God' and i can also say 'oh my Allah' or 'my Rab'
in English we do not have that option. so while i speak to English speaking person, i might use the word God to make it easier or just because i respect that person.
when my teachers speak to Americans for example, they use word God. because that's how it is in their mother language. but my teachers would not use the word God, when they speak to me.
so, i am not against anything here. it is absolutely normal people speak their language. i just personally do not want to call Allah 'he'. only word in English that directs to third one without any gender is 'it'. that's why i prefer to use that one.

is it clear now?

 

[K.Venugopal]

only word in English that directs to third one without any gender is 'it'. that's why i prefer to use that one.

In English, babies may be referred to as "it" irrespective of the baby's gender and not because babies don't have gender.

 

[.lava]

In English, babies may be referred to as "it" irrespective of the baby's gender and not because babies don't have gender.

so K.Venugopal, why did you wonder? it is not a big deal if you ask me just like my other personal stuff. i wonder why you've been curious about this. i also wonder if you understood me.

 

[K.Venugopal]

so K.Venugopal, why did you wonder? it is not a big deal if you ask me just like my other personal stuff. i wonder why you've been curious about this. i also wonder if you understood me.

Not now. I am afraid not.

 

[TruthaboutGod]

hi,

i guess i am misunderstood. my bad.

ok, if we were talking about Greek Myths, i would not call Zeus 'Allah'. i would call it God. when i want to refer to the creator, i would say Allah, not God. in my daily life that is how it is.
when i say 'he likes to play God' i use the word God. i do not say Allah.

am i confusing more and more?

this has nothing to do with being religious or not. this is matter of language. as i said before, we have different name for the name God. i can say 'oh my God' and i can also say 'oh my Allah' or 'my Rab'
in English we do not have that option. so while i speak to English speaking person, i might use the word God to make it easier or just because i respect that person.
when my teachers speak to Americans for example, they use word God. because that's how it is in their mother language. but my teachers would not use the word God, when they speak to me.
so, i am not against anything here. it is absolutely normal people speak their language. i just personally do not want to call Allah 'he'. only word in English that directs to third one without any gender is 'it'. that's why i prefer to use that one.

is it clear now?

LOL it does seem a little confusing, but I think I understand what you are trying to say. As far as I am concerned: God = Allah - Allah = God. I am sure you will disagree on this but in the book it is stated that when referring to God or one of His Messengers the first letter is always capitalized. For example: he = a male person - He = God or one of His Messengers - god(s) = mythical figure(s) - God = God. If I were reffering to Moses, Jesus, or Muhammad, and were not reffering to them by name it would be: "He". This is not to equate a Messenger with God, this is a simple way that I show respect.

 

[TruthaboutGod]

In English, babies may be referred to as "it" irrespective of the baby's gender and not because babies don't have gender.

Yes but we also refer to our children as "kids". A "kid" is actually a young goat, it is really silly if you think about it.

 

[.lava]

As I have stated you will create fault where fault does not exist. You state that:
"i find it very tricky if you think you are equal to a Prophet for that matter." This has already been discussed and I have already denied being a prophet, what prophecy have I stated? I do not claim or even think of myself as equal to a prophet, the knowledge and wisom in the book was given by God, what then have I given you?

i never said you're claiming to be a Prophet. already denied it? would not make difference if you did not. i know you're not.

You have also stated: "they were special men and God didnot pick them up among crowd of people randomly." Yet how can you dictate how God picks a "special man":

God knows who's loyal and who's not. there are verses in Qur'an about people who has faith in God in good days yet rebelled when a disaster hits. all the Prophets had highly difficult lives. even when they were tortured to death, they did not betrayal their cause. they were not just patient. they did own patience.

Honestly there is no more I can do to help you. You may ask questions, however you will not accept the answers. You are blinded by religion and close your eyes to the other Gifts of Knowledge and Wisdom that God has provided you. Let us go in peace:

i began to talk to you just because you said 'God can not...'
is that why you think i need help?
all the answers that i need is written in Qur'an. even 'you' are in there, in some verses, you're described. in fact everyone is. i don't think it is useful to give you advices.


that voice -is not God. i am sorry. bye.

 

[TruthaboutGod]

i never said you're claiming to be a Prophet. already denied it? would not make difference if you did not. i know you're not.



God knows who's loyal and who's not. there are verses in Qur'an about people who has faith in God in good days yet rebelled when a disaster hits. all the Prophets had highly difficult lives. even when they were tortured to death, they did not betrayal their cause. they were not just patient. they did own patience.



i began to talk to you just because you said 'God can not...'
is that why you think i need help?
all the answers that i need is written in Qur'an. even 'you' are in there, in some verses, you're described. in fact everyone is. i don't think it is useful to give you advices.


that voice -is not God. i am sorry. bye.

You kind of confused me here. I do not think that you need help at all, the differences we have stated between ourselves have no bearing whatsoever on whether or not you are following God's Plan. With me there are only 2 questions that need answered:

1. Do you accept or deny God?
From what you have stated, you accept God.
2. Are you living within or outside of God's Plan?
From what you have stated you are living within God's Plan.

The differences we have are based upon religion, and I am not religious, so they do not bother me. I started this thread to answer questions, not give advice, so far I feel that I have asnwered your questions. Whether you feel that God has guided me or not has nothing to do with you accepting God, or living within God's Plan. I have no problem with you, carry on


P.S. I do feel a little akward having never given you a quote from the Bible, everything we have discussed as been from the Qur'an. As such I would like to put a little something here:

Isaiah 56 – 3 and 5:

Do not let the son of a foreigner who has joined himself to the Lord speak saying, “The lord has utterly separated me from His people”; Nor let the eunuch say, “Here I am, a dry tree.”
Even to them I will give in My house and within my walls a place and a name better then that of sons and daughters; I will give them an everlasting name that shall not be cut off.”

 

[TruthaboutGod]

As it seems I have a break from questions, I will check back in a few days to see if there are anymore. If anyone has any questions they want privately answered, just shoot me a PM.

 

[.lava]

You kind of confused me here. I do not think that you need help at all, the differences we have stated between ourselves have no bearing whatsoever on whether or not you are following God's Plan.

what differences do you think we have?
i don't mind having different beliefs. i would not stick to any atheist here to try to explain something else by quoting verses from Qur'an. i would share though. but what i am doing with you is not exactly sharing.

you know why i replied you. i explained it.

honesty is a virtue. if you are honest then it means you accomplished one thing. being honest is the only reason why you would not tell lie. you would not be honest just because you 'can not' lie. it is always a choice. God does not lie, it is not because God can not lie.

you said God has no weaknesses. so would you please tell me how is that gonna work?
no weaknesses + can not = ?

Venga! solve this problem and untie!

With me there are only 2 questions that need answered:

1. Do you accept or deny God?
From what you have stated, you accept God.
2. Are you living within or outside of God's Plan?
From what you have stated you are living within God's Plan.

i have faith in Allah.

what do you mean by plan? do you think God has a secret agenda?

The differences we have are based upon religion, and I am not religious, so they do not bother me.

you're not religious then what are you? please define your position.

I started this thread to answer questions, not give advice, so far I feel that I have answered your questions. Whether you feel that God has guided me or not has nothing to do with you accepting God, or living within God's Plan. I have no problem with you, carry on

yes, ok.
i have questions. please explain how do you accept the subject 'All-knowing' as 'cannot see future'? what is that 'ALL' stand for?

P.S. I do feel a little akward having never given you a quote from the Bible, everything we have discussed as been from the Qur'an. As such I would like to put a little something here:

Isaiah 56 – 3 and 5:

Do not let the son of a foreigner who has joined himself to the Lord speak saying, “The lord has utterly separated me from His people”; Nor let the eunuch say, “Here I am, a dry tree.”
Even to them I will give in My house and within my walls a place and a name better then that of sons and daughters; I will give them an everlasting name that shall not be cut off.”

so we discussed Qur'an? ahh come on!! we are far away from discussing it.
tell me basic concepts of Qur'an. so maybe we discuss.

Isaiah? is that a name?

ps: a friend here says that i insulted you. i did not mean to do that. i apologize if i did it.