• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Baha'i and Science

wandering peacefully

Which way to the woods?
Ahimsa is respect for all life, as a result of the view that God permeates all things. (monism, as opposed to dualism) Any disrespect for life is disrespect for God.
I am guessing that gays who are in a committed and loving relationship are not banned from joining Hinduism? Or are they basically told they are defective humans with medical problems that need to be cured or hidden in order to be considered 'true' Hindu? Because if not, that would be an actual example of unity in diversity and not just claiming it.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
I am guessing that gays who are in a committed and loving relationship are not banned from joining Hinduism? Or are they basically told they are defective humans with medical problems that need to be cured or hidden in order to be considered 'true' Hindu? Because if not, that would be an actual example of unity in diversity and not just claiming it.
Gays are not banned from joining and being active members of the Baha'i Faith.
Gays are not told they are defective humans with medical problems that need to be cured or hidden in order to be considered Baha'is.
I am getting sick of hearing these lies and I won't tolerate them anymore.
 

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member
Gays are not banned from joining and being active members of the Baha'i Faith.
Gays are not told they are defective humans with medical problems that need to be cured or hidden in order to be considered Baha'is.
I am getting sick of hearing these lies and I won't tolerate them anymore.

?
 

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member
I am guessing that gays who are in a committed and loving relationship are not banned from joining Hinduism? Or are they basically told they are defective humans with medical problems that need to be cured or hidden in order to be considered 'true' Hindu? Because if not, that would be an actual example of unity in diversity and not just claiming it.

When I was looking this up on Wikipedia, it WAS a firm debate for awhile, but I think they mostly accept it now, and recognize that some of their old stories contain Third Gender in them.

I'm talking about Hinduism.
 

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member
Gays are not banned from joining and being active members of the Baha'i Faith.
Gays are not told they are defective humans with medical problems that need to be cured or hidden in order to be considered Baha'is.
I am getting sick of hearing these lies and I won't tolerate them anymore.

I'd really like to hear the way you go with this though, as Shoghi DID make those statements we find so controversial. And if you wanted to make the statement that gays are accepted if they don't have gay sex... well you say potato, we say po-ta-toe.
 

wandering peacefully

Which way to the woods?
When I was looking this up on Wikipedia, it WAS a firm debate for awhile, but I think they mostly accept it now, and recognize that some of their old stories contain Third Gender in them.

I'm talking about Hinduism.
Thanks. It seems more reasonable than the judgemental Abrahamics. And they don't expect everyone on the planet to be homogeneous and ruled under a single theocracy. I just don't understand how anyone could consider that a good thing.
 

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member
Thanks. It seems more reasonable than the judgemental Abrahamics. And they don't expect everyone on the planet to be homogeneous and ruled under a single theocracy. I just don't understand how anyone could consider that a good thing.

Not to mention, I don't want to say this for a fact, but I believe Hinduism is older than the book of Genesis.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
I'd really like to hear the way you go with this though, as Shoghi DID make those statements we find so controversial. And if you wanted to make the statement that gays are accepted if they don't have gay sex... well you say potato, we say po-ta-toe.
Extracts from letters written by or on behalf of the Universal House of Justice:

As you know, Bahá'u'lláh has clearly forbidden the expression of sexual love between individuals of the same sex. However, the doors are open for all of humanity to enter the Cause of God, irrespective of their present circumstance; this invitation applies to homosexuals as well as to any others who are engaged in practices contrary to the Bahá'í teachings. Associated with this invitation is the expectation that all believers will make a sincere and persistent effort to eradicate those aspects of their conduct which are not in conformity with Divine Law. In the case of homosexuality, the Guardian has stated, in a letter written on his behalf on 26 March 1950, that "through the advice and help of doctors, through a strong and determined effort, and through prayer, a soul can overcome this handicap!".

Homosexuality
 

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
It is the unity of mankind. It is not under anyone's banner.
But that is what your Master, Abdul Baha, is saying.

''which is to occur in the Day of the manifestation of that Incomparable Branch [Bahaullah] is the hoisting of the Standard of God among all nations. By this is meant that all nations and kindreds will be gathered together under the shadow of this Divine Banner, which is no other than the Lordly Branch itself, and will become a single nation.''

Self-praise and nothing else. You see, this is 21st Century and not a community of unlettered and ignorant Iranian Muslims among whom Bahaullah preached. The days of Lords and Dames are gone. Even the days of Allah are numbered.
 
Last edited:

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
I am guessing that gays who are in a committed and loving relationship are not banned from joining Hinduism? Or are they basically told they are defective humans with medical problems that need to be cured or hidden in order to be considered 'true' Hindu? Because if not, that would be an actual example of unity in diversity and not just claiming it.
No. They are not. Actually we have a religious order dedicated solely to LGBTQ. That is known as Kinnar Akhada. This is the Chief of Kinnar Akhada. She is a qualified electrical engineer. They are respected by common people who seek their blessings. A blessing from LGBTQ to new-borns is considered very ausicious and is sort of a must. We treat LGBTQ, in life and in law, as any other people. They play important parts in our mythology. We have Gods and Goddesses who are partial to LGBTQ - Yellamma, Iravan, Bahuchara Mata and possibly more. The last thing that has to come is acceptance of gay-marriage, and we hope that Indian law will accept it soon. However, as Hindus, we do not go about seeking adherents. We consider that demeaning.

images

images
kumbh-festival-allahabad-india-shutterstock-editorial-10048962c.jpg
 
Last edited:

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
Who cares what Revelations means? Everyone thinks they know, but nobody knows and nobody agrees, so why bother trying to figure out what it means? What an utter waste of time because it does not prove a damn thing.
Your religion is supposed to be the fulfillment of it. Duh. If it's meaningless why do Baha'is say they believe in the Bible. Say it's myth and I'll be fine.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Your religion is supposed to be the fulfillment of it. Duh. If it's meaningless why do Baha'is say they believe in the Bible. Say it's myth and I'll be fine.
I did not say it is meaningless, I said nobody would ever agree on the meaning.
No matter what meanings Baha'is come up with Christians will disagree and that is why it is a waste of time to try to use it to prove anything. Of course that is true of the entire Bible. :rolleyes:
 
Last edited:

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
.. but I think they mostly accept it now, and recognize that some of their old stories contain Third Gender in them. I'm talking about Hinduism.
Read the story of Shikhandini from Mahabharata. It is a famous and poignant story. She was a women (Amba) abducted by Bhishma, the Kaurava warrior, for marriage to his nephew. But before the marriage could have taken place, the nephew died. The person who she earlier wanted to marry refused to accept her. Shikhandini asked a sage to give her a new life as a male warrior so that she could take her revenge from Bhishma, because she knew Bhishma would not fight with her if she remained in the form of a female. That is not considered fair in Hinduism. For that she jumped into a fire sacrifice. The sage did give her a new life as a warrior but fumbled in the mantras to change her sex. When Shikhandini saw that she was still a woman, she complained. The sage corrected his mistake by changing her sex to that of a male (how easy is that in mythology :)). In the great Mahabharata war, Arjuna hid behind Shikhandi to shoot an arrow at Bhishma. Though that too was unfair in Hinduism, Krishna advised Arjuna to go ahead with it, because there was no other way Bhishma could be killed. Bhishma saw all that, but he felt guilty about his abduction of Amba wanted to pay for his error. He let Arjuna shoot him from behind Shikhandi, though he had power to do so.
 
Last edited:

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member
Read the story of Shikhandini from Mahabharata. It is a famous and poignant story. She was a women (Amba) abducted by Bhishma, the Kaurava warrior, for marriage to his nephew. But before the marriage could have taken, the nephew died. The person who she earlier wanted to marry refused to accept her. Shikhandini asked a sage to give her a new life as a male warrior so that she could take her revenge from Bhishma, because she knew Bhishma would not fight with her if she remained in the form of a female. That is not considered fair in Hinduism. For that she jumped into a fire sacrifice. The sage did give her a new life as a warrior but fumbled in the mantras to change her sex. When Shikhandini saw that she was still a woman, she comlained. The sage corrected his mistake by changing her sex to that of a male (how easy is that in mythology :)). In the great Mahabharata war, Arjuna hid behind Shikhandi to shoot an arrow at Bhishma. Though that too was unfair in Hinduism, Krishna advised Arjuna to go ahead with it, because there was no other way Bhishma could be killed. Bhishma saw all that, but he felt guilty about his abduction of Amba wanted to pay for his error. He let Arjuna shoot him from behind Shikhandi, though he had power to do so.

Great story. I was reading a view on the afterlife from apparently a Hindu website, and it was so deep I had to stop halfway through the 10 pages. And I mean that in a positive way.
 

kiwimac

Brother Napalm of God's Love
As long as women cannot be members of the UHJ the Baha'i faith is prejudiced against women. As long as homosexuals are treated as carrying a spiritual contagion, the Baha'i faith is a-scientific and just so long as people are declared "covenant breakers" and shunned for absurd reasons, the Baha'i faith is not universal.
 

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
You misunderstood.. By Word of God I was referring to the Bible. I was saying that interpretations of scriptures do not constitute the Word of God Bible) so can be ignored.

So what scholars and priests say is not authoritative and does not replace the Word of God in this case the Bible. So Baha’is are not disrespecting Jesus or the Bible by having a different interpretation than Chrustian scholars and priests because their interpretations are just their personal opinions.
Except... aah… No. Baha'is have pulled out the not written by eye-witnesses but rather by second and third hand source card. Who wrote the Bible? Who wrote the gospels? Were they passed down oral traditions? Did the events described really happen? All questionable things. Baha'is could have said "No". There is no question about it. The Bible was revealed to people by the Holy Spirit and is word for word true. But instead, Baha'is say "no". We can't say it's all true. Only the things Baha'u'llah and Abdul Baha' say is true we can trust as true.

Why keep pretending. You have your own beliefs, and some of them are very good, but when it comes to other religions, Baha'is make those other Scriptures fit into the Baha'i beliefs. Like reincarnation? A return of the "qualities" of a person? Seriously? People that believe in reincarnation are supposed say "Oh, now that makes sense. Gee, why did I ever believe such a silly thing as a soul going into a different physical body after the other body dies." So those that believe in reincarnation have made the wrong interpretation of Hindu Scriptures? Is that what you're saying?

But then Baha'is when they make an "interpretation" that really isn't an interpretation from man, it comes from an infallible prophet who got his information from God. So he's right and all the wise men of all the other religions, if they say different, are wrong. That is what the Baha'is are saying. And no matter what some Baha'is say, that is essentially saying your religion is newer, has the latest and best information and is therefore better than the other religions.
 

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
How about temporally "better" truths than the old truths that no longer work in the modern world. And that someday these truths too will be replaced with better ones more suited to the times?

What a complete distortion. Newer does not equate to better.

Only the social teachings and laws changes and the message for the age is new.
So these new social teachings are worse, the same, or better than the old ones? And don't blow what I say out of proportion to make yourself look good. Oh, and no Baha'i has told me what the new social teachings that were brought to humanity by Jesus. Would you happen to know?
 

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
Who cares what Revelations means? Everyone thinks they know, but nobody knows and nobody agrees, so why bother trying to figure out what it means? What an utter waste of time because it does not prove a damn thing.
Yeah, every thing else is falsehood accept what your trio of Gods, Bahaullah, Abdul Baha and Shoghi Efendi say. I understand that.
 
Top