Ban the Bible and the Qur'an?

[lewisnotmiller]

Really??

I can see that most of your poems have no rhyme and rhythm
I don't know why u call them poem???!!!

Yeah...if it don't rhyme HOW CAN IT BE A POEM!?

(Err..that was supposed to be ironic)

Re : the elegance of the Quran in its original firm...
What's your opinion of Ibn al-Rawandi and his view on it?

 

[Jedster]

Oh, don't take on so. I've beaten this particular topic to death and I most certainly reject the Qur'an's unsound so-called "challenge". It's not a realistic or fair "challenge" and so no non-Muslims have ever taken it particularly seriously. It's only meaningful to Muslims who would not dare to try meet the challenge. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy, at best.

I found this conversation between a Sikh and A Muslim which makes what you said clear.

 

[interminable]

Yeah...if it don't rhyme HOW CAN IT BE A POEM!?

(Err..that was supposed to be ironic)

Re : the elegance of the Quran in its original firm...
What's your opinion of Ibn al-Rawandi and his view on it?

I don't know
Please tell me or send a link

 

[Laika]

I was going to tell @Laika that I wasn't especially keen on banning anything... but, your post gives me some pause... Jus' sayin'...

I find it deeply rewarding to be able to bring everyone together based on how wrong they think I am. Its refreshing as sometimes people need reminding how much they share in common....

...only for normal service to be resumed about page 2 when they start hating and attacking each other again.

Being so wrong and bringing people together momentarily is truly heart warming.

 

[Laika]

I don't see why we're explicitly equating 'antiquated' = 'bad'. The Bible and the Quran, for all their faults, also contain timeless positive moral guidelines as well as both being of immense literary value. I'm all for religious progression -- one of the central tenets of my faith -- but this is overkill.

Welcome to RF btw. :

Its not always this intresting, but I hope you enjoy your time here.

 

[Kirran]

It's not very hard to understand

U should provide a text that has a sensible meaning and at the same time literally and grammatically has no any faults like the Qur'an

There are many people who know Arabic while they aren't Muslims

So u write one if your text is like Qur'an they will give no time to Muslims to defend !

Besides this book was revealed when poets of Arab were proud of their poems and put them on کعبه
But Qur'an forced them to remove them.

Those who tried to bring like it have written something that makes u laugh.

After all Qur'an is really different from other texts in Arabic so that even prophet's words can't be compared to it

It all seems terribly subjective to me.

But seriously, are the criteria just 'have a sensible meaning and have no errors in grammar or meaning'? Thousands of texts qualify, although a kaffir like myself is inclined to doubt whether the Qur'an is among them.

 

[interminable]

It all seems terribly subjective to me.

But seriously, are the criteria just 'have a sensible meaning and have no errors in grammar or meaning'? Thousands of texts qualify, although a kaffir like myself is inclined to doubt whether the Qur'an is among them.

The person that wants to bring like the Qur'an should read it and consider it's eloquence and then start to write

Since there is no such a book like Qur'an the only way would be this.

I told that in my previous post because in past some tried to do so But their works had lots of grammar mistakes and considering the meaning of them were completely funny and nonsense.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

I don't know
Please tell me or send a link

I thought you might have been aware of some native-speaking critics of the Quran, given your dismissal of the English speaking ones.

For example;

Also...

Ibn al-Rawandi - Wikipedia

 

[Ben Avraham]

Ban the Bible and the Qur'an!

Hold onto that, at least as the Bible is concerned! Otherwise, how could we ever know that the Primal Cause caused the Universe to exist? We all know that the Universe could not have caused itself to exist. Some One Who preceded it must have done that job!

 

[Kirran]

The person that wants to bring like the Qur'an should read it and consider it's eloquence and then start to write

Since there is no such a book like Qur'an the only way would be this.

I told that in my previous post because in past some tried to do so But their works had lots of grammar mistakes and considering the meaning of them were completely funny and nonsense.

All subjective though. It isn't a proper test because the conditions and requirements aren't defined with any specificity.

 

[Kirran]

I thought you might have been aware of some native-speaking critics of the Quran, given your dismissal of the English speaking ones.

For example;

Also...

Ibn al-Rawandi - Wikipedia

People with different views? Come now!

 

[LuisDantas]

I told u
Both should be considered not only its message simply because there are always some people that argue its content and say it's not logical while in fact it's against their passions

Many people say so. Many others disagree. I am among those who disagree.

Even I wanna say that it's just the opposite
First eloquence then the meaningful message

Look
What did God want from sending this book?

I don't think it was a God-sent book at all, so the question does not present itself.

But if I did believe it to be God-sent, I would ask why he is avoiding meaningful content so persistently. The Qur'an's message roughly compares to nationalism, not to religion.

Just his aim was to make human being understand that u can't bring like this book while u can read and write

If you say so.

 

[interminable]

All subjective though. It isn't a proper test because the conditions and requirements aren't defined with any specificity.

This is simply because a miracle is.

But as it is a miracle opponents have no choice but to read and see its eloquence and then start to write

 

[interminable]

I thought you might have been aware of some native-speaking critics of the Quran, given your dismissal of the English speaking ones.

For example;

Also...

Ibn al-Rawandi - Wikipedia

That picture isn't clear enough and I read that link's content but what did that have to do with our discussion?

He may left Islam but did he prepare a good verses like the Qur'an to defeat it?
Or he just claimed that we can bring like it???

 

[Kirran]

This is simply because a miracle is.

But as it is a miracle opponents have no choice but to read and see its eloquence and then start to write

Personally I think many other texts are better than the Qur'an, but this is because they speak better to me while the Q speaks better to others.

Have you read the Daodejing or the Bhagavad Gita?

 

[interminable]

Personally I think many other texts are better than the Qur'an, but this is because they speak better to me while the Q speaks better to others.

Have you read the Daodejing or the Bhagavad Gita?

U mean u know Arabic?

I have no knowledge about them.

 

[Kirran]

U mean u know Arabic?

I have no knowledge about them.

Nope! And you don't know Sanskrit or Classical Chinese?

So if you have no knowledge of them, how do you know they don't beat the challenge? Honestly, this whole thing seems utterly riddled with holes. I had a lot of respect for Islam a couple years ago, but the more I talk to Muslims, the more I hear Muslims' arguments for Islam and its teachings, the more that declines. Maybe it'd be a good PR policy for Islam to make sure no Muslims ever discuss Islam with kuffar.

Like, my agenda is truth so if the Qur'an was the Word of God I'd genuinely want to know that, if orthodox Islam's claims were true I'd really want to know that. But they've just been so unpersuasive!

 

[interminable]

Nope! And you don't know Sanskrit or Classical Chinese?

So if you have no knowledge of them, how do you know they don't beat the challenge? Honestly, this whole thing seems utterly riddled with holes. I had a lot of respect for Islam a couple years ago, but the more I talk to Muslims, the more I hear Muslims' arguments for Islam and its teachings, the more that declines. Maybe it'd be a good PR policy for Islam to make sure no Muslims ever discuss Islam with kuffar.

Like, my agenda is truth so if the Qur'an was the Word of God I'd genuinely want to know that, if orthodox Islam's claims were true I'd really want to know that. But they've just been so unpersuasive!

I don't know them.

It's needed to beat Qur'an in Arabic since it's Arabic. If u knew Arabic your view about eloquence of Qur'an was quite different.

Something that u and other atheists are ignoring is that a religion should not necessarily be as clear as day. Simply because faith would be meaningless.
Islam or other divine religions are set and collections of rules if someone can't understand a single part of it it doesn't mean that the whole should be considered invalid.

 

[Rival]

I had a lot of respect for Islam a couple years ago, but the more I talk to Muslims, the more I hear Muslims' arguments for Islam and its teachings, the more that declines.

Now you know where Rival comes from, ah!

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Really??

I can see that most of your poems have no rhyme and rhythm
I don't know why u call them poem???!!!

Quit embarassing yourself. You've obviously read very, very little poetry if you think most English poetry lacks rhyme and meter. Milton, Shakespeare, Poe, Whitman, there are indeed many fine and wonderful English poets. Even The Divine Comedy has incredibly powerful language that leaves the reading with vivid images of Hell, and that is still after it's been translated from its native Italian to English.