• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

By the way -- if you claim to be a Christian...

Sgt. Pepper

All you need is love.
How would you prove that? Would you believe that same thing if a Muslim said it? If not then why should anyone believe you? Once again, you have mere belief. You do not have knowledge.

I've been to "delivery" church revivals in the past, and I can assure you that emotions are high during these events. I've witnessed myself and heard from others that the so-called "delivery" usually runs its course once the people impacted return to their normal lives and away from the religiously zealous snake oil salesmen from the revivals. In my opinion, these revivals are a total charade to take advantage of hurting and vulnerable people. It's shameful.
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
So if I go to a doctor and I get treatment for a life threatening disease and I follow his advice and I get better -- then I got better. But then the question comes up, what's better?
Well if you get sick it must be God's will, and to seek medical treatment goes against God's will. Why would you do that? If the higher source dictates a fatal illness on you isn't it your obligation to accept it?
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
I've been to "delivery" church revivals in the past, and I can assure you that emotions are high during these events. I've witnessed myself and heard from others that the so-called "delivery" usually runs its course once the people impacted return to their normal lives and away from the religiously zealous snake oil salesmen from the revivals. In my opinion, these revivals are a total charade to take advantage of hurting and vulnerable people. It's shameful.
You should go to a multi level marketing seminar some time. The landlady of my store used to be into one of those. My rent was waaaaaay below market level. Mainly because my Dad before me and then when I took over were her most reliable renters. So one time she asked me to go to one them for this magnetic cure hokum that she was into. It was largely to keep the faithful true to the cause. But they were trying to get new blood too because multi level marketing does not work by making sales. It works by getting new members. They even had a demonstration that the product really worked, but due to my years of martial arts training I saw immediately why it seem to make a person stronger and could replicate it without the product. At any rate I was probably one of the few skeptics there. I did not make any noise for my landlady's sake, but it would be interesting to crash such a party if one could be open about one's skepticism.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
No, you are just being very naughty. How can people have a polite conversation when the one has to rely on insults?
I generally won't answer you now, but I find your above post ironic when you have insulted virtually anyone that is positive towards the Bible. Oh well...have a good evening.
 
As a Christian I believe this reality to be true, we share this joy! The world doesn’t comprehend this.

”whom having not seen you love. Though now you do not see Him, yet believing, you rejoice with joy inexpressible and full of glory, receiving the end of your faith—the salvation of your souls.“
‭‭I Peter‬ ‭1‬:‭8‬-‭9‬ ‭NKJV‬‬
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
I know. That is why I was chiding him as if he was a child.
One more thing before I go -- You call God evil and a liar. I do not read all of your posts but I don't remember if you said you believe in God at all. However, I find that you do not say anything about belief in wicca and talking with the dead and mediums. OK, enough.
 

Sgt. Pepper

All you need is love.
As I have studied about what hell and death are, I have reason to believe the threat of burning forever in conscious torment in not something from God.

This is your belief as a Jehovah's Witness, but I know that other Christians disagree with you. And they can quote specific scriptures to support their beliefs about hell, just as I'm sure you can as well. The fact remains that I don't see any reason to believe any of you, especially since you contradict one another.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
As a Christian I believe this reality to be true, we share this joy! The world doesn’t comprehend this.

”whom having not seen you love. Though now you do not see Him, yet believing, you rejoice with joy inexpressible and full of glory, receiving the end of your faith—the salvation of your souls.“
‭‭I Peter‬ ‭1‬:‭8‬-‭9‬ ‭NKJV‬‬
Ah -- beautiful, thank you.
 

Sgt. Pepper

All you need is love.
One more thing before I go -- You call God evil and a liar. I do not read all of your posts but I don't remember if you said you believe in God at all. However, I find that you do not say anything about belief in wicca and talking with the dead and mediums. OK, enough.

If you have something to say to me or about me, then just say it and don't beat around the bush by saying something like "belief in Wicca and talking to the dead and mediums." I think it's dishonest otherwise. I know that you're referring to me, as do Subduction Zone and everyone else who reads your post.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
This is your belief as a Jehovah's Witness, but I know that other Christians disagree with you. And they can quote specific scriptures to support their beliefs about hell, just as I'm sure you can as well. The fact remains that I don't see any reason to believe any of you, especially since you contradict one another.
That's fine and we can go into the reasoning some time possibly, as to why I have come to conclusion that hellfire re: eternal conscious torture is not true. It can be detailed if one wants to use scripture. But I never believed that anyway, and I used to visit certain ministers and houses of worship but no one was able to study with me one on one. I did enjoy so much singing (and listening to) certain oratorios such as Handel's Messiah and other songs, but usually there was no commentary in those great works of music, only scripture.
I used to feel similarly to you, but not quite as you since I was not involved deeply in a religion that touted hellfire as a punishment. I thought it was hogwash. While my family followed certain traditions, it was never impressed that they actually believed it. Kind of similar to those celebrating Christmas or giving out eggs at Easter time.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
If you have something to say to or about me, then just say it and don't beat around the bush by saying something like "belief in Wicca and talking to the dead and mediums." I think it's dishonest otherwise. I know that you're referring to me, as do Subduction Zone and everyone else who reads your post.
I'm saying it to Subduction Zone, he just assails the Bible to those who trust it, calls God a liar, but I haven't seen him talk about wicca or those who believe they can talk with the dead in a negative way. I guess that's ok with him.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
I generally won't answer you now, but I find your above post ironic when you have insulted virtually anyone that is positive towards the Bible. Oh well...have a good evening.
Have I? Or have I merely been honest? Too often creationists, not theists, and not even Christians, are overly sensitive because they seem to know that they believe in nonsense. One has to be a science denier to be a creationist. And it is almost always a willful ignorance.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
I'm saying it to Subduction Zone, he just assails the Bible to those who trust it, calls God a liar, but I haven't seen him talk about wicca or those who believe they can talk with the dead in a negative way. I guess that's ok with him.
Whoa! I have never called God a liar. I have pointed out that you call your own God a liar. How can you not understand this after who knows how many posts.

When I was a Christian I did not believe that God is a liar as you do. That is why I did not read Genesis literally. You are the one that claims God is liar. Not me.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
One more thing before I go -- You call God evil and a liar. I do not read all of your posts but I don't remember if you said you believe in God at all. However, I find that you do not say anything about belief in wicca and talking with the dead and mediums. OK, enough.
No, I have never done that. I can show how you have done that. Do not accuse me of your sins.
 

Sgt. Pepper

All you need is love.
I'm saying it to Subduction Zone, he just assails the Bible to those who trust it, calls God a liar, but I haven't seen him talk about wicca or those who believe they can talk with the dead in a negative way. I guess that's ok with him.

Of course, I won't speak for Sub, but I think he and I have an understanding. I respect his personal views, despite the fact that we don't always agree.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Have I? Or have I merely been honest? Too often creationists, not theists, and not even Christians, are overly sensitive because they seem to know that they believe in nonsense. One has to be a science denier to be a creationist. And it is almost always a willful ignorance.
nah...you say naughty, naughty to @ElishaElijah but so far I have not seen anything like that come out of his posts, yet you have often in the past said things I said that I never said. anyway, have a good one, I'll consider this conversation over.
 

Sgt. Pepper

All you need is love.
That's fine and we can go into the reasoning some time possibly, as to why I have come to conclusion that hellfire re: eternal conscious torture is not true. It can be detailed if one wants to use scripture. But I never believed that anyway, and I used to visit certain ministers and houses of worship but no one was able to study with me one on one. I did enjoy so much singing (and listening to) certain oratorios such as Handel's Messiah and other songs, but usually there was no commentary in those great works of music, only scripture.
I used to feel similarly to you, but not quite as you since I was not involved deeply in a religion that touted hellfire as a punishment. I thought it was hogwash. While my family followed certain traditions, it was never impressed that they actually believed it. Kind of similar to those celebrating Christmas or giving out eggs at Easter time.

I understand that what you've written are your personal beliefs as a Jehovah's Witness. You're not the first JW that I've conversed with online or in person. I used to evangelize and teach JWs when I was an evangelist and street preacher. I led quite a few of them in their conversion to evangelical Christianity.
 
Top