Catholicism & Christianity

[Villager]

I'd guess he's use to it by now.

I'm sure he approves.

 

[Random]

I'm sure he approves.

Who knows?

 

[krsnaraja]

I think its obvious that Catholics are divided, but it may depend on your perceptions outside of your social circle or whatever group you belong to (if any). The sex abuse scandals are just an example, but modernity and tradition are clearly the two main divisions IMO, and so long as tradition continues to prevail the Church will dwindle in social significance no matter what the numbers of adherents are, up or down.

Come to Cebu & see if we Catholics are divided every 3rd Sunday of January.

[youtube]PO9lYVhNJ_U[/youtube]
Bato Balani sa Gugma (Sto. Nino de Cebu) - YouTube

 

[krsnaraja]

Balarama & Krishna

[youtube]RWzWp9KPz6I[/youtube]
KRISHNA BALARAMA - YouTube

The Santo Nino de Cebu ( Balarama) is the elder half brother of Krishna

[youtube]yeCyJ19qwC0[/youtube]
sinulog (theme) - YouTube

 

[krsnaraja]

When Blessed Pope John Paul II visited Cebu in 1981 this what he took from us.

[youtube]mYJc2rFrjDk[/youtube]
Pope's Blessing in Filipino - YouTube

 

[krsnaraja]

"Merry Christmas & a Happy New Year," Pope John Paul said

[youtube]bmU4lwzKE2E[/youtube]
KASADYA NING TAKNAA - YouTube

 

[krsnaraja]

That`s my point. For so many centuries the Catholic Church have hidden from us this knowledge of Hinduism. There`s none in the New Testament of the Bible describing in full graphic the childhood years of Christ Jesus. But if you study Srimad Bhagavatam, there you can find the childhood pastimes of (Christ) Balaramaji- the half elder brother of Krishna. The Santo Nino de Cebu fits the description of Krishna & yet he`s white. What you do not know is we also have a black Santo Nino de Cebu kept by the Augustinian priest inside the convent. What we commonly see & enshrined at the Basilica de Santo Nino is the white Santo Nino de Cebu ( Balarama). Balarama is the son of Rohini & Vasudeva. In Catholicisim, Christ Jesus is the son of Saint Mary. If Protestants want to know the childhood pastimes of Christ Jesus let them read Srimad Bhagavatam-the book Srila Prabhupada surrendered to Blessed Pope Jonh Paul II for the Pope`s perusal.

 

[Villager]

Who knows?

It's a giveaway if Catholics don't care.

 

[doppelganger]

Catholicism changes too. Albeit at a glacially slow pace. And it's often the largest "Christian" anchor weighing down the changes necessitated by changing economic, technological and economic shifts, usually to the detriment of everyone (and to be clear, it's not the only anchor, just consistently the heaviest).

I say that with great affection. There's much I love about the RCC. I love the beauty of the ritual, the artistic history, many of the philosophical writings of the early Church fathers (Aquinas was right though, his own stuff was so much chaff). I think it's unfortunate that the Church over the years has cheated its liturgy, leaving behind the Latin Mass for example, in order to hold on to a badly outdated, unworkable and downright dangerous fascination with ancient sexual mores and misogynistic attitudes that have undermined further the transformative power of its liturgy to more people with each passing generation. I'll say this . . . having been raised Catholic (son of a man educated in Linguistics for the priesthood, graduate of a Jesuit university, and probably having gone through more of the Holy Sacraments than my friend Lawrence ) and also having been actively involved in the American Evangelical movement both personally for several years in my late teens and through several siblings and their spouses over the last 30 years, I find RCC a much more viable vehicle to the transcendent experience of the divine than the cold, calculated, consumerist capitalism of the Protestant offshoots.

Having said that, the failure of both to update their morality or their cosmology has ultimately left them both largely irrelevant and empty to this particular human.

 

[Renji]

Catholicism changes too. Albeit at a glacially slow pace. And it's often the largest "Christian" anchor weighing down the changes necessitated by changing economic, technological and economic shifts, usually to the detriment of everyone (and to be clear, it's not the only anchor, just consistently the heaviest).

It does change.:yes: Many articles actually agree with that (both Catholic and non Catholic sources)

I say that with great affection. There's much I love about the RCC. I love the beauty of the ritual, the artistic history, many of the philosophical writings of the early Church fathers (Aquinas was right though, his own stuff was so much chaff). I think it's unfortunate that the Church over the years has cheated its liturgy, leaving behind the Latin Mass for example, in order to hold on to a badly outdated, unworkable and downright dangerous fascination with ancient sexual mores and misogynistic attitudes that have undermined further the transformative power of its liturgy to more people with each passing generation. I'll say this . . . having been raised Catholic (son of a man educated in Linguistics for the priesthood, graduate of a Jesuit university, and probably having gone through more of the Holy Sacraments than my friend Lawrence ) and also having been actively involved in the American Evangelical movement both personally for several years in my late teens and through several siblings and their spouses over the last 30 years, I find RCC a much more viable vehicle to the transcendent experience of the divine than the cold, calculated, consumerist capitalism of the Protestant offshoots.

Having said that, the failure of both to update their morality or their cosmology has ultimately left them both largely irrelevant and empty to this particular human.

There are many problems that the Church actually deals with (or at least wanted to deal with), and of course as a Catholic I won't deny that.

And yeah, how can you expect someone who's 18 years old to have undergone many sacraments . I haven't received matrimony yet.

 

[doppelganger]

Now it's time to watch the Evangelical and the Catholic unite to defend their views on human sexuality . . . see how easy it is to bring people together?

 

[Renji]

Now it's time to watch the Evangelical and the Catholic unite to defend their views on human sexuality . . . see how easy it is to bring people together?

This, I quite agree with.

 

[Kathryn]

Catholicism changes too. Albeit at a glacially slow pace. And it's often the largest "Christian" anchor weighing down the changes necessitated by changing economic, technological and economic shifts, usually to the detriment of everyone (and to be clear, it's not the only anchor, just consistently the heaviest).

I say that with great affection. There's much I love about the RCC. I love the beauty of the ritual, the artistic history, many of the philosophical writings of the early Church fathers (Aquinas was right though, his own stuff was so much chaff). I think it's unfortunate that the Church over the years has cheated its liturgy, leaving behind the Latin Mass for example, in order to hold on to a badly outdated, unworkable and downright dangerous fascination with ancient sexual mores and misogynistic attitudes that have undermined further the transformative power of its liturgy to more people with each passing generation. I'll say this . . . having been raised Catholic (son of a man educated in Linguistics for the priesthood, graduate of a Jesuit university, and probably having gone through more of the Holy Sacraments than my friend Lawrence ) and also having been actively involved in the American Evangelical movement both personally for several years in my late teens and through several siblings and their spouses over the last 30 years, I find RCC a much more viable vehicle to the transcendent experience of the divine than the cold, calculated, consumerist capitalism of the Protestant offshoots.

Having said that, the failure of both to update their morality or their cosmology has ultimately left them both largely irrelevant and empty to this particular human.

Well stated!

 

[Villager]

Catholicism changes too. Albeit at a glacially slow pace.

Catholicism changes its view according to its audience. It says opposites simultaneously. This has been so increasingly since it became unable to silence dissent- though even in its earliest years, from the time of Constantine, it shifted emphasis in a pragmatic way, reacting to events, rather than maintaining a fixed theological basis. RC theology has been a continuing development, a fact that many Catholics do not realise. Transubstantiation was not declared a dogma until the 13th century. Many of the key dogmas have been formulated only since the Reformation, and even in the 19th century. The strong disagreements of Vatican 2 still resonate; the vehemence between Catholics is at least as strong as any between Catholics and other groups.

Today, events move much more quickly than they did in the first millennium, and individual Catholics between them have a complete gamut of beliefs, that not only contradict each other; individuals often contradict themselves. There are communist Catholics, anti-communist Catholics, racist Catholics, libertarian Catholics. But there are Buddhist Catholics, Hindu Catholics, evangelical Catholics, Protestant Catholics, charismatic Catholics, atheist Catholics, anti-papal Catholics. A pope kissed a Qur'an, that denied Jesus' sacrifice. If there's a bandwagon, a religious or political notion that has a significant following that looks like gaining popularity, you'll find a Catholic on it somewhere.

Catholics are all things to all men. The word 'catholic' at last applies properly to the RCC. Syncretism has been a feature of the Vatican's policy since the Age of Discovery, and tribes with local deities with rites and rituals had Masses and Marian processions added to them. The RCC mimics, the RCC adapts. It listens hard to what is said (there is someone in the Vatican reading what I write), and can move exceedingly fast if the 'need' arises.

 

[Villager]

deleted by Villager

 

[Renji]

Remember, too, that its greatest appeal is to the less educated, but more morally punctilious people of the Third World, and it would lose that majority constituency if it acceded to Western pressure.

Now, this is really insulting. Now I can see how different your Christianity is from mine.

 

[Mister Emu]

It was never given a name, so ashamed were its progenitors. But it's called 'the King James Bible'. If that is not contradiction in terms.

So wait... you think Catholics burned the translator of the King James Bible? BWAHAHAHAHA!

The KJV was translated by 47 people in three different groups at three different colleges, each being given a portion of the Bible to translate. In Protestant England. None of them were burned.

Which official documents use the KJV?

They removed the antichrist books written and added by antichrists.

What on earth are you talking about? Do you even know what books they are to call them anti-Christ books?

The RSV. It's now caught up.

Indeed the RSV-CE is acceptable... if we acknowledge the skill of protestant translators, for the most part, where is the bad in that?

Still the Confraternity-Douay Bible was a modern Catholic update of the Bible in 1941, before the ASV was updated to the RSV, and 30 years ahead of the RSV-CE.

Of course. If you really tried.

Well yea, you did have to really try. This was before the printing press, books were expensive and hard to come by, Bible included. Still there were lay translations in pretty much every place the Catholic Church was.

But their motivation is to suppress real Protestantism, that inspired democracy and freedom of the individual in the first place.

Christianity isn't democratic...

 

[Mister Emu]

I bet you didn't expect me to mention the Spanish Inquisition.

Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition!

 

[Me Myself]

Now it's time to watch the Evangelical and the Catholic unite to defend their views on human sexuality . . . see how easy it is to bring people together?

Nothing like sex to bring people together

 

[Villager]

So wait... you think Catholics burned the translator of the King James Bible? BWAHAHAHAHA!

Those who have less than perfect memory, and the stamina to search back five pages of this thread to find out what was actually written, will find this:

'Their forebears strangled and burned the translator of 85% of a Bible'

That will be $50. PayPal acceptable; not Papal currency, thank you.

Which official documents use the KJV?

Have used the KJV.

Documents issued by bishops in the UK explaining Catholic teachings to UK Catholics.

What on earth are you talking about? Do you even know what books they are to call them anti-Christ books?

Why would I not? Do Catholics imagine that they are the only people who know anything? It's not like that, believe me.

we acknowledge the skill of protestant translators

No, no, no. Let us get this correct. Catholics acknowledge the skill of Protestant translators. See the difference?

And not just skill. Catholics acknowledge the spirituality of Protestant translators. Even though they call Protestantism anathema, cursed of God. But then that's Houdini Catholicism, catholic to a fault.

When the 'KJV' seemed outdated, the Vatican took a more modern Protestant version, re-labelled it 'Catholic', and issued it to the faithful, intact, except for a few changes that they have since restored! Wonders never cease.

Now why would those skilled enough to translate for the Vatican not know the names of the books that the Vatican added to the Bible?

This was before the printing press,

So was the early church before the printing press, but that church managed to produce thousands of manuscripts, mostly in an era when the church was illegal. The RCC made itself legal, but 99% of its members knew nothing about the Bible except what it was told by 1%. And the 1% beat up any who saw fit to argue about it. Some church.

Christianity isn't democratic.

That depends on who you ask.

"I learned much from the Order of the Jesuits. Until now, there has never been anything more grandiose, on the earth, than the hierarchical organization of the Catholic Church."