themadhair
Well-Known Member
A clash of cultures? Or a clash between enlightenment and a relic from the dark ages?
And yeah, that is how I see it.
-
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:- Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
- Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
- Access to private conversations with other members.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
Culture clash in the hallway
- Thread starter YmirGF
- Start date
- Status
And yeah, that is how I see it.
themadhair
Well-Known Member
I happen to believe that placing societal restrictions upon how we express ourselves sterilises conversation. Would like platitudes and dishonesty or do you want to know what people really think?
.lava
Veteran Member
see?? you're seeing what suits you, themadhair. news is not about a guy who killed or attacked or beat up someone for saying hello. if he and his wife donot want to be friends with that guy, i think it is their right to do so. they are not obligated to be in a relationship with anyone at all. he chosed a human way to let the guy how they feel, so what? what's the problem there? you talk like as if husband did some harm to man. what's wrong with you people? so saying 'hello' became an enlightenment sign. this is really ridicules. i wish you were more humane and civilized than you think you are. original post and question is already weird, it is even weirder than the issue itself. the most funny among all is that noone knows the details of the story. i do not either but at least i am aware of it. so are you guys so sure this non-Muslim man never met that Muslim guy ever in the hallway? or do you have any idea how that Muslim lady feel about some Muslim women being stabbed to death by Westerners? once you have a chance, you do everything to attack, to insult and in your own way to himuliate all of us, our culture, our religion. people we have known for years now, come back over and over again and ask silly questions even though we all know they know the answer. is this what Muslims should become for living in Western nations? i do not think so. if you have something good, then no prblem taking or sharing it. but s far what you have shown should be kicked out. because you are no friendly, you are hostile, you have greed and you act like you are examples of civilized human beings. that is TRAGIC. what do you think your gain would be? peace on Earth? so what if someone was ignorant in a way you are not. you are ignorant in a way he is not! but you reject to see other side of the coin. you are too busy to look down upon Muslims. so go prve me that Muslim woman was not scared of the guy who said hello to her, prove me he was in touch with her husband before, prove me not he never said hello to the Muslim woman while she was with her husband. come on, prove, show me.
PS: sorry themadhair, i am not just talking to you. i am so tired of this situation here. i keep asking myself what you want, what you could possibly want or expect to gain from this kind of behavour.
.
Last edited:
Who beat his wife?! I don't remember reading this in the article!!
Is politeness confined to the Canadian culture? Can we say that the people in Saudi Arabia are impolite for example? Or there are no impolite people in Canada?!
Actually this guy didn't break a law, so I don't think anyone can make him leave that country that you don't think he belongs to...
Vile Atheist
Loud and Obnoxious
1) He filed a complaint.
2) He was offended based on cultural differences.
3) There are other ways he could have voiced his opposition to friendship.
4) While it is his every right to refuse contact for whatever reason he desires, this isn't the point.
5) The point is 2). If he does not like polite people, obviously Canada isn't a country he should be in.
Yes, in a sense, saying "Hello" did become an enlightenment sign. Especially to someone of a different race, culture, and religion. Because you see centuries ago, this wasn't so. Racism and slavery were a lot more rampant. Religious fervour was the norm. Human rights? Forget it.
In a sense, a "Hello" to a complete stranger is that. It's a recognization that everyone is equal. And surely you'll agree that both man and woman are equal?
If so, then you'll see exactly why we get peeved at a story like this. Our forefathers fought and died on battlefields so we can be equal and free. When someone like this comes to our country, it sets us back.
If you do not agree that men and women should be equal, then my friend, my criticisms are levelled at you too. And not because you are a Muslim. But because you devalue fairness, justice, and equality.
They live in the same building near each other. Why wouldn't they have met already? The complaint filed was absolutely 100% unjustified.
I thought that was a speciality that comes hand-in-hand with "honour killings".
But while we're on the subject...
Do you have any idea how us Westerners feel when Muslims cover their women in burkas?
Do you have any idea how us Westerners feel when Afghani law dictates a man can withhold food from his wife until he gets sex?
Do you have any idea how us Westerners feel when Muslims torture and execute gays in Iraq?
Do you have any idea how us Westerners feel when Muslims execute someone for choosing to follow another religion besides Islam?
Do you have any idea how us Westerners feel when Muslim nations use barbaric, medieval punishments for crimes?
Do you have any idea how us Westerners feel when Muslims come to our Western nations and try to devalue all we've worked hard to achieve? Centuries of free-thinking? Hard fought and won freedoms?
Do you have any idea how us Westerners feel when we condemn all these things and in turn are called "racist" and "intolerant"?
Let me know when you get around to these questions, friend.
We aren't attacking it because it's a different culture. We don't attack you because you have a different religion. We don't attack your people because they are different. I don't know how you don't see this.
Cultures like these get criticized when they trample human rights.
When a man (and his wife) refuses a common, polite greeting that is endemic to our nation on the basis that it offends him and justifies this with a difference of culture, it is quite clear this man does not belong. Yeah, he should get out.
I also find it quite odd that you seem to be very, very quiet about this man's control over his wife. Or perhaps we should "tolerate" that too?
Again, if refusing a common greeting offends you because you are Muslim (and I have no idea how it would), then it's quite clear that you should not be in such a friendly country where people DO interact with each other, have polite conversations with strangers, and people have the right to say what they wish to whomever they wish so long as they do not violate their rights (and I'm no expert on the Canadian Constitution or the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, but you can bet your burka that saying "Good morning!" is NOT a violation of anyone's rights, whether they welcome the greeting or not).
Why on Earth would anyone be scared by someone saying "Good morning"? By a Canadian, no less. And not even a complete stranger, a neighbour whom they must have seen many, many times before.
And I don't even understand what you are asking or why you are asking that with the other questions. It's irrelevant. This guy filed a complaint because of a greeting on the basis he was offended. It was a cultural thing, apparently.
Preferably a situation where we can condemn violation of basic human rights without being branded "racist" or "intolerant" as such.
Stellify
StarChild
I completely agree with you. I don't think anyone was saying that the Muslim man and his wife HAVE to be friends with the author.
But....
The husbands behavior was extreme enough to frighten the landlady, and the author seemed to think that the husband made vague threats to his life. That's pretty bad, even if no physical harm came to him. Especially since he was only trying to be polite.
I think you've misunderstood why people are confused and think the Muslim man was being rude....So may I try to clarify? At least as far as my understanding goes?
The author was confused and insulted by the husbands behavior because they DID meet in the hallway, and the author DID say hello to the Muslim husband and wife. (It seemed like you thought people were saying they didn't meet?)
And the confusion came when the author said hello to them, and the husband proceeded to freak out about it: report the guy to the landlady, yell at him, etc.
The more appropriate response would been to have informed the author of the article that his greeting was considered inappropriate and/or disrespectful, and to ask him politely not to do it again.
In other words, explain to him the mistake he made in a manner that would promote understanding- as opposed to 'attacking' him for an honest mistake and good intentions.
As for how the culture is viewed, I cannot speak for others. I do not agree with objectifying women, or treating them as property, but that does not mean I'm against an entire culture or religion, either. And the article does not mention how the wife is treated at home, so I think that is a non-issue for this thread and there is no conclusive evidence that the wife is being mistreated. Only that her husband is hot-tempered and perhaps jealous/possessive.
Please let me know if I've misunderstood you
Vile Atheist
Loud and Obnoxious
The man beating his wife was a hypothetical.
Politeness is not confined to Canadian culture, but Canadians have a reputation for being polite.
There may be polite people in Saudi Arabia. But I'm sure a lot more people in Saudi Arabia would have me killed because I'm an atheist than if I was in Canada. That's a pretty good indicator of "politeness", eh?
Of course there are impolite people in Canada, just like any other country.
You've missed the point entirely.
No, the guy didn't break the law and no, he cannot be deported because of that. But that wasn't even my argument. I said he doesn't belong in a country like Canada if he finds polite greetings offensive.
Last edited by a moderator:
Vile Atheist
Loud and Obnoxious
The "White man" has nothing to do with it. There are plenty of Muslims that fit in Canada and they are assets to their communities and to the nation as a whole.
...But then again, they aren't offended when somebody wishes them a good morning.
Edit: Even in my Catholic school, we had a Muslim computer technician. His son also went to the school and was the Student Council President.
His father came into our religion class and set up the Hajj so we can learn about it and take part. He even spent time building replicas and having us chant in Arabic.
Yeah, that's the tolerance of "the White man's culture". Last I checked, a man in Afghanistan converted to Christianity and had to be hidden in Italy (Oh yeah, another country with "the White man's culture") so he can escape from the masses of people trying to kill him. His whereabouts is a secret now, thanks to remarkably "tolerant" and "polite" cultures like these.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abdul_Rahman_(convert)
Oh yeah, and you know how he fled to Italy so he wouldn't be killed by his own government? Pressure from "the White man's government" you so revile.
Double Edit: I'll even be kind enough to spell it out for you. That's EXACTLY why the "culture of the White man" is so superior. See what we do there? We allow freedom of speech and expression along with freedom of religion and from religion, and freedom of the press. That's "our" culture. And anyone - not just White Westernized people - are welcomed to partake of it so long as they do not devalue it.
Last edited by a moderator:
Why you people confuse things and bring stuff unrelated to the topic from east and west?
Should he care about belonging to this country if he came, for example, for work for some years?
Personally if I traveled to a Western country, I would acknowledge that I indeed don't belong to their Western culture and I would try to keep my Islamic identity...
But "I don't belong" doesn't mean I would break their rules...
is there anything wrong with that? :sarcastic
Vile Atheist
Loud and Obnoxious
Because you started making comparisons with Saudi Arabia.
And yes he should care, even if he's only here to work for a few years.
And in Canada you would be welcomed to do that, so long as you don't violate anyone else's rights and freedoms.
And you not breaking our rules is exactly why you'd be welcome here.
And no, there isn't anything wrong with that. But this isn't about you or what you would do if you were here. This is about a man who was offended by a common and polite greeting on the basis that it offends him on a difference of culture.
Canada is a free country, isn't it? He is free to feel offended, what can you do about it?
You can feel however you want to but it isn't very nice to cause trouble even in a free country. Basically, by causing trouble it is contradicitng hte other man's right to wave hello.
Vile Atheist
Loud and Obnoxious
Yes, he is free to be offended, but again you miss the point. He's doing this on the basis of a cultural difference. All I'm saying is that if he doesn't like politeness, Canada is not a country he should be in, then. Simple as that.
In the US, if anyone -- regardless of where they are from -- behaved that way regarding someone saying hello to his wife, he would probably face social sanctions. There's no law saying you cannot be touchy about someone saying hello to your wife. But law or no law, such a person would likely be shunned and talked badly about. So, free country or not, it would not be wise to violate the social expectations of the majority of the people.
Vile Atheist
Loud and Obnoxious
Good. Me neither, if it wasn't obvious enough lol. Glad we can see things the same way.Vile Atheist
Loud and Obnoxious
This is another very true point, but in reality, all he had to do was make it known he is reclusive and people wouldn't necessarily talk bad about him, but would probably treat him as if he isn't there (as is obviously his wish). There was no need for complaints or intimidation.
- Status