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Did Jesus say he was God???

Mark2020

Well-Known Member
And I already showed you a verse that shows His omniscience
(John 18:3-4 [NIV]) So Judas came to the grove, guiding a detachment of soldiers and some officials from the chief priests and Pharisees. They were carrying torches, lanterns and weapons. Jesus, knowing all that was going to happen to him, went out and asked them, "Who is it you want?"
 

waitasec

Veteran Member
Your question isn't clear. He was still omniscient, yet He had human feelings. There isn't contradiction in that, if this is what you mean.
why would he be sad if he already knew what was going to happen?
it's like forgetting what it's like to reason or understand and know something you were privy to. if jesus was god he had the experience of knowing everything but jesus seemed pretty clueless. this makes no sense.

Please don't repeat your questions.
I already answered that. If you have a problem with my answer,then discuss it. But repeating the question is no good.

but i am not satisfied with your answer can you elaborate or give me something else to go on in order for me to understand why jesus wanted to escape and have the apostles stand guard in the gospel of mark?


“Simon,” he said to Peter, “are you asleep? Couldn’t you keep watch for one hour?

yes the apostle were to stand watch...
but for what?


and...

34 “My soul is overwhelmed with sorrow to the point of death,...”
why wouldn't jesus dying of sorrow be good enough for atonement?

“...everything is possible for you. Take this cup from me. Yet not what I will, but what you will.”
this makes no sense
'not what i will but what i will'
:confused:

so many holes to fill...
 

waitasec

Veteran Member
And I already showed you a verse that shows His omniscience
(John 18:3-4 [NIV]) So Judas came to the grove, guiding a detachment of soldiers and some officials from the chief priests and Pharisees. They were carrying torches, lanterns and weapons. Jesus, knowing all that was going to happen to him, went out and asked them, "Who is it you want?"

yes but it contradicts mark's account.
 

Mark2020

Well-Known Member
why would he be sad if he already knew what was going to happen?
it's like forgetting what it's like to reason or understand and know something you were privy to. if jesus was god he had the experience of knowing everything but jesus seemed pretty clueless. this makes no sense.
He didn't seem clueless. Read John 18.
(John 18:4-11 [NIV]) Jesus, knowing all that was going to happen to him, went out and asked them, "Who is it you want?"Jesus of Nazareth, they replied. "I am he," Jesus said. (And Judas the traitor was standing there with them.)When Jesus said, "I am he," they drew back and fell to the ground.Again he asked them, "Who is it you want?" And they said, "Jesus of Nazareth."I told you that I am he, Jesus answered. "If you are looking for me, then let these men go."This happened so that the words he had spoken would be fulfilled: "I have not lost one of those you gave me."Then Simon Peter, who had a sword, drew it and struck the high priest's servant, cutting off his right ear. (The servant's name was Malchus.)Jesus commanded Peter, "Put your sword away! Shall I not drink the cup the Father has given me?"

For His sadness, at least consider His carrying all the sins of mankind. Consider the death on cross. Doesn't this make a human being sad. Yes, He knew all what was going to happen, but as human He felt sad. And He also taught us to pray when we are sad.

but i am not satisfied with your answer can you elaborate or give me something else to go on in order for me to understand why jesus wanted to escape and have the apostles stand guard in the gospel of mark?
I said He didn't want to escape. [Jesus, knowing all that was going to happen to him, went out and asked them, "Who is it you want?" ]

If you are referring to this:
(Mark 14:42 [NIV]) Rise! Let us go! Here comes my betrayer!"
(Mark 14:42 [KJV]) Rise up, let us go; lo, he that betrayeth me is at hand.

I said He was going to meet him, not to escape from him.[which is also evident in John 18] He had already told them that one of them was going to betray Him.
(Mark 14:18 [NIV]) While they were reclining at the table eating, he said, "I tell you the truth, one of you will betray me--one who is eating with me."


“Simon,” he said to Peter, “are you asleep? Couldn’t you keep watch for one hour?

yes the apostle were to stand watch...
but for what?
I said "stand watch" here means "keep awake". I gave you the Greek word, and sites to check.

(Mark 14:38 [NIV]) Watch and pray so that you will not fall into temptation. The spirit is willing, but the body is weak."

I already showed you He didn't ask for and didn't need their protection.

34 “My soul is overwhelmed with sorrow to the point of death,...”
why wouldn't jesus dying of sorrow be good enough for atonement?
(Romans 6:23 [NIV]) For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Edit: And this:
(Hebrews 9:22 [NIV]) In fact, the law requires that nearly everything be cleansed with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.

“...everything is possible for you. Take this cup from me. Yet not what I will, but what you will.”
this makes no sense
Simply, as man. He showed us His suffer as human and He taught us such a prayer.
 
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Mark2020

Well-Known Member
I am confused. Are you saying that I AM means YHWH?

No.
"I am" means Ehyeh.
But this verse was translated into Greek as "Ego Emi Ho On" or "I am the Being".
Jesus used both expressions: "Ego Emi" and "Ho On". Both in the absolute sense, ie without predicate.
(Exodus 3:14 [NIV]) God said to Moses, "I AM WHO I AM. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: 'I AM has sent me to you.' "
I AM WHO I AM: In Hebrew, Ehyeh Asher Ehyeh. In Greek, Ego Emi Ho On.
 
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waitasec

Veteran Member
He didn't seem clueless. Read John 18.
why have you forsaken me? seems clueless
read marks account...

At least consider His carrying all the sins of mankind. Consider the death on cross. Doesn't this make a human being sad. Yes, He knew all what was going to happen, but at as human He felt sad. And He also taught us to pray when we are sad.
i have. as a god who is atoning for his creations short comings he should have been happy...it was his purpose after all.
I said He didn't want to escape.
the gospel of mark says he did...
Jesus, knowing all that was going to happen to him, went out and asked them, "Who is it you want?" ]

If you are referring to this:
(Mark 14:42 [NIV]) Rise! Let us go! Here comes my betrayer!"
(Mark 14:42 [KJV]) Rise up, let us go; lo, he that betrayeth me is at hand.

I said He was going to meet him, not to escape from him.[which is also evident in John 18] He had already told them that one of them was going to betray Him.
(Mark 14:18 [NIV]) While they were reclining at the table eating, he said, "I tell you the truth, one of you will betray me--one who is eating with me."


I said "stand watch" here means "keep awake". I gave you the Greek word, and sites to check.

(Mark 14:38 [NIV]) Watch and pray so that you will not fall into temptation. The spirit is willing, but the body is weak."
ok, so how you interpret this is that judas and the soldiers weren't going to wake up the apostles from their beauty sleep, right?
:facepalm:



(Romans 6:23 [NIV]) For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
it's a good time to buy a house, if you can afford to.


Simply, as man. He showed as His suffer as human and He taught us such a prayer.
did you know that avatar is the biggest box office hit of all time followed by titanic?
 

Mark2020

Well-Known Member
why have you forsaken me? seems clueless
No. It refers to carrying human sins and dying on cross. He was our representative in doing so and in saying so. Also He was pointing to the 22nd Psalm.

read marks account...
I already showed you this from Mark:
(Mark 14:38 [NIV]) Watch and pray so that you will not fall into temptation. The spirit is willing, but the body is weak."

i have. as a god who is atoning for his creations short comings he should have been happy...it was his purpose after all.
Of course it was a joy to Him to save us:
(Hebrews 12:2 [NIV]) Let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before him endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God.

But this doesn't deny human feelings at that time, especially carrying all human sins, being betrayed by his disciple, crucified by His people, ...

the gospel of mark says he did...
I think I've discussed this more than enough.

ok, so how ...
Pretty much the rest is mockery...
Thanks for that.
 

Mark2020

Well-Known Member
(Mark 14:42 [KJV]) Rise up, let us go; lo, he that betrayeth me is at hand.
Probably this is more accurate:
(Mark 14:42 [NET]) Get up, let us go. Look! My betrayer is approaching!”
He said this before he came. So He knew he was coming. As I said before, and from Mark too:
(Mark 14:18 [NIV]) While they were reclining at the table eating, he said, "I tell you the truth, one of you will betray me--one who is eating with me."

Anyway, here is a good site with a lot of commentaries about the bible.
Gill's is one of the best.
http://biblos.com/genesis/1-1.htm
You can select a verse, and click "comment" to find commentaries.
 
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javajo

Well-Known Member
Its all pretty much mockery, with no intent to really understand Christianity, just to question and condemn it. Welcome to RF! :)
 

Shermana

Heretic
For anyone else saying that my rendition of Acts 20:28 as "through the blood of his own" is scripture twisting, the Darby beat me to it!

Darby Bible Translation
Take heed therefore to yourselves, and to all the flock, wherein the Holy Spirit has set you as overseers, to shepherd the assembly of God, which he has purchased with the blood of his own.



I'm a little late for such an 'independent" interpretation/"twisting".

The RSV even goes so far as to include the word "Son" to help the context probably because they're aware of all these scripture twisters who completely toss out the "Tou". And it's a Trinitarian translation! Any translation that does not say "blood of his own" is in fact scripture twisting for the sake of their market by removing the Tou as if it does not exist.

Also Mark2020, ignoring my example of John 15:19 doesn't help your case. You want other cases where the word "Own" is used on its own for kin?
 
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