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Do You Believe In God, Why? Don't You Believe In God, Why?

TagliatelliMonster

Veteran Member
I doubt it. They believe nonsense such as the big bang and relativity

You think relativity is "nonsense"? :D

Are you aware that the workings of GPS literally depend on it?
As in: if one doesn't account for the relativistic effects, it's of by several miles. If you do, it works and pinpoints your location with a meter or 2 of precision.

Are you aware of that?
 

Skywalker

Well-Known Member
1. judges aren't the ones who make the laws. we have this thing called "seperation of powers", precisely because otherwise you get nasty situations.

2. if you make laws of which you know that subjects will be unable to live upto them, then yes, you are responsible for the "crimes" the subjects commit. It's like making a law in a third world country that says one deserves life in jail unless one makes a million dollars by the age of 20 while also making it illegal to get an education. This would inevitably lead to 99% of people going to jail for life. As the hitch said: "created sick and commanded to be well".




He is, if he also made the laws and made them in such a way that they are impossible to live upto.





Your god is both lawmaker AND judge. In a society, we call such a thing a dictatorship - and it's not a good thing.



It would most certainly not.
Imagine a supreme court judge letting a serial killer go free and "sacrificing himself" instead and doing the jail time instead of the killer. Do you think the American people would praise the judge and be pleased that the serial killer is set free? I say the people would all this scandalous and declare the judge to be a lunatic.

Instead of "accepting" thing "sacrifice", I think it's incredibly more likely that the judge be forced to retire, perhaps in a mental hospital, and replaced by someone who will put the actual killer in prison anyway.



But he didn't.

Judges determine sentencing guidelines.

Don't the punishments of all laws, by definition, imply that not everyone can live up to them? Not being rich is not a choice or harmful. Someone robbing a bank is.

That's like saying lawmakers made laws that are impossible for people to live up to.

God's ways are not our ways because the circumstances that people and God are in are totally different.

A judge would never sacrifice themselves for a criminal because God's ways aren't our ways.

Why do you think God didn't become a mortal being, wouldn't want to, or couldn't if he wanted to?
 

Moses_UK

Member
A car or a computer doesn't just exist. Their existence depends on design and purpose

The reasons why Atheists exist is due to the Christians misinterpreting their religion and
Jesus said those who seek will find him. Jesus didn't have to say directly that he is God and to worship him because that would be vain.


Matthew 7:8
First and foremost, David Wood talking about what Islam thinks, doesn’t answer the question. Forget Islam for the mean time.


The question I asked was, where did Jesus explicitly state that he was God and to worship him.


1. David wood states that Jesus said in revelation – Revelation cannot be used as a source due to the authors being anonymous (Christians don’t even know who the author is) and the text showing up 61 years + after the so-called crucifixion.

2. Seeking forgiveness is NOT being God as David Wood implies (Jesus says son of man can also forgive sin Matthew 9:6)

3. Who is our final judge?


Ø God gives authority not Jesus

John 17:1-4

Jesus spoke these things; and lifting up His eyes to heaven, He said, “Father, the hour has come; glorify Your Son, that the Son may glorify You, even as You gave Him authority over all flesh, that to all whom You have given Him, He may give eternal life. This is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent. I glorified You on the earth, having accomplished the work which You have given Me to do.

Nobody HAS SEEN THE FATHER John 5:37

37 And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.

God and Jesus different John 20:17

John 20:17

17 Jesus said, “Do not hold on to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. Go instead to my brothers and tell them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”

God the source (1 God)

Jesus said: "And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent" (John 17:3)

God the only knower of future (Jesus lacks knowledge)

Mark 13:32 (NASB)
"But of that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but the Father alone."

Matt 24:36 (NASB)

But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father alone.


Can Gods authority be stripped? And Jesus says I have no authority John 5:30

God is one

1 Timothy 2:5 (NASB)
For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, ...

Ephesians 4:5-6 (NASB)
one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all who is over all and through all and in all.

God and Jesus are different entities

1 Corinthians 8:4-6

Therefore, concerning the eating of things sacrificed to idols, we know that there is no such thing as an idol in the world, and that there is no God but one. For even if there are so-called gods whether in heaven or on earth, as indeed there are many gods and many lords, yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him.


Jesus calling out to God and questioning his decision

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, “Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?” (which means “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?”)


God the greatest (God is greater than Jesus)

Jesus also said that "my Father is greater than I" (John 14:28) and that "I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God" (John 20:17)


Jesus doesn’t give power – Only God gives power according to Jesus

John 19:11

11 Jesus answered, “You would have no power over me if it were not given to you from above. Therefore the one who handed me over to you is guilty of a greater sin.”


God greater then Jesus
John 14:28 “You heard me say, ‘I am going away and I am coming back to you.’ If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I.


Jesus praying to God

In the Garden of Gethsemane, Jesus prayed to the Father. To whom was Jesus praying? To himself? To an alter ego?

Does God suffer from multiple personality disorder? In this prayer, Jesus asked: "That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one..." (John 17:20-21). Are we to be one in the way that Trinitarians say that the Father and Son are one? That is impossible. So apparently, the oneness that Jesus was talking about was not the oneness that Trinitarians talk about. The only way to explain these scriptural contradictions would be by concluding that the oneness of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit is figurative rather than literal.


God is individual and not 3

The reason for believing that God is an individual person is because we, as humans, are each an individual person, and we are made in the image and likeness of God.



God gives the instructions to Jesus (Jesus not all knowing he has to learn)

John 15:15

15 I no longer call you servants, because a servant does not know his master’s business. Instead, I have called you friends, for everything that I learned from my Father I have made known to you.



Jesus inferior to God

1 Cor 15:27-28

For He has put all things in subjection under His feet. But when He says, “All things are put in subjection,” it is evident that He is excepted who put all things in subjection to Him. When all things are subjected to Him, then the Son Himself also will be subjected to the One who subjected all things to Him, so that God may be all in all.


Jesus hungry Matthew 4:4

‘Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, left the Jordan and was led by the Spirit into the wilderness, 2 where for forty days he was tempted[a] by the devil. He ate nothing during those days, and at the end of them he was hungry.’


God gives authority

John 17:1-4

Jesus spoke these things; and lifting up His eyes to heaven, He said, “Father, the hour has come; glorify Your Son, that the Son may glorify You, even as You gave Him authority over all flesh, that to all whom You have given Him, He may give eternal life. This is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent. I glorified You on the earth, having accomplished the work which You have given Me to do.


Jesus clearly telling people only one master can be served

Matthew 6:24

24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon
 

TagliatelliMonster

Veteran Member
What does people having children have to do with there being intermediate organs?

I understood what he said, because I actually understand what a "transitional" is.

If you say that you aren't a "transitional", you are effectively saying that you will not be reproducing.
Because if you DO have children, then that means that you are a transitional between your parents and your kids.
 

Skywalker

Well-Known Member
You think you are being clever, but actually you're only exposing who ignorant on the theory you like to argue against.


As @Polymath257 said: ALL life is "fully formed".

An intermediate is not "half an X".
An intermediate is simply a species that has characteristics / traits of both its ancestral species as well as its subspecies.

Like Tiktaalik. It's basicly a fish with limbs and a neck.
But it's a "fully formed" species in its own right.

There's no such thing as "half a species" in evolution.
That's just creationist propaganda.


Learn the science before trying to argue against it.
Continuing this argument is an exercise in futility, because you are not arguing against evolution theory. You are instead then arguing against a misrepresentation thereof. Even if you win the argument, all you would have accomplished is debunking a false version of the model.

The actual model will be left untouched.

Intermediate doesn't have a strict definition. Something can be intermediate and mixed, or neither. There are different degrees of intermediate. If my ancestors had intermediates of my organ, eventually it would have to be half of my what my organ is now.

The Caspian Tiger is a close cousin of the siberian tiger but there was no change of kinds with them. Both animals are still tigers. Other than Tiktaalik I can think of no possible changes of kinds.
 

Skywalker

Well-Known Member
I understood what he said, because I actually understand what a "transitional" is.

If you say that you aren't a "transitional", you are effectively saying that you will not be reproducing.
Because if you DO have children, then that means that you are a transitional between your parents and your kids.

If I had kids they would still have fully formed organs and not half a heart, and the same would apply to me and my parents.
 
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