Do you not ask yourself "what if I am wrong?"

[Lady B]

OK let me clarify what your trying to get at, I assumed you were referring to a incident in the bible that I have never seen regarding a aborted or lost child, now I think you are blaming God for all miscarriages? Let me see what your real question is then I shall try to answer you the best I can.

 

[waitasec]

OK let me clarify what your trying to get at, I assumed you were referring to a incident in the bible that I have never seen regarding a aborted or lost child, now I think you are blaming God for all miscarriages? Let me see what your real question is then I shall try to answer you the best I can.

no your argument was that atheists would equate the ant analogy and twist it to make god look like unjust and uncaring, implying that god is just and caring. how do you know that?

if god is just and caring why would god allow for miscarriages?

if you are going to blame miscarriages on mans sin then
you also need to answer the question, why is there sin?
why create the tree of knowledge to begin with (assuming you take the genesis account literally) if you are going to move the goal post yet again and say, gods ways are higher than ours... then we have come full circle. how do you know this?

 

[Lady B]

no your argument was that atheists would equate the ant analogy and twist it to make god look like unjust and uncaring, implying that god is just and caring. how do you know that?

if god is just and caring why would god allow for miscarriages?

if you are going to blame miscarriages on mans sin then
you also need to answer the question, why is there sin?
why create the tree of knowledge to begin with (assuming you take the genesis account literally) if you are going to move the goal post yet again and say, gods ways are higher than ours... then we have come full circle. how do you know this?

It seems to me you are angry at God for a devastating event in your life,I am sorry and have been there myself twice. I really cannot answer your questions and in no way shrug them off as foolish, they are valid feelings and I wish really I could help you and me and every woman who has suffered this loss. I am not equipped to examine the mind or motives of God, but I do know and trust he has his reasons he really does.

 

[waitasec]

It seems to me you are angry at God for a devastating event in your life,I am sorry and have been there myself twice. I really cannot answer your questions and in no way shrug them off as foolish, they are valid feelings and I wish really I could help you and me and every woman who has suffered this loss. I am not equipped to examine the mind or motives of God,

no i am not angry at something that i don't believe exists...that would be silly.

these are not feelings these are arguments...

but I do know and trust he has his reasons he really does.

how do you know this?

 

[waitasec]

I am not equipped to examine the mind or motives of God,

what makes you think god had a mind and a motive?

 

[Lady B]

no i am not angry at something that i don't believe exists...that would be silly.

these are not feelings these are arguments...

how do you know this?

If God does not exist then why are u blaming him? That is selective reasoning, you started off accusing him of aborting wanted babies, now your saying its silly to be angry at something that doesn't exist. You can't have both ways. If you believe God exists then OK ,blame him if you like, if you don't believe in any god, surely you need a different fall guy for all the tragedy in the world. Right?

 

[Alceste]

If God does not exist then why are u blaming him? That is selective reasoning, you started off accusing him of aborting wanted babies, now your saying its silly to be angry at something that doesn't exist. You can't have both ways. If you believe God exists then OK ,blame him if you like, if you don't believe in any god, surely you need a different fall guy for all the tragedy in the world. Right?

Perhaps you mistake the proposition that "god aborts wanted babies" for an attempted criticism of god. It's only a trope for pro-choice people to argue their case. If the proposition is "my omnipotent God wants all fetuses to live", the obvious counter is "then why does he cause so many miscarriages?" It's only meant to prove that a hypothetical omnipotent God clearly could not be in the least bit interested in the lives of fetuses. If so, then how could he cause up to half of all pregnancies to miscarry?

Blame doesn't enter into it.

 

[Lady B]

Perhaps you mistake the proposition that "god aborts wanted babies" for an attempted criticism of god. It's only a trope for pro-choice people to argue their case. If the proposition is "my omnipotent God wants all fetuses to live", the obvious counter is "then why does he cause so many miscarriages?" It's only meant to prove that a hypothetical omnipotent God clearly could not be in the least bit interested in the lives of fetuses. If so, then how could he cause up to half of all pregnancies to miscarry?

Blame doesn't enter into it.

perhaps you are right, perhaps i jumped to the wrong conclusion by her statement
(besides your god doesn't seem to show remorse for aborting a wanted child...)
to my mind she is saying God doesn't seem to show remorse for an act he did to the wanted child, Im wrong?

 

[waitasec]

If God does not exist then why are u blaming him? That is selective reasoning, you started off accusing him of aborting wanted babies, now your saying its silly to be angry at something that doesn't exist. You can't have both ways. If you believe God exists then OK ,blame him if you like, if you don't believe in any god, surely you need a different fall guy for all the tragedy in the world. Right?

i'm not blaming god for anything.

you are.


it is your position that god knows all, isn't it?

 

[Alceste]

perhaps you are right, perhaps i jumped to the wrong conclusion by her statement
(besides your god doesn't seem to show remorse for aborting a wanted child...)
to my mind she is saying God doesn't seem to show remorse for an act he did to the wanted child, Im wrong?

If you're talking to an atheist, you are. They are talking about your deity, as portrayed by your religion, and trying to illustrate one of the many contradictions that make this particular proposed entity impossible to believe in. To a rational mind, "God hates abortion" and "God causes half of all pregnancies to abort naturally, and that's for the best" are incompatible claims.

 

[Lady B]

If you're talking to an atheist, you are. They are talking about your deity, as portrayed by your religion, and trying to illustrate one of the many contradictions that make this particular proposed entity impossible to believe in. To a rational mind, "God hates abortion" and "God causes half of all pregnancies to abort naturally, and that's for the best" are incompatible claims.

Ok I give
I apologize for assuming.

 

[waitasec]

dogmatic religions are dependent on assumtions

 

[ChristineES]

this post implied you know that god is just and caring...right?
how do you know this?

I have seen you ask this question and others similar to it a lot of times and now I have my own question: How do you know God isn't caring and just? And don't use Bible verses to answer, let me hear it in your own words.

I have had not so nice things happen in my life: Two special needs sons, a fire that destroyed our home back when I was a child, a not so good marriage, depression and anxiety disorder, etc, but for some reason, I still don't see God as uncaring and unjust. Things happen in the world, both good things and bad things. It's what you do with it that's important.

 

[Me Myself]

Which is ironic considering they, generally, believe in an omniscient being

Well, they believe in "free" will in a way that is incompatible with determinism and they dont seem to be able to understand it.

but blah, too much about that other threads for it o.o

 

[9Westy9]

no your argument was that atheists would equate the ant analogy and twist it to make god look like unjust and uncaring, implying that god is just and caring. how do you know that?

She actually said that we can't comprehend God. I don't remember her implying anything about god being just and caring (even if that's what she believes)

yikes! you misunderstood me completely. the poster with the ant analogy was giving a picture of how small man is to God, I said this analogy will be picked apart because of the view from an atheist perspective that God is a murderer, unjust, uncaring ect...so the analogy will backfire on us who view God as that huge being we cant comprehend. ok? of course I never ever would assasinate any person's character based on their beliefs.

 

[waitasec]

I have seen you ask this question and others similar to it a lot of times and now I have my own question: How do you know God isn't caring and just? And don't use Bible verses to answer, let me hear it in your own words.

theres the problem of evil, children contracting cancer and so on.

I have had not so nice things happen in my life: Two special needs sons, a fire that destroyed our home back when I was a child, a not so good marriage, depression and anxiety disorder, etc, but for some reason, I still don't see God as uncaring and unjust. Things happen in the world, both good things and bad things. It's what you do with it that's important.

because you are a caring and just person...

 

[kylixguru]

dogmatic religions are dependent on assumtions

I'd like to modify that just a little.
Dogmatic religions are dependent on assumptions and refuse to question them when invited to do so even by sincere people in possession of truth to counter such

 

[waitasec]

I'd like to modify that just a little.
Dogmatic religions are dependent on assumptions and refuse to question them when invited to do so even by sincere people in possession of truth to counter such

and i will modify that even further

dogmatic religions are dependent on assumptions and refuse to question them when invited to do so even by sincere people in possession of THEIR subjective truth to counter such

 

[Lady B]

wow I was almost feeling defended there for a moment.......

 

[waitasec]

She actually said that we can't comprehend God. I don't remember her implying anything about god being just and caring (even if that's what she believes)

she was arguing against the idea that god is unjust and uncaring, therefore implying that god is just and caring....i want to know how she knows that