Do you really think you are helping anyone?

[sky dancer]

Kathryn seeks to impose Her truth on everyone since she feels there can only be one truth--Christianity. Kathryn's position is we can't all be right. Mine is, we can. Jews can be right in choosing Judaism as the way to truth for them, Islam is the way to truth for Muslims, Buddhism is the way to truth for Buddhists and Christians find truth in Christianity.

She can't stand the idea of other faiths thinking they have the truth.

 

[Kathryn]

OK. According to you, only Christians have the truth. Bye.

You keep saying this. I've never said this. You're using cheap and obvious tricks to avoid serious debate and discussion.

I've clearly stated that I am certain - CERTAIN - that I am wrong about some things, maybe even many things. I've changed my mind on numerous serious issues and philosophies over my lifetime, and I am pretty sure I will change my mind again.

I am SEARCHING for truth. I also believe that some things are true and I'm not afraid or ashamed to admit that. My gosh, we all have to operate within a system of some sort of belief in order to even get out of bed each day.

Surely we have reasons to believe as we do. And surely we believe what we do because we believe in the TRUTH of our beliefs - we're not intentionally following untruth or a set of lies - at least I'm not, nor do I know anyone who is.

This doesn't mean that we're closed to gathering more information and possibly changing our mind about what we believe to be true. It also doesn't mean that additional information will PROVE that what we're believing is not true.

You are the one who comes across as dogmatic in your judgment of others - a fact which I find ironic.

 

[waitasec]

Sky Dancer - Do you believe that that those who choose Christianity are choosing a belief system based on truth?

You keep saying this. I've never said this. You're using cheap and obvious tricks to avoid serious debate and discussion.

I've clearly stated that I am certain - CERTAIN - that I am wrong about some things,

not about jesus...
jesus is your truth...do you believe jesus is everyones truth?

 

[Kathryn]

but isn't jesus the answer to everything?
would it be fair to say you reached your enlightenment when you accepted jesus?

i think sky is saying everyone has their truth. you argue that truth is is objective...either you are right and he is wrong or the other way around. obvioulsy he has accepted the truth you have is for YOU.
if you are trying to impose your truth on others you are diminishing the others truth...and that's the truth

What on earth do you mean "jesus is the answer to everything." As a Christian, I have no idea what you mean by that statement.

And no, it would not be fair to say that I reached my enlightenment when I became a Christian. My path in search of truth and enlightenment is ongoing. I haven't "reached" any particular summit.

if you are trying to impose your truth on others you are diminishing the others truth...and that's the truth

So you agree that there can be absolute truth. Outside of religious dogma - there can be truth which is objective and absolute. Agree or disagree?

 

[sky dancer]

You are telling me that all faiths cannot be true. That there is only one truth faith--yours. That is dogmatic.

Buddhism has a tenet in it about the truth of impermanence. Is there anything in the universe that doesn't change?

The Buddha taught 84,000 different methods. We cannot possibly master them all or know them all. How do we know Christianity wasn't a method the Buddha taught?

 

[sky dancer]

not about jesus...
jesus is your truth...do you believe jesus is everyones truth?

She does. Jesus is everyone's truth because there can only be one truth.

 

[Kathryn]

not about jesus...
jesus is your truth...do you believe jesus is everyones truth?

What do you mean by "jesus is your truth"?

 

[waitasec]

What on earth do you mean "jesus is the answer to everything." As a Christian, I have no idea what you mean by that statement.

who do you pray to for guidance?

And no, it would not be fair to say that I reached my enlightenment when I became a Christian. My path in search of truth and enlightenment is ongoing. I haven't "reached" any particular summit.

so how do you define you realization about jesus?

So you agree that there can be absolute truth. Outside of religious dogma - there can be truth which is objective and absolute. Agree or disagree?

the truth is...everyone has their truth...

 

[sky dancer]

Clearly, you don't like me Kathryn. I'm sorry for that. It seems to offend you that I chose Buddhism instead of Christianity.

 

[Sultan Of Swing]

You are telling me that all faiths cannot be true. That there is only one truth faith--yours. That is dogmatic.

Buddhism has a tenet in it about the truth of impermanence. Is there anything in the universe that doesn't change?

The Buddha taught 84,000 different methods. We cannot possibly master them all or know them all. How do we know Christianity wasn't a method the Buddha taught?

I think what Kathryn is saying, Sky, is how can you find all religions valid, when one religion can have completely opposite beliefs from another?

(Sorry Kathryn if that wasn't what you were saying )

 

[Kathryn]

You are telling me that all faiths cannot be true. That there is only one truth faith--yours. That is dogmatic.

Buddhism has a tenet in it about the truth of impermanence. Is there anything in the universe that doesn't change?

Can all faiths be true?

What I am asking you (which you absolutely refuse to answer) is this:

If truth exists, and an idea exists which contradicts this truth, then is the idea wrong?

If two ideas contradict each other, but both claim to be true, are both true? Are both untrue? If truth exists outside of dogma (which I believe it does) and one dogma embraces truth and another dogma opposes the teachings of the first one, are both valid?

 

[waitasec]

What do you mean by "jesus is your truth"?

jesus is your truth...it's a personal realization.
what is faith in jesus then?

 

[Vinayaka]

And the topic was: Is proseltysing valid? Does it do anyone any good? Does it help anyone to share your faith with them?

Is this off-topic bit going on now any clue to the answer to the OP's question?

 

[sky dancer]

Can all faiths be true?

What I am asking you (which you absolutely refuse to answer) is this:

If truth exists, and an idea exists which contradicts this truth, then is the idea wrong?

If two ideas contradict each other, but both claim to be true, are both true? Are both untrue? If truth exists outside of dogma (which I believe it does) and one dogma embraces truth and another dogma opposes the teachings of the first one, are both valid?

Truth exists in the moment of realization. Truth is non-conceptual. We are arguing over concepts. Concepts are not truth.

You refuse to accept my answers because they don't conform to your narrow view of truth.

 

[Kathryn]

jesus is your truth...it's a personal realization.
what is faith in jesus then?

So truth is just a personal realization? What do you mean by this?

If I personally realize that I am 125 pounds (and I am NOT) - does that mean I am, whether I am or not?

 

[Kathryn]

The truth is - I do not weigh 125 pounds.

Now - I can say I do. I can believe I do. I can tell you that I do. I can tell you that I've had a personal realization that I indeed to weigh 125 pounds.

That doesn't change the fact that I don't.

 

[Sultan Of Swing]

Sky dancer, I'm afraid you have misjudged. Kathryn is asking you a simple question: how can you believe that all religions are as valid as each other while they can have such opposite beliefs?

 

[sky dancer]

Let's talk about truth. Truth is not appearances. We think this computer table is sold, but in fact, it is mostly space. Molecules and atoms moving in space. It appears solid, but it not solid in truth.

 

[waitasec]

And the topic was: Is proseltysing valid? Does it do anyone any good? Does it help anyone to share your faith with them?

Is this off-topic bit going on now any clue to the answer to the OP's question?

i think proselytising diminishes the truth others hold...
in other words, it's not respectful even though it may come from a heart of gold. the mere act of proselytising is assuming "i have it, you don't and i want to share it with you" for a various reasons

 

[sky dancer]

Sky dancer, I'm afraid you have misjudged. Kathryn is asking you a simple question: how can you believe that all religions are as valid as each other while they can have such opposite beliefs?

I've answered this question so many times already.

If Christianity, Christian contemplation, prayer and meditation leads to a state beyond conception, Christianity is as true as Buddhism.

The beliefs appeal to different minds, which is the reason the Buddha taught 84,000 methods of meditation. Our minds differ from one another.

The Jesus story did not lead me to the spiritual development that I longed for all my life. Buddhism has.

That doesn't make Christianity wrong and Buddhism right. It makes Christianity wrong for me.

I'm sorry, but my experience is that many Christians, like Kathryn, are black and white thinkers. It's my way or the highway. They cannot seem to live with differences.