Does Atheism Lead to Nihilism?

[Sunstone]

Is this not the definition of nihilism? No inherent meaning?

There is no inherent definition of nihilism, nor of any other words. To define nihilism as "no inherent meaning" seems useful in some ways, not useful in others. To me, it seems a rather academic definition, divorced from where most people live, so to speak.

 

[Father Heathen]

There is a common question: Where do atheists get their morals from? I think it deserves more attention than it receives, but this is not ny main question.

Whenever I take an atheistic turn of mind it is automatically nihilistic. This is because I believe in objectivity and the answers I receive from most atheists rely on relativity and subjective meaning, which doesn't work for me because this, in essence, still means the meaning is made-up, which still imo leads to nihilism.

Thus my question:
So does, or can, atheism lead logically to nihilism?

I'm defining atheism as lack of belief in God or Gods, this is all.

Why would a god be a prerequisite for either ethics or purpose? It would be rather sad indeed if the only way people could care about how to live or what to live for is if it were spoon fed to them, like programming an automaton.

 

[McBell]

So does, or can, atheism lead logically to nihilism?

I suppose it can.
Though I suspect it more than likely works the other way around.

 

[McBell]

Created meaning is subjective.

ALL meaning is subjective

I'm seeking objectivity.

I hope you the best in your search.
Buckle up, I suspect it is going to be a rough ride.

 

[Rival]

There is no inherent definition of nihilism, nor of any other words. To define nihilism as "no inherent meaning" seems useful in some ways, not useful in others. To me, it seems a rather academic definition, divorced from where most people live, so to speak.

Well of course words have meanings, they don't just mean whatever you want them to. The meaning of nihilism seems pretty straightforward to me.

 

[Rival]

How can you be both a nihilist and a Christian?

Because as others have said, all meaning is subjective, even my Christian lens. As long as objective meaning eludes me I am a nihilist.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Because as others have said, all meaning is subjective, even my Christian lens. As long as objective meaning eludes me I am a nihilist.

I still think "objective meaning" is a fiction. Meaning is a product of human minds, and therefore inherently subjective.

 

[Sunstone]

Well of course words have meanings, they don't just mean whatever you want them to. The meaning of nihilism seems pretty straightforward to me.

You should study semiotics if you think words don't mean whatever you want them to.

 

[Rival]

You should study semiotics if you think words don't mean whatever you want them to.

I guess this means you can't give me a warning for swearing on RF if I decide that the C word merely means 'hello'?

 

[Sunstone]

I guess this means you can't give me a warning for swearing on RF if I decide that the C word merely means 'hello'?

Nice one. If you decided the C word merely meant hello, I would suspect you of trolling. Would I be wrong? But that would be insufficient grounds for you to advance the radical notion that the C word has an inherent meaning. If it had an inherent meaning, who assigned it that meaning? God? And how did he do that? Was God the creator of the English language, then?

I don't think you can very argue from the observation that the C word has a common meaning to the radical conclusion that the C word has an inherent meaning.

 

[Rival]

Nice one. If you decided the C word merely meant hello, I would suspect you of trolling. Would I be wrong? But that would be insufficient grounds for you to advance the radical notion that the C word has an inherent meaning. If it had an inherent meaning, who assigned it that meaning? God? And how did he do that? Was God the creator of the English language, then?

I don't think you can very argue from the observation that the C word has a common meaning to the radical conclusion that the C word has an inherent meaning.

If words have no meaning then we can have no discussions. I never said the meanings are inherent but they are not easily changed either. In no serious context can the word 'sky' ever mean 'handbag'.

 

[Augustus]

I guess this means you can't give me a warning for swearing on RF if I decide that the C word merely means 'hello'?

It wouldn't be uncommon for someone to greet their friends with 'Alright, what are you ***** up to?' - meaning 'folk' in an informal but friendly context.

Playing golf - the 17th hole is a right **** - meaning it is very difficult

'Last night I was ****ed off my face' - meaning I was highly intoxicated

If words have no meaning then we can have no discussions. I never said the meanings are inherent but they are not easily changed either. In no serious context can the word 'sky' ever mean 'handbag'.

Meaning comes from convention within a given context. Meanings are very easily changed, metaphor for example or irony. All that matters for communication is that words in context are mutually intelligible between sender and receiver of message via a complex process of negotiating meanings.

"'Language does not exist; it is an abstractum. That we cannot enter twice the same river,applies also to language." "Language is no object of use,and no tool,it is no object at all, it is nothing but its use. Language is use of language" " Language came into being as a big city, room on room, window on window,flat on flat, house on house,street on street, quarter on quarter. . ." It is here that his insistence on the context comes in. With Frege and Wittgenstein he maintains that the basic unit of meaning is the sentence and that the word gains its meaning from it" On Fritz Mauthner's Critique of Language - Gershon Weiler

 

[Rival]

It wouldn't be uncommon for someone to greet their friends with 'Alright, what are you ***** up to?' - meaning 'folk' in an informal but friendly context.

Playing golf - the 17th hole is a right **** - meaning it is very difficult

'Last night I was ****ed off my face' - meaning I was highly intoxicated



Meaning comes from convention within a given context. Meanings are very easily changed, metaphor for example or irony. All that matters for communication is that words in context are mutually intelligible between sender and receiver of message via a complex process of negotiating meanings.

"'Language does not exist; it is an abstractum. That we cannot enter twice the same river,applies also to language." "Language is no object of use,and no tool,it is no object at all, it is nothing but its use. Language is use of language" " Language came into being as a big city, room on room, window on window,flat on flat, house on house,street on street, quarter on quarter. . ." It is here that his insistence on the context comes in. With Frege and Wittgenstein he maintains that the basic unit of meaning is the sentence and that the word gains its meaning from it" On Fritz Mauthner's Critique of Language - Gershon Weiler

Nope, still strikes me as gibberish :|

 

[Augustus]

Nope, still strikes me as gibberish :|

 

[Augustus]

.. by a certain understanding of "theistic", "succesful", and "impartially", anyway.

I mean successful = best able to replicate and sustain itself, rather than a value judgement.

The other 2 are pretty self-explanatory, based around god(s) and 'the evidence strongly suggests'.

 

[LuisDantas]

I mean successful = best able to replicate and sustain itself, rather than a value judgement.

I don't think that has much truth to it, though. The facts are sorely lacking in support of such a claim.

The other 2 are pretty self-explanatory, based around god(s) and 'the evidence strongly suggests'.

 

[loverofhumanity]

You'll seek in vain, then. Even if there were some deity, and even if that deity in some way created an "objective meaning" to our lives, you yourself would never be able to know for certain whether that objective meaning existed or what it was. That's because all knowledge is ultimately subjective. Even inter-subjectively verifiable knowledge is ultimately subjective. And there is no escape from that. At best, you could have faith that there existed an objective meaning to your life and that you knew what that meaning was. But you could never be certain of it.

Of course we can be certain of it.

I've had a rich meaningful purposeful life. Knowing exactly my purpose has brought complete stability to my life.

 

[Augustus]

I don't think that has much truth to it, though. The facts are sorely lacking in support of such a claim.

Given the ubiquity of god based belief systems throughout human history, what makes you think the facts are 'lacking' as regards the statement 'god based belief systems seem to be the best at replicating and sustaining themselves'?

In your opinion, what does the evidence suggest?

 

[Rick O'Shez]

So is nihilism prevention a factor in peoples' religious beliefs?

 

[Jonathan Ainsley Bain]

There is a common question: Where do atheists get their morals from? I think it deserves more attention than it receives, but this is not ny main question.

Whenever I take an atheistic turn of mind it is automatically nihilistic. This is because I believe in objectivity and the answers I receive from most atheists rely on relativity and subjective meaning, which doesn't work for me because this, in essence, still means the meaning is made-up, which still imo leads to nihilism.

Thus my question:
So does, or can, atheism lead logically to nihilism?

I'm defining atheism as lack of belief in God or Gods, this is all.

aTheism and Nihilism are in effect, the same.