Everyone who hears of Jesus but does not accept Him is going to hell.

[Desert Snake]

I am concerned with only the spirit of Jesus' (supposed) teachings. I think there was truth in them.

I think that there is truth in the teachings, but also, misinterpretation. I find much of the interpreted meaning presented as faulty, in general. This is also connected to how the theology is read into the text, or believed, as well.

 

[leibowde84]

I think that there is truth in the teachings, but also, misinterpretation. I find much of the interpreted meaning presented as faulty, in general. This is also connected to how the theology is read into the text, or believed, as well.

Very true. And, that is where I'd like to think my personal relationship with God fits in and helps me to sort it out.

 

[Nakosis]

Anyone who doesn't accept truth, life, love, wisdom, knowledge, understanding, reality, peace, calmness, equality will be in a mental state of hell chasing their mind in circles in some way or another or many ways.

Dang it, you figured me out.

That a lot of accepting being required there. To which I ask, what is truth? What is life and love? Wisdom, knowledge, understanding and the rest... What are these things that we are supposed to accept? If we haven't identified what they are, how are we supposed to accept them?

 

[leibowde84]

Dang it, you figured me out.

That a lot of accepting being required there. To which I ask, what is truth? What is life and love? Wisdom, knowledge, understanding and the rest... What are these things that we are supposed to accept? If we haven't identified what they are, how are we supposed to accept them?

I agree. Generalities like this sound great, but they don't really do anyone any good.

 

[Nakosis]

Very true. And, that is where I'd like to think my personal relationship with God fits in and helps me to sort it out.

Your subconscious mind is capable of providing that relationship for you. Since it's subconscious, you wouldn't even be aware of it doing so.

How can you be certain that where you've consciously read the Bible, your subconscious hasn't taken that and married with your feelings (also developed subconsciously) and provided you with an answer?

I think the honest answer is that we don't. Even though we feel we should be able to, it's all happening at a subconscious level we can't consciously access.

 

[leibowde84]

Your subconscious mind is capable of providing that relationship for you. Since it's subconscious, you wouldn't even be aware of it doing so.

How can you be certain that where you've consciously read the Bible, your subconscious hasn't taken that and married with your feelings (also developed subconsciously) and provided you with an answer?

I think the honest answer is that we don't. Even though we feel we should be able to, it's all happening at a subconscious level we can't consciously access.

Very true.

 

[LASTINGLIGHT]

Couple of things, here. The 'story of Jesus's birth, if taken as false, is not a de facto declaration of a 'normal' storyline, ie. Mary is a Jewish woman, unwed, etc etc. The entire narrative could be inference as fictional, if you choose to disbelieve the virgin birth. My issue is, not your disbelief, that's fine with me, but the following expectation that people are supposed to believe the story at all. Why believe that the story isn't all made up, you already stated that the Bible has false, and true things in it. You are using a pre-set narrative, imo, fitting the Scripture into the 'story', that many secularists, and some other religious people as well, think that they are reading, when they read the Bible.


So, is the ''best guess', that Mary gave birth to a person named Jesus,, in Israel, in a barn, and that person became the quasi Rabbi fisherman carpenter whose verbal teachings were written down later by people who never knew Him, but they knew His teachings, and all the ''mystical'' stuff, (which is like, what, most of the narrative), is fictional? How does that ,make the Bible more credible? Or are you saying the Bible has no credibility?

In the Gospel of James Jesus was born in a cave. Who knew?

 

[Nakosis]

I agree. Generalities like this sound great, but they don't really do anyone any good.

Oh... Thanks.

I ask too many questions. I don't know the questions do any good either.

I can experience love and peace and happiness. Whatever leads us there is important. Whatever doesn't, isn't.

 

[Desert Snake]

In the Gospel of James Jesus was born in a cave. Who knew?

The gospel of James is an added epistle, ie not everyone considered it Scripture, at the time of addition into Canon. Take that any way you like, just bringing that into the dialogue.

 

[Unification]

Dang it, you figured me out.

That a lot of accepting being required there. To which I ask, what is truth? What is life and love? Wisdom, knowledge, understanding and the rest... What are these things that we are supposed to accept? If we haven't identified what they are, how are we supposed to accept them?

What everyone has in common.

That's the key, identification and conscious awareness which can only be experienced internally. A whole, balanced, and one mind. Defining doesn't do much. Denying oneself of all the things that create harm and divide. Loosing the chains of everything that has control over us. They can only gradually become more identified the more we die to lies and and rid of lies, and strip our ego's and labeling/judging by becoming humble. Taking no thought, a still mind, leaving the mind open, self control. Everything just gradually comes and follows automatically. Waking up, higher, altered, and magnified awareness. Knowing oneself and then surroundings. Only ways they can be identified. Everyone is equipped with everything they need internally, just a matter of taking the leap of faith and courage to seek and do.

There are many things we commonly do that hinders and deceives us that most are not aware of.

 

[metis]

Mary is a Jewish woman, unwed, etc etc.

As just a point of clarification, the term "wed" would be appropriate to their legal status as Mary was indeed "wed" by today's western standard because she was "betrothed" to Joseph, which carried legal status back then. However, during this period of betrothal, they could not live together or consummate the marriage. Some Muslims still follow this practice.

 

[Nakosis]

What everyone has in common.

That's the key, identification and conscious awareness which can only be experienced internally. A whole, balanced, and one mind. Defining doesn't do much. Denying oneself of all the things that create harm and divide. Loosing the chains of everything that has control over us. They can only gradually become more identified the more we die to lies and and rid of lies, and strip our ego's and labeling/judging by becoming humble. Taking no thought, a still mind, leaving the mind open, self control. Everything just gradually comes and follows automatically. Waking up, higher, altered, and magnified awareness. Knowing oneself and then surroundings. Only ways they can be identified. Everyone is equipped with everything they need internally, just a matter of taking the leap of faith and courage to seek and do.

There are many things we commonly do that hinders and deceives us that most are not aware of.

Ok, so there are layers of lies which must be stripped away in order to become enlightened?

Why didn't we just start out without the lies. You/I accepts the lies are part of our current state. Is there a purpose in that. How or why did this condition come about?

 

[LASTINGLIGHT]

The gospel of James is an added epistle, ie not everyone considered it Scripture, at the time of addition into Canon. Take that any way you like, just bringing that into the dialogue.

It is no epistle. It is not in the Bible. It is also called The Infancy Gospel Of James. Learn your facts before you criticize someone for not knowing theirs. Take that any way you like.

 

[Godobeyer]

It would be different in meaning to a Muslim. A muslim could accept Jesus as a prophet and messenger. To a Chrsitain it means accpting Him as Lord and Savior.

Jesus (pbuh) identify him self as prophet and messenger he NEVER EVER identify himself as GOD or Savior .

my point is like:
IF someone identify him self as male , then after his death ,his people identify him as female .

 

[Desert Snake]

It is no epistle. It is not in the Bible. It is also called The Infancy Gospel Of James. Learn your facts before you criticize someone for not knowing theirs. Take that any way you like.

A ''Gospel'', that is not in the Bible, is not a Scriptural Gospel. So, it's basically off topic. lol. There are a lot of 'extra' Biblical writings. I generally would not refer to them, if they contradict the main Gospels on something basic, like that.

I think the real question is, what point were you trying to make in the first place?

 

[Glaurung]

The implication, therefore, is that if I never heard about him, then I don't have to worry about going to Hell.

For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities--his eternal power and divine nature--have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse. Romans 1:20

It's not really about "accepting Jesus" whatever that is meant to mean. It's about recognising that you're a created creature and your dependence on the one omnipotent creator. Christians see this creator as the Triune God, incarnated as man in the person of Christ. We believe that every single human is at some level aware of the reality of God, and even if one has not being exposed to Christian claims explicitly, one will still be held accountable to the degree they have sincerely sought God. You do not get a free pass on ignorance of Christ alone, and it's certainly not a "safer" bet.

In that case, why in the world would you tell anybody about Jesus at all?!

In a certain sense what your saying is true, because once one is baptised one is held to greater accountability.

The servant who knows the master’s will and does not get ready or does not do what the master wants will be beaten with many blows. But the one who does not know and does things deserving punishment will be beaten with few blows. From everyone who has been given much, much will be demanded; and from the one who has been entrusted with much, much more will be asked. Luke 12:47-48

However it's also by baptism we receive the remission of sin and gain access the the Sacraments. Christ and his Church are the most assured way to gain the grace necessary for salvation and hence we are commanded to spread that possible salvation. Extra ecclesiam nulla salus does not mean non-Christians are by default all damned, but those who know the Church, who know Christ and yet obstinately refuse it all for their own sin and fancy will go to Hell.

It's going to be up to God to judge the testimony of our own consciences. And there'll be no chance for any rationalisation before the throne of God. We cannot "outwit" God.

 

[OurCreed]

As a Muslim, who does and does not go to hell is not for any human to decide.

Every human being is judged according to their own capacities and their own manner.

The answer to the poll should be: NO.

 

[Windwalker]

If you don't love Jesus for his own sake, but merely because you think his harvested body will be useful to you, IMO you are barely a Christian at all.

I really like this depiction of thinking his "harvested body" as being useful to them. That's perfect. I'm going to try to remember this term to describe what really captures the essence of what Jesus is to those that "believe" in order to be saved from hell. The focus is entirely about saving their own skin. It's narcissism. It's not about love.

As far the OP goes I would say most people's ideas of "accepting" Jesus is about a mental acknowledgement. In which case, that's pretty worthless. That's why I liked Savagewind's question about what is meant by "accept". To me, in the context of religion it has much more to do with "allowing". So, let's rephrase the entire popular Christian idea of 'accepting Jesus" from a simple 'belief' that magically changes some line on some legal document in heaven that say you won't be sent to hell, to say "allow" instead. Now, let's restate the question in those terms! "Everyone who hears of Jesus but does not [allow] Him is going to hell".

There we go. Much better now. Sort of changes the whole landscape of those who self-identify as "believers", doesn't it? It sort of makes the question not about those who hear but don't join the religion of that name, but about those who "hear", as part of that group, but don't not in fact allow, or accept the teachings internally. Standing in the group all day saying "I believe" is not the same thing as "I allow". In which case, where do they really stand? That turns the heat up a little more.

Personally, I agree with the view that hell is a metaphor for a mental state of separation. You can "believe" in the idea of a religious figure till the cows come home, but that doesn't do anything to change that mental state. So simply joining a religion isn't going to do it for you.

 

[LASTINGLIGHT]

A ''Gospel'', that is not in the Bible, is not a Scriptural Gospel. So, it's basically off topic. lol. There are a lot of 'extra' Biblical writings. I generally would not refer to them, if they contradict the main Gospels on something basic, like that.

I think the real question is, what point were you trying to make in the first place?

It was a reply to the story of Jesus birth. Why do you think Eusebius left some books out of the Bible and included others. It was not because they were not scripture but because they did not fit his particular views. It's all scripture.

 

[idea]

This is sort of unclear as to meaning, ie in what context are you presenting this. I don't think that 'some' people should have to accept Jesus, while others don't. That makes no sense, imo.

In this life, or in the next, we will all come to a knowledge of who Jesus is - it is only after we have a full and complete knowledge that we can make an informed choice to either accept Christ or not. I'm not going to point my finger at anyone currently alive and condemn them to hell - we all have an incomplete knowledge, God is just, and it would be unjust to hold someone accountable for what they do not know.