Everyone worships

[Link]

Then the Quran and Hadiths are wrong.
Looks to me like this whole thread is just a stab at atheists to say "you're just like me." That's just as bogus as the atheist trying to say "you're an atheist like me, I just believe in one less god than you."
The only confusion is when a theist tries to broaden the word until it's stretched thin and tearing in places just to try to erroneously claim everyone worships something. A lot of people worship nothing.

In what way? In a way that it offends the atheists so it must be wrong?

 

[blü 2]

I have found this to be true in our day and time, sometimes worded differently but people worship the One True God or something else. May be something tangible, themselves, objects but we were made to worship. People are no different than these philosophers.

”“The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples built by human hands. And he is not served by human hands, as if he needed anything. Rather, he himself gives everyone life and breath and everything else. From one man he made all the nations, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he marked out their appointed times in history and the boundaries of their lands. God did this so that they would seek him and perhaps reach out for him and find him, though he is not far from any one of us. ‘For in him we live and move and have our being.’ As some of your own poets have said, ‘We are his offspring.’ “Therefore since we are God’s offspring, we should not think that the divine being is like gold or silver or stone—an image made by human design and skill. In the past God overlooked such ignorance, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent. For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to everyone by raising him from the dead.”“
‭‭Acts‬ ‭17‬:‭24‬-‭31‬ ‭NIV‬‬

I don't get your point.

What definition of "worship" are you using?

 

[Nakosis]

I have found this to be true in our day and time, sometimes worded differently but people worship the One True God or something else. May be something tangible, themselves, objects but we were made to worship. People are no different than these philosophers.

”“The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples built by human hands. And he is not served by human hands, as if he needed anything. Rather, he himself gives everyone life and breath and everything else. From one man he made all the nations, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he marked out their appointed times in history and the boundaries of their lands. God did this so that they would seek him and perhaps reach out for him and find him, though he is not far from any one of us. ‘For in him we live and move and have our being.’ As some of your own poets have said, ‘We are his offspring.’ “Therefore since we are God’s offspring, we should not think that the divine being is like gold or silver or stone—an image made by human design and skill. In the past God overlooked such ignorance, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent. For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to everyone by raising him from the dead.”“
‭‭Acts‬ ‭17‬:‭24‬-‭31‬ ‭NIV‬‬

I think you are conflating the definitions of worship :reverence offered a divine being or supernatural power with the term being use as a figure of speech in which case you are doing both definitions a disservice.

 

[Bthoth]

There is two "I" in us.

Trying using the english language and you can elminate the use of 2 'i's

One that is from Iblis and Satanic and his breath, and one that is from God.

Funny

The one from God is from the Imam of time,

Imam of time.

""Imam"""" (definition).........a.....the person who leads prayers in a mosque. b...a title of various Muslim leaders, especially of one succeeding Muhammad as leader of Shiite Islam.

and the one from Iblis is from one of Satanic forces that is connected to Iblis and has his lineage (spiritually) from him.

imam are from ibis and satanic forces?

You either born of the spirit of truth (Imam) or spirit of falsehood.

All conscious life is born with the spirit and capable but the rude and ruthless are constantly trying to condemn and isolate people.

As i heard, sunni are superior to shia and what islame has a whole new layer of worship

Most people hold on to Satan thinking it's their original self or the self they chose to be.

i can see that, you hold onto some weird ideas of exceptionalism

"Who knows himself knows his Lord" - Prophet Mohammad, Imam Ali, and other Imams have said it.

OK............. do you know that your own self is misleading others and the truth by your own choice?

Until you know that, you will not know the boss.

a title of various Muslim leaders, especially of one succeeding Muhammad as leader of Shiite Islam.

muhammad has been gone for about 1400 yrs. and I heard the sunni keep the word of muhammad better than shia.

Care to explain which who is worshiping which satan?

 

[Bthoth]

Yes and words can only do so much. So many people recite Quran and still don't see the manifest enemy Satan nor detect the Qareen (close companion) from Iblis and hardly give Satan a fight.

Wow, that gin must be strong.

 

[Revoltingest]

My definition is the one it's been used from ancient times and by most of the world.

In a forum using English, we should
use current English definitions.
Then we'll avoid much confusion.

 

[Link]

@Bthoth we are going off the rails of the topic.

I will keep it with you with the last say.

 

[Link]

In a forum using English, we should
use current English definitions.
Then we'll avoid much confusion.

If English word was coherent, the conclusions of a religion class on how to define "religion" would not be so confusing and the conclusion of the professor teaching it would not be "there is no coherent definition without problems at the end".

There's been attempts, but there is no coherent universal definition of religion in the west. All of them from what I recall have holes.

This is what happens when you overcomplicate such a simple usage of a term.

 

[Bthoth]

If English word was coherent, the conclusions of a religion class on how to define "religion" would not be so confusing and the conclusion of the professor teaching it would not be "there is no coherent definition without problems at the end".

There's been attempts, but there is no coherent universal definition of religion in the west. All of them from what I recall have holes.

This is what happens when you overcomplicate such a simple usage of a term.

here in the USA and western world, you will either articulate with rational discourse and definitions or end up losing every argument.

Islam nor arabic 'we the people' and NEVER will. No yes man Imam or god of abraham controls US.

BE certain, no religious teacher can nor ever will change that.

 

[Quintessence]

I have found this to be true in our day and time, sometimes worded differently but people worship the One True God or something else. May be something tangible, themselves, objects but we were made to worship. People are no different than these philosophers.

I dunno about "made to worship," but there is little doubting that all humans - excepting the unconscious - engage in subjective valuation of the world around them. That process is the root of worth-ship, or declaring something worthy of worship. Some humans place more importance and mindfulness on the process of worth-ship than others. It is worth asking what level of value must be ascribed in order to use what is typically a very weighty word like worship.

I have no answer for that, as it is a very personal question. As such, though I agree with you on principle that there is no such thing as a human who does not engage in subjective valuation (and thus worth-ship of something in their lives), I'm not convinced that appending the term "worship" to all cases of this is necessarily a good call. It has utility in evoking common ground where folks can see past the superficiality of word/label/things and to the substance behind it, but less utility for those who quibble over "correct" definitions of words as they will be unable to see the validity of what it is you are trying to present.

 

[Link]

here in the USA and western world, you will either articulate with rational discourse and definitions or end up losing every argument.

Islam nor arabic 'we the people' and NEVER will. No yes man Imam or god of abraham controls US.

BE certain, no religious teacher can nor ever will change that.

We'll see. Surah Kahf is God's version of never say never in neverland.

 

[Bthoth]

We'll see. Surah Kahf is God's version of never say never in neverland.

Now it's your turn.

I get to name drop.

Peace be unto him.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

In what way? In a way that it offends the atheists so it must be wrong?

The way is to try to imply that even atheists worship something. They don't.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I dunno about "made to worship," but there is little doubting that all humans - excepting the unconscious - engage in subjective valuation of the world around them. That process is the root of worth-ship, or declaring something worthy of worship. Some humans place more importance and mindfulness on the process of worth-ship than others. It is worth asking what level of value must be ascribed in order to use what is typically a very weighty word like worship.

I have no answer for that, as it is a very personal question. As such, though I agree with you on principle that there is no such thing as a human who does not engage in subjective valuation (and thus worth-ship of something in their lives), I'm not convinced that appending the term "worship" to all cases of this is necessarily a good call. It has utility in evoking common ground where folks can see past the superficiality of word/label/things and to the substance behind it, but less utility for those who quibble over "correct" definitions of words as they will be unable to see the validity of what it is you are trying to present.

Water has a very high value to us. It is absolutely necessary for good health and survival. You'd be hard pressed to find someone who actually worships it, even among those who realize the availability of potable water is another cliff our society is on course to driving off.

 

[ElishaElijah]

wor·ship..........the feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity.

show reverence and adoration for (a deity); honor with religious rites.


NO.........NOT everyone worships

That same old line of rubbish has been used for 1000's of years.

It's an assumption created by the rude and still propagated by the mislead.

Everyone does worship:
Worship doesn’t have to be the exact act of bowing down to the ground or a song it is a lifestyle of what motivates you in life, what you give your life, money, love and adoration to.

 

[Link]

The way is to try to imply that even atheists worship something. They don't.

Depending on the definition. One problem with the dictionary definition, it's very circular.

It uses "religion" but then "religion" is related to worship (potentially but not always). That is you have to discuss worship when discussing religion (even if not all religions worship per claims of definition). So this is full circle defining.

 

[Quintessence]

Everyone does worship:
Worship doesn’t have to be the exact act of bowing down to the ground or a song it is a lifestyle of what motivates you in life, what you give your life, money, love and adoration to.

It's worth nothing that if we understand worship in this way, that which most humans worship does not match up with that which they call their gods, at least in a monotheistic society where the gods have been sundered from the world. As a Pagan I obviously have no problem with this perspective, but it has troubling implications for those of other theistic (and non-theistic) persuasions. For monotheists, it means every human is guilty of what they sometimes call idolatry which is quite the taboo. For atheists, it means they're lying to themselves which isn't exactly flattering. Neither of which are accurate depictions of how either group likely regards themselves on their own terms.

 

[Link]

For monotheists, it means every human is guilty of what they sometimes call idolatry which is quite the taboo.

Part of the awakening process of Quran and Sunnah and hadiths of Ahlulbayt (a) is to get you to realize a concept known as "hidden shirk". That is you are associating idols with God but hiddenly in a way you don't realize.

This is very useful for purifying the self.

 

[ElishaElijah]

It's worth nothing that if we understand worship in this way, that which most humans worship does not match up with that which they call their gods, at least in a monotheistic society where the gods have been sundered from the world. As a Pagan I obviously have no problem with this perspective, but it has troubling implications for those of other theistic (and non-theistic) persuasions. For monotheists, it means every human is guilty of what they sometimes call idolatry which is quite the taboo. For atheists, it means they're lying to themselves which isn't exactly flattering. Neither of which are accurate depictions of how either group likely regards themselves on their own terms.

I used to think worship consisted of the particular part of the service that songs were sung to the Lord but it’s much more than that. It is living a life that is pleasing to the Lord in every area of my life. That is worship for me to my Lord, if anyone including myself takes that place it’s idolatry.My love for Jesus Christ is above anything or anyone else, He is worthy of that.
For someone else they would have to answer that for themselves, offer an alternative if you don’t. Are you number 1 above everything else, what is for you? Has to be something

 

[Bthoth]

Everyone does worship:

That's a crock of assumption

Worship doesn’t have to be the exact act of bowing down to the ground or a song it is a lifestyle of what motivates you in life, what you give your life, money, love and adoration to.

Breathing motivates me. OH mighty breath of life, thank god I dont have to worship anything to be alive an appreciate each moment.