Evolution and Creationism both have equal value and scientific evidence to support them.

[Autodidact]

Because people that don't believe in God take issue with me.

Ding ding ding. Just want to draw this to your attention, posters. The more you disagree with Danmac, the more he's convinced he's filled with the spirit of God.

Danmac--what is disagreeing with you is science. You know, that thing you falsely claim to accept? It disagrees with you. Is the spirit of God opposed to science?

 

[Wotan]

"Originally Posted by Danmac
Because people that don't believe in God take issue with me. "

No Damca, people who don't believe in YOUR version of god.:shout

 

[tumbleweed41]

If science does not have an opinion on God stop trying to use science as a source to prove that there isn't a God. Since science cannot offer a scientific conclusion about God, all you can do is speculate without evidence. You see, you do have faith. Only in reverse.

So you are using science to disprove God. Only thru proxy. Ok I get it.

Because people that don't believe in God take issue with me. With you they do not.

My Bible says God created man not ape. When I stand before my God I will stand on what his book says.


Science just hasn't found out that it is wrong on the one common ancestor thing yet. Just like the cosmological constant. In time they will.



I find my identity in Christ, not in myself. I am an imperfect creature. In Christ I am complete. The glory goes to Christ not me.

John 7:18 He who speaks of himself seeks his own glory, but he who seeks the glory of Him who sent Him is true, and no unrighteousness is in Him.

Thanks for helping to prove my point.
Science and Atheism

 

[Jose Fly]

Obviously not.

What IS it about these people that they CANNOT get past the assumption that everything is about their ideas and their myth?

Has it occurred to you that maybe, Danmac is doing the best he can with what he has?

 

[McBell]

Others who say they have the spirit. There are a lot of wolves in sheeps clothing.

thanks for the heads up.
Now, what makes you think that you are not one yourself?

What is the matter Danmac?
You are finally asked a question that you should be able to answer with absolutely no problems and you choke on it?

And you missed this one as well:

If science does not have an opinion on God stop trying to use science as a source to prove that there isn't a God.

Would you please be so kind as to link to the posts of those who you claim are doing this?
​

Now since you are a god fearing Christian who would not disgrace your god by lying or bearing false witness (you are right?).....

 

[McBell]

Has it occurred to you that maybe, Danmac is doing the best he can with what he has?

Not me.
But then, there are plenty of his posts to show that he is merely a proud underachiever.
He does not want to learn about things that he thinks contradict his beliefs.

he has made that perfectly clear here on RF.
He is more than content with his willful ignorance.
In fact, he holds onto his ignorance with a two handed death grip because he has found that the more he waves his ignorance around like a flag, the more people will call him out on it, the more he feels prosecuted, the closer he is ends up to his god.

Nice little system he has worked out for him to keep hold of his warm fuzzies.

 

[Autodidact]

I believe Danmac is demonstrating just what Jose Fly described in another thread. It's that black and white, if not of God then of the devil thinking. When science questions his scriptures, science must be of satan. If we disagree with Danmac, we are of satan, which confirms that he's on the side of the holy spirit. It's a very limiting, screwed up, self-confirming, scary little box to live in.

 

[Jose Fly]

Not me.
But then, there are plenty of his posts to show that he is merely a proud underachiever.

I'm not talking about intelligence. I'm talking about the ability to question and potentially abandon everything by which one defines oneself. Few people can do that.

He does not want to learn about things that he thinks contradict his beliefs.

Does that surprise you? Do you think that sort of thing is uncommon in the human condition?

he has made that perfectly clear here on RF.
He is more than content with his willful ignorance.
In fact, he holds onto his ignorance with a two handed death grip because he has found that the more he waves his ignorance around like a flag, the more people will call him out on it, the more he feels prosecuted, the closer he is ends up to his god.

Nice little system he has worked out for him to keep hold of his warm fuzzies.

Sure. Humans do all sorts of things to keep themselves psychologically comfortable.

 

[Jose Fly]

I believe Danmac is demonstrating just what Jose Fly described in another thread. It's that black and white, if not of God then of the devil thinking. When science questions his scriptures, science must be of satan. If we disagree with Danmac, we are of satan, which confirms that he's on the side of the holy spirit. It's a very limiting, screwed up, self-confirming, scary little box to live in.

But it keeps him safe, comfortable, and happy. Plus he has the assurance of being in heaven after he dies.

Safety, comfort, happiness, and surety beyond death...Wouldn't you agree that abandoning those things would be an immense psychological upheaval for Danmac, and is not something to be taken frivolously?

 

[Autodidact]

Exactly. Danmac has shared that he is Christian because it makes him happy. Unfortunately, his particular brand of Christianity includes repudiating science, which is niggling around the edges of his certainty. After all, he knows science works. So he has to claim that most scientists aren't scientific. That's a tough position to demonstrate.

 

[Jose Fly]

Unfortunately, his particular brand of Christianity includes repudiating science

That's merely a side effect of the deeper psychological issue. Fundamentalist Christianity also repudiates modernism, multi-culturalism, tolerance, and a host of other things that are based in nuance.

which is niggling around the edges of his certainty. After all, he knows science works.

I disagree. I don't think science is making the slightest dent in his absolute certainty. I've yet to see a single sign of any sort of doubt or uncertainty in anything he's posted.

So he has to claim that most scientists aren't scientific. That's a tough position to demonstrate.

But that's not the criterion by which he operates. Whether or not one can demonstrate a point is irrelevant; what matters to a fundamentalist is whether it confirms his position.

I had a fascinating exchange with a fundamentalist Christian a few years ago where I kept asking over and over whether she understood the difference between saying something is so and demonstrating it. The fascinating part was that she never got it, or at least never allowed herself to post that she understood the difference. I think she realized that once she posted that she recognized the difference, she would also have to admit that say-so is inferior to demonstration. And that would automatically cause her to have to start demonstrating her points rather than just asserting them to be so. So instead, she elected to simply continue arguing via assertion.

So on the surface, she appeared rather dumb, but really I think she was thinking several steps ahead and was fending off what for her, would be a disastrous outcome.

Never underestimate the ability of the human psyche to keep itself safe.

 

[Autodidact]

Here's the thing. If your religion relies on asserting that science is false, and you know science works, because you use it every day, how do you reconcile that? Isn't that a foundation of sand? Or isn't contradicting yourself a problem?

It seems to me "safer" to adopt a religion that accepts science, if you know science works, which most people do nowadays.

Even Danmac says he accepts the scientific method, so how does he accept the scientific method and reject science?

Danmac: How do you accept the scientific method and reject science?

 

[Jose Fly]

But they don't make the assertion that "science is false". They assert that evolution is false, part of which involves arguing that evolution is not science (thus the whole "evolution is a religion" meme).

Problem solved.

 

[Autodidact]

I guess that's why they call people who accept science "evolutionists." However, to really hold their creation myth as truth, they also have to reject geology, astronomy, cosmology, paleontology, a lot of physics, archeology, linguistics, anthropology...You don't really have a lot of science left at that point. Maybe they don't realize that, or prefer not to.

 

[Autodidact]

But they don't make the assertion that "science is false". They assert that evolution is false, part of which involves arguing that evolution is not science (thus the whole "evolution is a religion" meme).

Problem solved.

Yes, but when pressed hard enough, around page 20 of the thread, the mask comes off and they start trashing science.

 

[Jose Fly]

In my experience, it's only the hard-core creationists who really are into the issue who have thought about it that much. For most, it's simply "The Bible is right and evolution is wrong" and not much beyond that.

And when cornered and given the choice between abandoning their faith or "trashing science" on an internet message board, it's a pretty safe bet which way they'll go (and actually, my experience is that most of them just leave the thread).

 

[Luminous]

There are a lot of wolves in sheeps clothing.

And there are a lot of devils in "Holy" robes. As Shakespeare once wrote:

"Often, The instruments of darkness win us with honest trifles, to betray us in deepest consequence."

Your point being that you are right and they are wrong...because you believe it to be true, and often times desire it. or could it be the other way around?

 

[Luminous]

Because people that don't believe in God take issue with me. With you they do not.

People that do believe in God take an issue with "you" as well. and people who don't believe in 'your God' sometimes also take and issue with Science. I am sure that if Atheists were left to ignorance, they would also not quite understand Evolution and would take an issue with it.

My Bible says God created man not ape. When I stand before my God I will stand on what his book says.

When I stand before The Judge, i will stand on what is TRUE...not on Idol scripture.
btw: the Hebrews hardly mentioned "ape".

Science just hasn't found out that it is wrong on the one common ancestor thing yet. Just like the cosmological constant. In time they will.

I dont like the idea of one common ancestor either... it seams very assumptive, but the idea of abiogenisis seams perfectly reasonable. the idea of magic poofing, and 'life giving breath'. seams very childish and bronze-agie, though there were also perfectly reasonable philosophers that lived in that time too.

I find my identity in Christ, not in myself. I am an imperfect creature. In Christ I am complete. The glory goes to Christ not me.

John 7:18 He who speaks of himself seeks his own glory, but he who seeks the glory of Him who sent Him is true, and no unrighteousness is in Him.

HIM! as in GOD! NOT YOU! ....see how the H is capitalized, there is NO RIGHTEOUSNESS in YOU, even If you claim to have Christ... all you have is a claim. This is why i prefer to call God an IT, that way simple people do not get confused with the semantics.

 

[Danmac]

HIM! as in GOD! NOT YOU! ....see how the H is capitalized, there is NO RIGHTEOUSNESS in YOU, even If you claim to have Christ... all you have is a claim. This is why i prefer to call God an IT, that way simple people do not get confused with the semantics.

You have a preference. Do you have a source for your "IT"?

 

[Luminous]

You have a preference. Do you have a source for your "IT"?

The fact that i do not believe "male" is a good characteristic of a "sole being" which is part of my defination of "God".
IT, is not really a preference. "He" is. In any case, not even idol scripture could give its followers righteousness...no matter how many times its idol pages spouted that it did.