Evolution My ToE

[Hockeycowboy]

Wait....wait..... @Hockeycowboy cited Ron Wyatt? Oh that's just too rich!

Was that picture taken by Ron Wyatt?

I really don’t know.

Was it a prop? You believe it wasn’t a chariot axle?
From what I understand, it was recovered, but is now lost.
(Gotta hide - or destroy - the evidence, I guess. Doesn’t surprise me. It saddens me, but doesn’t surprise me.)

 

[Subduction Zone]

@dad , you might enjoy this:

http://www.2001translation.com/Authenticity.htm

Your source cherry picked its first argument. It said that genealogies prove the Bible to be consistent and they ignore what for Christians would be the most important genealogies of all, and that one is self contradictory in the Bible. If anything it shows that the Bible is not the "word of God" since the apparent error (we all know that there are apologists that are ready to come up with false defenses of the errors of the Bible) was not one the poor way that they were presented disqualifies that book from that status.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Was that picture taken by Ron Wyatt?

I really don’t know.

Was it a prop? You believe it wasn’t a chariot axle?
From what I understand, it was recovered, but is now lost.
(Gotta hide - or destroy - the evidence, I guess. Doesn’t surprise me. It saddens me, but doesn’t surprise me.)

Yep, that was from his work. And no, that is just a story told for the gullible. It was a fraud from the start. Seriously do you think that a chariot wheel would last 3,000 years under the sea in near pristine condition? I have some swampland in Arizona that I am willing to sell cheap.

 

[Jose Fly]

What some do not know is that Ron Wyatt was a Seventh Day Adventist. They are a sect that interprets Genesis literally and even they called Wyatt a fraud. You would think that creationists would know better than to use his photographs of recent nautical disasters or even trash. Have you seen the pictures of brass ship's valve wheels that Ron identified as golden Egyptian chariot wheels? Did they think that the Egyptians were incredibly wealthy and extremely poor engineers? Even a gold alloy would make a very poor material for a wheel. If there were "golden wheels" from that time it would be wooden wheel with gold hammered over it. One can spread gold very very thinly. And wood actually works as a wheel. Sadly they do not last for 3,000 years under saltwater. As has been pointed out by other Ron Wyatt was the Indiana Jones of Biblical archaeology. He found everything and anything and like Indy, his finds were all fictitious.

When someone cites Wyatt to support their argument, you pretty much know right then and there that they're not doing even the most cursory of fact-checking and are likely just "arguing via Google".

 

[Jose Fly]

Was that picture taken by Ron Wyatt?

I really don’t know.

Was it a prop? You believe it wasn’t a chariot axle?
From what I understand, it was recovered, but is now lost.
(Gotta hide - or destroy - the evidence, I guess. Doesn’t surprise me. It saddens me, but doesn’t surprise me.)

I gotta ask....how did you find Wyatt's stuff in the first place? Did you just Google something like "archaeological evidence for the Exodus" and go with whatever came up that supported you? Did you do any investigation of Wyatt and his history at all?

 

[Hockeycowboy]

I gotta ask....how did you find Wyatt's stuff in the first place? Did you just Google something like "archaeological evidence for the Exodus" and go with whatever came up that supported you? Did you do any investigation of Wyatt and his history at all?

I googled ‘chariot wheels in the Red Sea’ images about 2 years ago, and added some pics to my photos.

I’d like to know how such an archeological treasure got “lost”.

 

[Jose Fly]

I googled ‘chariot wheels in the Red Sea’ images about 2 years ago, and added some pics to my photos.

And you didn't do any checking into where they came from?

I’d like to know how such an archeological treasure got “lost”.

Did it ever occur to you to look into Wyatt's background, history, and reputation among Biblical archaeologists?

 

[Hockeycowboy]

I gotta ask....how did you find Wyatt's stuff in the first place? Did you just Google something like "archaeological evidence for the Exodus" and go with whatever came up that supported you? Did you do any investigation of Wyatt and his history at all?

Why is this “Wyatt’s stuff”?

Why isn’t it Egypt’s Ministry of Antiqities “stuff”? Or don’t they want to preserve those antiquities?

 

[Hockeycowboy]

And you didn't do any checking into where they came from?


Did it ever occur to you to look into Wyatt's background, history, and reputation among Biblical archaeologists?

Yes, I have. It just raised further questions, and highlighted the Bible’s statements about who really is controlling & “misleading” this world!

Ask yourself, “How does a chariot axle get into the Red Sea, and eventually get covered with coral?”

 

[Jose Fly]

Why is this “Wyatt’s stuff”?

Because he's the one who claimed to have found it.

Why isn’t it Egypt’s Ministry of Antiqities “stuff”? Or don’t they want to preserve those antiquities?

Shouldn't you have already looked into all that before insinuating that there was some sort of cover-up? Did it ever even occur to you that maybe Wyatt was a notorious hoaxer?

Yes, I have. It just raised further questions

And what did you find?

and highlighted the Bible’s statements about who really is controlling & “misleading” this world!

You know, that's become one of the most fascinating things for me about having discussions with Jehovah's Witnesses. It seems whenever things aren't in line with what Witnesses want to be true, you just wave it away as further evidence that Satan is controlling things. It's always struck me as rather lazy and something anyone who believes in anything, no matter how outlandish, could employ.

Flat-earthers could wave away all the images, videos, etc., of a spherical earth as just more evidence that Satan is misleading humanity, right? And how would that differ from you doing the same thing?

Ask yourself, “How does a chariot axle get into the Red Sea, and eventually get covered with coral?”

Again, did it ever occur to you that Wyatt was a fraud?

 

[SkepticThinker]

Of course he was created by the One True Almighty God., the bible makes that clear. You have no evidence to the contrary and the bible is highly supported, so can be believed in areas that man can't check.

And why should anybody believe what the Bible says?

I don't need any evidence to the contrary to doubt your unsubstantiated claim. I will accept your claim when you present evidence for it.
That's the thing you don't seem to understand about claims, despite it being explained to you umpteen thousand times.

 

[SkepticThinker]

All evo infested and infected sciences will forever vanish soon. The truth will march on over their corpses laughing all the way and singing.

Uh huh.

More empty and erroneous claims to waste our time with.

Here's the thing, scientists can (and have) back up their claims about evolution with mountains and mountains of evidence collected over 150+ years by multiple independent groups of scientists in multiple different fields of science, all over the world. All the evidence points to evolution.

So, when you've got anything near that level of evidence for your past history/Adam/Bible/God/etc. claims, then get back to me. Without evidence, I don't believe it.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I googled ‘chariot wheels in the Red Sea’ images about 2 years ago, and added some pics to my photos.

I’d like to know how such an archeological treasure got “lost”.

LOL! It was not an archaeological treasure. I suggest that you read up on Ron Wyatt.

 

[Subduction Zone]

And why should anybody believe what the Bible says?

I don't need any evidence to the contrary to doubt your unsubstantiated claim. I will accept your claim when you present evidence for it.
That's the thing you don't seem to understand about claims, despite it being explained to you umpteen thousand times.

I think he understands well enough. His posts reek of quiet desperation at times. He knows that he cannot support his cliams, that is why he is so insistent that others support theirs and then either ignores or denies the support given. He has to claim that others have not supported there claims. It is the only tactic that he has.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

....highlighted the Bible’s statements about who really is controlling & “misleading” this world!

You know, that's become one of the most fascinating things for me about having discussions with Jehovah's Witnesses. It seems whenever things aren't in line with what Witnesses want to be true, you just wave it away as further evidence that Satan is controlling things. It's always struck me as rather lazy and something anyone who believes in anything, no matter how outlandish, could employ.

What we “want to be true”!

That’s really a laugh, because some of our beliefs, based on the Bible, is not what we’d like.

I don’t like the truth that my grandmothers are non-existent, their bodies just rotting in the ground...but I accept it.

I don’t like the fact that Jehovah doesn’t stop all the suffering even good people go through...but I understand the reasons for Him letting it continue on for so long.

Amazing that you can look at how screwed-up everything is, that some religiously-motivated people think they are ‘pleasing God’ by wanting to kill themselves just to kill others, that starvation affects 1/9th of the world but society lets 1/3 of the world’s food go to waste, et.al., and not think something is behind the scenes, influencing such heinous behavior and manipulating mankind.

I think you, along with most skeptics, are naïve.

 

[Jose Fly]

What we “want to be true”!

That’s really a laugh, because some of our beliefs, based on the Bible, is not what we’d like.

I don’t like the truth that my grandmothers are non-existent, their bodies just rotting in the ground...but I accept it.

I don’t like the fact that Jehovah doesn’t stop all the suffering even good people go through...but I understand the reasons for Him letting it continue on for so long.

Okay then, modify my statement to "what you believe to be true". The point remains the same (it's both convenient and lazy to dismiss everything that doesn't line up with what you believe to be true as Satan controlling things).

Amazing that you can look at how screwed-up everything is

That's probably the main difference between us. You look around and see "everything is screwed up". I look around and see quite a bit of good going on.

that some religiously-motivated people think they are ‘pleasing God’ by wanting to kill themselves just to kill others, that starvation affects 1/9th of the world but society lets 1/3 of the world’s food go to waste, et.al., and not think something is behind the scenes, influencing such heinous behavior and manipulating mankind.

I think you, along with most skeptics, are naïve.

I'm sure you do.

So you ever get around to looking more into Ron Wyatt?

 

[Hockeycowboy]

I look around and see quite a bit of good going on.

Like what, for instance? Individual incidents, yes. But how does it weigh in the scales overall?

 

[Jose Fly]

Like what, for instance? Individual incidents, yes. But how does it weigh in the scales overall?

I'm really sorry that the world immediately around you is so terrible that you feel compelled to attribute it all to Satan. I guess if I was in that sad situation, maybe being a Jehovah's Witness would be more appealing. Is that kinda what you guys look for when you go door-to-door....people who have sad lives?

And I suppose I can take your repeated ignoring of my questions about Ron Wyatt as an indication that you've dropped that part of your argument. Overall, that's a good thing and I hope it makes you more cautious in the future.

 

[shunyadragon]

Doesn't say much since many meteorite ALSO probably originated there, and some maybe exactly there!

Why would there be?? I think they come from the impact site if I recall..no? The issue is only whether the impact was from below or not.

Simply the most bizzaro answer you could give. Shocked quartz and tektites only form on impact.

False . In fact I have repeatedly stated that time was basically the same because a year was 360 days.

. . . but 66 million years does not equal 6000-10,000.

Much of it yes. Of course. In the former nature that was no problem, the only problem comes in sticking your pre determined beliefs into the equation.
False. In other words you have used the observed present nature processes to model the past by blind faith.

False we observe past nature of our physical existence based on the objective verifiable evidence.

Where is the evidence that the natural processes are not the same as today?

Still waiting . . .

 

[Hockeycowboy]

I'm really sorry that the world immediately around you is so terrible that you feel compelled to attribute it all to Satan

I just feel for some people, especially in other countries who have it worse. My life isn’t that bad, though.
But I’m not naïve about the pain many are going through.

I won’t press you for an answer...really the only good things are the results of what certain technologies have provided.

But people are more vicious & selfish than ever.

Take care, my cousin.