For those who doubt the Ouija Board...

[fallingblood]

In the spirit of this thread, I find this highly doubtful.

The challenge was published in the North Dakota Spectrum, on a couple of my sites (only a blog still being in existence), as well as a variety of other sites. Unexplained Australia - Paranormal Newcastle Hunter: News / Comments / $100,000 offered for proof of psychic powers
http://belzianmagic.xanga.com/584651045/item/

The original article is no longer available, but it was posted in it's entirety on both sites I posted. If you want further verification that I am the person in those articles, I can certainly provide it.

 

[Gentoo]

I know I started it and it's probably bad form, but I really could not be less interested in reading it.

 

[Nepenthe]

The challenge was published in the North Dakota Spectrum, on a couple of my sites (only a blog still being in existence), as well as a variety of other sites. Unexplained Australia - Paranormal Newcastle Hunter: News / Comments / $100,000 offered for proof of psychic powers
http://belzianmagic.xanga.com/584651045/item/

The original article is no longer available, but it was posted in it's entirety on both sites I posted. If you want further verification that I am the person in those articles, I can certainly provide it.

I too usually couldn't be less interested in reading vapid anecdotes on forums about paranormal phenomenon from strangers, but something about supernatural claims fascinates me.
And Jeff Sheridan! He's a huge influence, especially when it comes to street stuff. Not a big fan of McBride but he's undeniably skilled. Green's In the Trenches is great too.

Banachek, Ted Lesley and Maven are my favorites (I almost said living but Lesley died recently).

 

[blackout]

If your conception of something is "a joke",
(ie... something to mock, or roll your eyes at...)
what do you expect you will ever find there?

 

[blackout]

Divination, essentially, is the fine art of reading life signs.

If you do not see any signs, obviously there is nothing for you to read.

 

[Erebus]

I've used Tarot and pendulum dowsing with some accuracy in the past, but I couldn't possibly say whether or not this is coincidence. All forms of divination are a little suspect to me, but a couple seem to work. I prefer to use my tarot cards as ritual tools than tools for divination.

 

[fallingblood]

If your conception of something is "a joke",
(ie... something to mock, or roll your eyes at...)
what do you expect you will ever find there?

I personally don't think it's a joke. However, I've also seen far too many charlatans use supposed supernatural abilities to just con the weak and vulnerable. Which is why I am skeptical.

 

[Wandered Off]

I'm struggling to understand the need for a device if a spirit wishes to communicate. If it can move an object, wouldn't there be a more direct, reliable communication method? Silly question, but what if a spirit can't spell and accidentally sends the wrong message? Surely not all spirits are literate, right?

Also, I haven't figured out how or why spirits would hone in on a board in the first place. Do they see a Ouija board as kind of like a chat room or telephone? How do they know when to "show up?" Are there sort of annoying cell-phone-like ringers in the spirit world every time a human gets a notion to gab? OK, I used silly wording, but the question is genuine.

 

[Erebus]

I'm struggling to understand the need for a device if a spirit wishes to communicate. If it can move an object, wouldn't there be a more direct, reliable communication method? Silly question, but what if a spirit can't spell and accidentally sends the wrong message? Surely not all spirits are literate, right?

Also, I haven't figured out how or why spirits would hone in on a board in the first place. Do they see a Ouija board as kind of like a chat room or telephone? How do they know when to "show up?" Are there sort of annoying cell-phone-like ringers in the spirit world every time a human gets a notion to gab? OK, I used silly wording, but the question is genuine.

I can only offer my own opinion on this and it's pure theory, so take it or leave it as you see fit

Personally I see magic/divination as something of a beacon to spirits. They may be able to communicate anyway if they had reason to (such as an emotional connection), but such a beacon would be noticed by spirits without an emotional connection to the witch. In a way it is kind of like a spiritual chatroom
I don't trust ouija boards because people are touching the glass, but I do believe they could work as such a beacon.

 

[Sententia]

it's all utter nonsense.

/qft.

 

[Willamena]

I'm struggling to understand the need for a device if a spirit wishes to communicate. If it can move an object, wouldn't there be a more direct, reliable communication method? Silly question, but what if a spirit can't spell and accidentally sends the wrong message? Surely not all spirits are literate, right?

Also, I haven't figured out how or why spirits would hone in on a board in the first place. Do they see a Ouija board as kind of like a chat room or telephone? How do they know when to "show up?" Are there sort of annoying cell-phone-like ringers in the spirit world every time a human gets a notion to gab? OK, I used silly wording, but the question is genuine.

That's a very good point that (IMO) touches on whether Ouija should be deemed divination: the divine is found in signs, not symbols. Pointing to "Yes" or "No" or spelling out a name in letters is not signs. Being told in English, and in no uncertain terms, is (may be) someone communicating with you, but a divining it's not.

I fall on the side of saying that unless the words Ouija spells out are themselves used in a divination, no divination takes place in the process of using the Ouija.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

If you think the Ouija board is a joke, do you feel the same way about Tarot readings, Runes, Palm Readings, Ball Gazing, Dice, Tea Leaves, Pendulums, Astrology, any other form of Divination, or Fortune Telling?

Yup. At least when these things are being used for fortune telling. I think a pendulum can be a source of information... specifically, it can tell you the direction of a perfectly vertical line.

I do believe in many forms of Divination. Certain forms may or may not work in the right hands. I do believe these things work through the Gods and Goddesses when they do work. That being said, what is to keep a God from seeing to it that the appropriate fortune cookie wound up in front of the appropriate person when a message needed to be conveyed?

Yes, I originally meant the fortune cookie to be a joke, but it is possible to get a divine message in one, nonetheless.

"Possible" in the same sense that it's "possible" that government satellites are beaming subliminal messages into our brains. I'm still not going to go out and get a tinfoil hat, though.

If your conception of something is "a joke",
(ie... something to mock, or roll your eyes at...)
what do you expect you will ever find there?

For me, it works in the opposite order: I only consider it something to be mocked after I consider it and realize that I can't expect to find anything there.

Here's the more important question in my mind: why would I (or anyone else) expect to find something there?

 

[Willamena]

For me, it works in the opposite order: I only consider it something to be mocked after I consider it and realize that I can't expect to find anything there.

Here's the more important question in my mind: why would I (or anyone else) expect to find something there?

How does that differ from what Vi said?

 

[Valjean]

It's all bunk!

The only legitimate form of divination is the Magic 8-ball.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

How does that differ from what Vi said?

Her question suggested that if we approach these things with the expectation of not finding anything, we won't find anything. What I want to know is what expectation would be reasonable to approach them with.

 

[Nepenthe]

I'm struggling to understand the need for a device if a spirit wishes to communicate. If it can move an object, wouldn't there be a more direct, reliable communication method? Silly question, but what if a spirit can't spell and accidentally sends the wrong message? Surely not all spirits are literate, right?

Also, I haven't figured out how or why spirits would hone in on a board in the first place. Do they see a Ouija board as kind of like a chat room or telephone? How do they know when to "show up?" Are there sort of annoying cell-phone-like ringers in the spirit world every time a human gets a notion to gab? OK, I used silly wording, but the question is genuine.

That also raises plenty of other questions: assuming the ouija board works by the influence of spirits and not telepathy or para-cognition of some kind, is there some reason the spirits would hone in on ouija boards and not, for example, manipulate the electrons on a medium's computer monitor to type out full sentences, paragraphs, dissertations? If a spirit could make a rocking chair rock, stomp heavily up the stairs or make a planchette hover over the board untouched by human hands they must be able to physically manipulate their environment to some degree. And if they can move their environment in even more subtle ways, like even on a molecular level, why not spell out a message in bubbles in a cloud chamber?

 

[Nanda]

Yes...

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

When did the ouja board change from being a novelty which facilitated automatic writing as a party trick to being a tool for divination?

Good point.

According to Wiki, the term "Ouija" remains a trademark of Parker Brothers, a toy and game company.

 

[Willamena]

Her question suggested that if we approach these things with the expectation of not finding anything, we won't find anything. What I want to know is what expectation would be reasonable to approach them with.

Regardless that there is a reasonable expectation to approach them with, "why would I (or anyone else) expect to find something there" indicates to me an attitude of having approached them with an expectation of finding nothing. But perhaps I'm reading it wrong.

A reasonable expectation, I believe, lies in the philosophy that supports these devices in their usage, and in fact in their existence.

 

[Nepenthe]

When did the ouja board change from being a novelty which facilitated automatic writing as a party trick to being a tool for divination?

To answer the op, I don't believe in divination of any sort.

I wonder if it was WWII that started the spark of ouija-as-more-than-a-kid's-toy craze. Just like WWI was a booming time for seances and mediums, WWII saw people flocking to mediums to contact loved ones and the ouija board became a popular tool for contact. The NY Times ran a story in 1944 documenting how over one department store alone sold 50,000 ouija boards in a five month period. Then the 60s and 70s saw a revival in the supernatural and the ouija board was associated with the counter culture and youth movement(s). I also suspect film's like The Exorcist affected the ouija's popularity as a serious item rather than a kid's toy. While the board was taken seriously before The Exorcist, I suspect its reputation as dangerous was exacerbated by Captain Howdy.
Mitch Horowitz - Ouija: A History
Talking Boards in the Movies