Freewill and Volition

[Ben Masada]

Heres a parable Jesus had to say about you Jews and your knowledge over faith.

Well trees are also symbolic for mankind also. This is another parable most likely saying this about the Jews/pharisees and scribes and what they teach. Fruit is symbolic of knowlege and faith in God and His Son. Leaves in this are Gods commandments.

Mat 21:19 AndG2532 when he sawG1492 aG3391 fig treeG4808 inG1909 theG3588 way,G3598 he cameG2064 toG1909 it,G846 andG2532 foundG2147 nothingG3762 thereon,G1722 G846 butG1508 leavesG5444 only,G3440 andG2532 saidG3004 unto it,G846Let no fruitG2590growG1096onG1537theeG4675henceforwardG3371for ever.G1519 G165 AndG2532 presentlyG3916 theG3588 fig treeG4808 withered away.G3583

Then read the next couple of verses. The Jews lacked faith, but they did keep the commandments.

μηκέτι henceforwardG3371
mēketi
may-ket'-ee
From G3361 and G2089; no further: - any longer, (not) henceforth, hereafter, no henceforward (longer, more, soon), not any more.

Eze 17:9 Say thou, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Shall it prosper ? shall he not pull up the roots thereof, and cut off the fruit thereof, that it wither ? it shall wither in all the leaves of her spring, even without great power or many people to pluck it up by the roots thereof.

+++++++++++++++++++++++

The parable about the tree without fruits and only leaves was not pronounced by Jesus but interpolated by the Gentile who wrote the first Gospel. It's part of the 80 percent that constitute interpolations to the NT. I don't recall if I have told you before, I accept only 20 percent of the NT as genuinely from Jesus or that happened
to him. The rest is interpolation.

Ben :sorry1:

 

[Muffled]

+++++++++++++++++++++++

The parable about the tree without fruits and only leaves was not pronounced by Jesus but interpolated by the Gentile who wrote the first Gospel. It's part of the 80 percent that constitute interpolations to the NT. I don't recall if I have told you before, I accept only 20 percent of the NT as genuinely from Jesus or that happened
to him. The rest is interpolation.

Ben :sorry1:

What kind of logic works to have a Gentile interpolate Hebrew scripture?

My Bible claims that the Jew Matthew Levi who was one of the twelve apostles wrote the Gospel of Matthew.

 

[Ben Masada]

What kind of logic works to have a Gentile interpolate Hebrew scripture?

My Bible claims that the Jew Matthew Levi who was one of the twelve apostles wrote the Gospel of Matthew.

Matthew Levi was a Nazarene, and none of the writings of the Nazarenes got approved into the canon of the NT by the Fathers of the Church in the Fourth
Century due to their controversial character vis-a-vis the writings of Paul.

Ben

 

[Ben Masada]

What kind of logic works to have a Gentile interpolate Hebrew scripture?

My Bible claims that the Jew Matthew Levi who was one of the twelve apostles wrote the Gospel of Matthew.

Matthew Levi was a Nazarene, and none of the writings of the Nazarenes got
approved into the canon of the NT by the Fathers of the Church in th Fourth
Century due to their controversial character vis-a-vis the writings of Paul.

Ben :sorry1:

 

[opuntia]

The creation of the earth is no figment of our imagination since we are standing upon it. So if there is a creation then it necessarily implies a beginning. If two beings called Adam and Eve began the human race then so be it. But that is beside the point: Do we truly understand from Scripture or are we to forever debate the book?

The book called the Torah has been in existence for centuries and yet debate seems to come upon it. Where are the prophets who could tell us in no uncertain terms what these words mean? Constant debate only seems to muddy what was probably a clear book at its beginning. When Moses gathered together the words of God and the history of the Israelites there was no confusion. It is likely that Moses was not confused as he had access to the Supreme Being, so his writings should not be confusing. Is God a God of confusion or exactness or precision? If we desire metaphors perhaps we got what we asked for.

 

[Ben Masada]

To deny the existance of Satan is to call the bible and the Gospels uninspired. Check it out friend, the Christ makes direct refernces to the devil, and even had interaction with him.
Satan is not the opposite of God, but he is the servent of God and according to Job, can only act under God's authority. Satan did rebel against the will of God, and was himself wanting equality with God. This is what he uses to tempt mankind. Even if Genesis 1 and 2 is metaphorical, then he metaphorically still exists, and we must ask ourselves if in our demands that the first two chapters are metaphorical, then ask, what is the metaphor of Satan supposed to represent. But, the devil is not responsible for our choices to rebel or obey the Creator. If the devil was responsible, then God would be unjust. We know this because of the curses that are put on man and woman, along with the serpent. If the devil were responsible, we would not be under the curse of adam, and thus nulifying the need for mercy and our need for the Christ. That would mean Yeshua came and allowed himself to be murdered for no reason and moreover would be calling God a liar. We are completely responsible for our own choices to disobey the Father. Ben, it is interesting that you deny the existance of the devil...may I ask you why you have this understanding?

Because it doesn't make any sense. Devil or Satan is a concept to illustrate the evil inclination in man. There is no Spiritual Being besides God Himself.
God is absolutely One with no equal and no rival. Read Isaiah 46:5.

Ben

 

[Ben Masada]

Freewill is the only absolute thing man has been granted with. That's a gift that was not extended to the irrational animal. Even God abstains Himself from interfering with. However, advice is given to choose life. (Deut. 30:1920)

Ben

 

[drs]

no man is free, it is 1 of 2 things



1) your are a slave to sin and the devil.
Abraham’s Seed and Satan’s John 8


37 “I know that you are Abraham’s descendants, but you seek to kill Me, because My word has no place in you. 38 I speak what I have seen with My Father, and you do what you have seen with[l] your father.”
39 They answered and said to Him, “Abraham is our father.”
Jesus said to them, “If you were Abraham’s children, you would do the works of Abraham. 40 But now you seek to kill Me, a Man who has told you the truth which I heard from God. Abraham did not do this. 41 You do the deeds of your father.”
Then they said to Him, “We were not born of fornication; we have one Father—God.”
42 Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and came from God; nor have I come of Myself, but He sent Me. 43 Why do you not understand My speech? Because you are not able to listen to My word. 44 You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it. 45 But because I tell the truth, you do not believe Me. 46 Which of you convicts Me of sin? And if I tell the truth, why do you not believe Me? 47 He who is of God hears God’s words; therefore you do not hear, because you are not of God.”



2) you were a slave to sin but you have been bought by GOD at the price of the attoning blood sacrifice of JESUS CHRIST at which time you become reborn believing in JESUS CHRIST as your LORD and SAVIOUR and living in obedience to his will.


Romans 6

Dead to Sin, Alive to God

1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? 2 Certainly not! How shall we who died to sin live any longer in it? 3 Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? 4 Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection, 6 knowing this, that our old man was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves of sin. 7 For he who has died has been freed from sin. 8 Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him, 9 knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, dies no more. Death no longer has dominion over Him. 10 For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God. 11 Likewise you also, reckon yourselves to be dead indeed to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus our Lord.
12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body, that you should obey it in its lusts. 13 And do not present your members as instruments of unrighteousness to sin, but present yourselves to God as being alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. 14 For sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

 

[AK4]

Because it doesn't make any sense. Devil or Satan is a concept to illustrate the evil inclination in man. There is no Spiritual Being besides God Himself.
God is absolutely One with no equal and no rival. Read Isaiah 46:5.

Ben

To deny spiritual beings is to deny the Word of God. Who was interpreting the visions of Daniel to Daniel? Himself? Was it a vision inside a vision? Was it a regular man who was above the waters swearing to Him who lives eonian? Come on.

Dan 12:5 Then I, Daniel, looked, and there before me stood two others, one on this bank of the river and one on the opposite bank. 6 One of them said to the man clothed in linen, who was above the waters of the river, "How long will it be before these astonishing things are fulfilled?" 7 The man clothed in linen, who was above the waters of the river, lifted his right hand and his left hand toward heaven, and I heard him swear by him who lives forever, saying, "It will be for a time, times and half a time. When the power of the holy people has been finally broken, all these things will be completed."

Who were the three men who visited Abraham before the destruction of Sodom and Gommorah? Was Abraham talking to Himself?

Come on now

 

[Ben Masada]

no man is free, it is 1 of 2 things



1) your are a slave to sin and the devil.
Abraham’s Seed and Satan’s John 8


37 “I know that you are Abraham’s descendants, but you seek to kill Me, because My word has no place in you. 38 I speak what I have seen with My Father, and you do what you have seen with[l] your father.”
39 They answered and said to Him, “Abraham is our father.”
Jesus said to them, “If you were Abraham’s children, you would do the works of Abraham. 40 But now you seek to kill Me, a Man who has told you the truth which I heard from God. Abraham did not do this. 41 You do the deeds of your father.”
Then they said to Him, “We were not born of fornication; we have one Father—God.”
42 Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and came from God; nor have I come of Myself, but He sent Me. 43 Why do you not understand My speech? Because you are not able to listen to My word. 44 You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it. 45 But because I tell the truth, you do not believe Me. 46 Which of you convicts Me of sin? And if I tell the truth, why do you not believe Me? 47 He who is of God hears God’s words; therefore you do not hear, because you are not of God.”

Very good! Now, take a look at verse 31 of this same chapter of John. It says in there that Jesus was speaking to the Jews who had believed in him. What sense does it make that the Jews who had believed in him were seeking to kill him?

If those Jews had believed in him how could his words find no place in them? So, the Jews who had believed in Jesus were ready to charge him with being born out of fornication? Why would they think at all about that? Did they know anything about Jesus that we don't? Take a look at my thread, "The Alleged Sons of God." Perhaps
there is some truth in it after all.

How could Jesus call the Jews who had believed in him children of the Devil? Don't you think the guy who wrote the gospel of John was unfortunate to insert here this contradiction in the NT?

Ben

 

[drs]

Very good! Now, take a look at verse 31 of this same chapter of John. It says in there that Jesus was speaking to the Jews who had believed in him. What sense does it make that the Jews who had believed in him were seeking to kill him?

If those Jews had believed in him how could his words find no place in them? So, the Jews who had believed in Jesus were ready to charge him with being born out of fornication? Why would they think at all about that? Did they know anything about Jesus that we don't? Take a look at my thread, "The Alleged Sons of God." Perhaps
there is some truth in it after all.

How could Jesus call the Jews who had believed in him children of the Devil? Don't you think the guy who wrote the gospel of John was unfortunate to insert here this contradiction in the NT?

Ben

there is no contradiction you have to read more than just verse 31 here lets look at a larger view of the scripture lets go back to verse 13 and go through it all to verse 59.


we will find 2 groups of people those that believe and those that don't.


it begins with the group of Pharisees which would be those that do not believe LORD JESUS verse 13 they say your witness is not true.

verse 19 saying where is your Father.

verse 21 LORD JESUS says to them they will die in their sin.

verse 22 unbelieving Jews.

verse 24 again LORD JESUS says to them you will die in your sins if you do not believe in me.

verse 25 unbelieving who are you they say.

verse 27 they did not undestand.

verse 28 very important verse. speaking to those that did not believe he says when you lift up the Son of Man you will know that I am he ( meaning they will know who he has been claiming to be when he is lifted up (refering to the crucifiction)

verse 30 as he spoke these words many believed in him (not all, many)

In verse 28 we have those that will not believe untill he is crucified and in verse 30 we have many that believed in him right there.

verse 31 speaking to those Jews that believed in him.

verse 31 - 36 LORD JESUS teaches the difference between being in bondage/slavery to men and being a slave to sin.

verse 37 it is clear he is speaking to the unbelievers of verse 28 because they seek to kill him

verse 37-43 LORD JESUS is telling them GOD is not their Father because if he were they would love him and leading to verse 44 to show them who their Father is.

verse 44 LORD JESUS tells them they are of their Father the devil.


I did put the rest of the chapter in here but I think this anwsers your question.
Jesus Defends His Self-Witness


13 The Pharisees therefore said to Him, “You bear witness of Yourself; Your witness is not true.”
14 Jesus answered and said to them, “Even if I bear witness of Myself, My witness is true, for I know where I came from and where I am going; but you do not know where I come from and where I am going. 15 You judge according to the flesh; I judge no one. 16 And yet if I do judge, My judgment is true; for I am not alone, but I am with the Father who sent Me. 17 It is also written in your law that the testimony of two men is true. 18 I am One who bears witness of Myself, and the Father who sent Me bears witness of Me.”
19 Then they said to Him, “Where is Your Father?”
Jesus answered, “You know neither Me nor My Father. If you had known Me, you would have known My Father also.”
20 These words Jesus spoke in the treasury, as He taught in the temple; and no one laid hands on Him, for His hour had not yet come.
Jesus Predicts His Departure


21 Then Jesus said to them again, “I am going away, and you will seek Me, and will die in your sin. Where I go you cannot come.”
22 So the Jews said, “Will He kill Himself, because He says, ‘Where I go you cannot come’?”
23 And He said to them, “You are from beneath; I am from above. You are of this world; I am not of this world. 24 Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.”
25 Then they said to Him, “Who are You?”
And Jesus said to them, “Just what I have been saying to you from the beginning. 26 I have many things to say and to judge concerning you, but He who sent Me is true; and I speak to the world those things which I heard from Him.”
27 They did not understand that He spoke to them of the Father.
28 Then Jesus said to them, “When you lift up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am He, and that I do nothing of Myself; but as My Father taught Me, I speak these things. 29 And He who sent Me is with Me. The Father has not left Me alone, for I always do those things that please Him.” 30 As He spoke these words, many believed in Him.
The Truth Shall Make You Free


31 Then Jesus said to those Jews who believed Him, “If you abide in My word, you are My disciples indeed. 32 And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”
33 They answered Him, “We are Abraham’s descendants, and have never been in bondage to anyone. How can You say, ‘You will be made free’?”
34 Jesus answered them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, whoever commits sin is a slave of sin. 35 And a slave does not abide in the house forever, but a son abides forever. 36 Therefore if the Son makes you free, you shall be free indeed.
Abraham’s Seed and Satan’s


37 “I know that you are Abraham’s descendants, but you seek to kill Me, because My word has no place in you. 38 I speak what I have seen with My Father, and you do what you have seen with[l] your father.”
39 They answered and said to Him, “Abraham is our father.”
Jesus said to them, “If you were Abraham’s children, you would do the works of Abraham. 40 But now you seek to kill Me, a Man who has told you the truth which I heard from God. Abraham did not do this. 41 You do the deeds of your father.”
Then they said to Him, “We were not born of fornication; we have one Father—God.”
42 Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and came from God; nor have I come of Myself, but He sent Me. 43 Why do you not understand My speech? Because you are not able to listen to My word. 44 You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it. 45 But because I tell the truth, you do not believe Me. 46 Which of you convicts Me of sin? And if I tell the truth, why do you not believe Me? 47 He who is of God hears God’s words; therefore you do not hear, because you are not of God.”
Before Abraham Was, I AM


48 Then the Jews answered and said to Him, “Do we not say rightly that You are a Samaritan and have a demon?”
49 Jesus answered, “I do not have a demon; but I honor My Father, and you dishonor Me. 50 And I do not seek My own glory; there is One who seeks and judges. 51 Most assuredly, I say to you, if anyone keeps My word he shall never see death.”
52 Then the Jews said to Him, “Now we know that You have a demon! Abraham is dead, and the prophets; and You say, ‘If anyone keeps My word he shall never taste death.’ 53 Are You greater than our father Abraham, who is dead? And the prophets are dead. Who do You make Yourself out to be?”
54 Jesus answered, “If I honor Myself, My honor is nothing. It is My Father who honors Me, of whom you say that He is your[m] God. 55 Yet you have not known Him, but I know Him. And if I say, ‘I do not know Him,’ I shall be a liar like you; but I do know Him and keep His word. 56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad.”
57 Then the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?”
58 Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.”
59 Then they took up stones to throw at Him; but Jesus hid Himself and went out of the temple,[n] going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

 

[Ben Masada]

Nice try fella! A lot of writing but only to patch the holes in a boat in the middle of the Ocean. It didn't help. The boat sank. From John 8:31 and onward, the text is very clear that Jesus was speaking to the Jews who had believed in him. So, don't try to stop the sun with a sieve.

Ben

 

[drs]

Nice try fella! A lot of writing but only to patch the holes in a boat in the middle of the Ocean. It didn't help. The boat sank. From John 8:31 and onward, the text is very clear that Jesus was speaking to the Jews who had believed in him. So, don't try to stop the sun with a sieve.

Ben

I took all that time to write that and make it clear for you

So either you did not read it,

Or you read it and you have no defense because the scripture is true and you can not deny it no matter how much you try.

 

[Ben Masada]

I took all that time to write that and make it clear for you

So either you did not read it,

Or you read it and you have no defense because the scripture is true and you can not deny it no matter how much you try.

I will accept everything you copied on that research of yours if you submit it to the test of Isaiah 8:20. Is it a deal? Here's what it says in Isaiah 8:20, "To the Law and
the Testimony, if they don't speak accordingly, it's because there is no light them." That's the test of the Truth. I hope you understand that by the Law, the Prophet
meant the Torah. And by Testimony, the Prophets and the rest of the Tanach. Do you think your research can pass that test? And don't forget that you are dealing
with a Jew who by nature is not bound by the Christian NT.

Ben :clap

 

[drs]

I will accept everything you copied on that research of yours if you submit it to the test of Isaiah 8:20. Is it a deal? Here's what it says in Isaiah 8:20, "To the Law and
the Testimony, if they don't speak accordingly, it's because there is no light them." That's the test of the Truth. I hope you understand that by the Law, the Prophet
meant the Torah. And by Testimony, the Prophets and the rest of the Tanach. Do you think your research can pass that test? And don't forget that you are dealing
with a Jew who by nature is not bound by the Christian NT.

Ben :clap

What is your question?

 

[Ben Masada]

What is your question?

Again! The Law and the Testimony in a word means Judaism. Does your message conform to Judaism?
According to Matthew 5:17-19, Jesus came to confirm the Law and the Prophets down to the letter,
and warned us all to do the same. His gospel yes, would score a passing grade under the scrutine of isaiah 8:20,
but what you submitted to me in all that writing above would score less than an "F".
Please, no offense meant. That's not you personally. It's the message you report.

Ben

 

[drs]

Again! The Law and the Testimony in a word means Judaism. Does your message conform to Judaism?
According to Matthew 5:17-19, Jesus came to confirm the Law and the Prophets down to the letter,
and warned us all to do the same. His gospel yes, would score a passing grade under the scrutine of isaiah 8:20,
but what you submitted to me in all that writing above would score less than an "F".
Please, no offense meant. That's not you personally. It's the message you report.

Ben

1)Before we can have this debate we have to establish who JESUS CHRIST is.

2) in your words here I don't think I can covince you of anything untill we can agree that LORD JESUS is the messiah and truly GOD

And don't forget that you are dealing
with a Jew who by nature is not bound by the Christian NT.

3) if its ok lets start here. we will use the Old Testement.

what do you say about this?
Isaiah 9




6 For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given,
and the government will be on his shoulders.
And he will be called
Wonderful Counselor, [b] Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. 7 Of the increase of his government and peace
there will be no end.
He will reign on David's throne
and over his kingdom,
establishing and upholding it
with justice and righteousness
from that time on and forever.
The zeal of the LORD Almighty
will accomplish this.

 

[Ben Masada]

1)Before we can have this debate we have to establish who JESUS CHRIST is.

2) in your words here I don't think I can covince you of anything untill we can agree that LORD JESUS is the messiah and truly GOD

And don't forget that you are dealing
with a Jew who by nature is not bound by the Christian NT.

3) if its ok lets start here. we will use the Old Testement.

what do you say about this?
Isaiah 9




6 For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given,
and the government will be on his shoulders.
And he will be called
Wonderful Counselor, [b] Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. 7 Of the increase of his government and peace
there will be no end.
He will reign on David's throne
and over his kingdom,
establishing and upholding it
with justice and righteousness
from that time on and forever.
The zeal of the LORD Almighty
will accomplish this.

I wonder why you jumped to verse 6, but before we get there, let me tell you a little about verse one. The original brings a little different from KJV. Here it is:
"The people who walked in darkness have seen a great light. Upon those who dwelt in the land of gloom a light has shone. This "people who walked in darkness"
are the Gentiles in the Galilee whom the King of Assyrian exchanged by the Israelites when Assyria removed them from the Land. "Have seen a great light."
This light are the Jews returning from exile in Babylon and many sought to populate the Galilee. "Land of gloom" because it had become desolate after the Israelites
had been removed. And "the light that has shone" is the presence of the Jews back in the Land. That child or son who was born or given, is Judah born out of the
ashes of Israel and took the government of the whole Land, no longer divided in two Kingdoms. He, Judah will reign in David's throne forever, but a conditional
forever depending on loyalty to God's Law. Those titles of Mighty God, Evelasting Father and Prince of Peace are applied metaphorically to the new Israel from the
stock of Judah. And everything will be accomplished by the zeal of the Lord in the People. Now, to establish who Jesus was, he was neither the Messiah nor God in the flesh.
Unless you have the potential to persuade me of the contrary. Then, and only then, we will be in business.

Ben :shout

 

[drs]

I wonder why you jumped to verse 6, but before we get there, let me tell you a little about verse one. The original brings a little different from KJV. Here it is:
"The people who walked in darkness have seen a great light. Upon those who dwelt in the land of gloom a light has shone. This "people who walked in darkness"
are the Gentiles in the Galilee whom the King of Assyrian exchanged by the Israelites when Assyria removed them from the Land. "Have seen a great light."
This light are the Jews returning from exile in Babylon and many sought to populate the Galilee. "Land of gloom" because it had become desolate after the Israelites
had been removed. And "the light that has shone" is the presence of the Jews back in the Land. That child or son who was born or given, is Judah born out of the
ashes of Israel and took the government of the whole Land, no longer divided in two Kingdoms. He, Judah will reign in David's throne forever, but a conditional
forever depending on loyalty to God's Law. Those titles of Mighty God, Evelasting Father and Prince of Peace are applied metaphorically to the new Israel from the
stock of Judah. And everything will be accomplished by the zeal of the Lord in the People. Now, to establish who Jesus was, he was neither the Messiah nor God in the flesh.
Unless you have the potential to persuade me of the contrary. Then, and only then, we will be in business.

Ben :shout

First this is not metaphorical this is literal and we must interpret it this way to get a proper and true understanding.


Mighty God(captial G) is only used to represent the true God never metephorically

The Immanuel Prophecy Isaiah 7


10 Moreover the LORD spoke again to Ahaz, saying, 11 “Ask a sign for yourself from the LORD your God; ask it either in the depth or in the height above.”
12 But Ahaz said, “I will not ask, nor will I test the LORD!”
13 Then he said, “Hear now, O house of David! Is it a small thing for you to weary men, but will you weary my God also? 14 Therefore the Lord Himself will give you a sign: Behold, the virgin shall conceive and bear a Son, and shall call His name Immanuel.[b] 15 Curds and honey He shall eat, that He may know to refuse the evil and choose the good. 16 For before the Child shall know to refuse the evil and choose the good, the land that you dread will be forsaken by both her kings. 17 The LORD will bring the king of Assyria upon you and your people and your father’s house—days that have not come since the day that Ephraim departed from Judah.”


correct me if I am wrong

I have read most of the reasons why Jews do not believe in JESUS CHRIST

alot of it has to do with the Jew's saying he did not fulfill certain scriptures.

next the common argument I have read by Christians is they say he will fufill the scriptures on his second coming.

So some were filled on his first coming and the rest will be filled on his second coming according to the Christians.


would you agree with this?

 

[AK4]

First this is not metaphorical this is literal and we must interpret it this way to get a proper and true understanding.


Mighty God(captial G) is only used to represent the true God never metephorically

The Immanuel Prophecy Isaiah 7


10 Moreover the LORD spoke again to Ahaz, saying, 11 “Ask a sign for yourself from the LORD your God; ask it either in the depth or in the height above.”
12 But Ahaz said, “I will not ask, nor will I test the LORD!”
13 Then he said, “Hear now, O house of David! Is it a small thing for you to weary men, but will you weary my God also? 14 Therefore the Lord Himself will give you a sign: Behold, the virgin shall conceive and bear a Son, and shall call His name Immanuel.[b] 15 Curds and honey He shall eat, that He may know to refuse the evil and choose the good. 16 For before the Child shall know to refuse the evil and choose the good, the land that you dread will be forsaken by both her kings. 17 The LORD will bring the king of Assyria upon you and your people and your father’s house—days that have not come since the day that Ephraim departed from Judah.”


correct me if I am wrong

I have read most of the reasons why Jews do not believe in JESUS CHRIST

alot of it has to do with the Jew's saying he did not fulfill certain scriptures.

next the common argument I have read by Christians is they say he will fufill the scriptures on his second coming.

So some were filled on his first coming and the rest will be filled on his second coming according to the Christians.


would you agree with this?

Good luck drs. No matter how many truths you show Ben even without using anything from the NT he wont see it.