French Burka Ban

[blackout]

One thing is for sure they will remain a minority. My country has a majority of Muslims, yet the number of women who wears it is still a minority. So i'm not so sure it will become a norm if you mean by norm very common.

Still I think it's good to mix it up a bit.
Keep people on their toes.

I for one would teach my children
NEVER to assume there is a "religious/holy woman"
under any particular type of body bag.

Body bags, are body bags.

ANYONE could be under any such covering.

You have NO IDEA who is under a full body/face cover.
Sometimes the packaging lies.
Packaging can be purposely misleading.

By "Norm", I meant socially accepted.

 

[Badran]

Still I think it's good to mix it up a bit.
Keep people on their toes.

Cool.

I for one would teach my children
NEVER to assume there is a "religious/holy woman"
under any particular type of body bag.

Body bags, are body bags.

ANYONE could be under any such covering.

You have NO IDEA who is under a full body/face cover.
Sometimes the packaging lies.
Packaging can be purposely misleading.

True, except for the body bag part. Probably not a good idea to use these terms which are intended for insults around children, its not a good example to give them.

By "Norm", I meant socially accepted.

If that means socially viewed as something good, that will probably not be the case.

 

[blackout]

Cool.



True, except for the body bag part. Probably not a good idea to use these terms which are intended for insults around children, its not a good example to give them.

A body bag... by any other name....
(is still a body bag)

I do not teach my children reverence.
In fact a healthy dose of irreverance
keeps you real,
and keeps life funny.
Are comedians reverent?
I personally teach my kids not to take life too seriously,
but
to be wise to the situations they are in,
to their surroundings,
and never to hurt anyone unnecessarilly.
You can still be respectful of the person IN the bag,
without having an ounce of respect for the bag itself.

Some people cover their faces in public,
others of us 'cover' our comments/words, in public.

Hope I expressed that well.
My children, and I , really are VERY loving.
We just don't do reverence. or piety.
And at home,
we speak freely.

You might say that is OUR religion.

 

[nameless]

I agree this is not part of the religion, however they don't. My opinion and yours are not better than theirs. So, there still would be inhibition.

While religion not calls for face-covering, it is sure that they wear as they are brainwashed. When this is the case, dont you think people like yourselves has the duty to eduacate them, rather than allowing them to lead a miserable life?

And as for tasting freedom, those of them who chose to wear it had already been tasting freedom, until France decided to take it away for them.

it is actually 'freedom' to practise non-freedom, im talking about freedom of dressing offered by religion.

Not necessarily of course, i'm pretty sure based on your experience you know how despicable these people are.

badran, while religion not demands for face-covering, how did it gained so much popularity out of no-where? why the reverse cannot happen?

Let me give an example of this situation. We have a problem with some men beating up their wives with a broomstick. So, someone decided to ban selling broomsticks. Resulting in hurting other people who use broomsticks properly, and the people who sell broomsticks. While the man who actually does the beating, will just find something else to beat up his wife with. Problem not even close to being solved, on the contrary, we only added to it.

All of this of course assuming that this was France's intent, which is not the case.

thanks for the example, i think not everyone will force women to stay at home, taking them as example the number starts growing as people are not comfortable staying at home whole day.

 

[Badran]

A body bag... by any other name....
(is still a body bag)

I do not teach my children reverence.
In fact a healthy dose of irreverance
keeps you real,
and keeps life funny.
Are comedians reverent?
I personally teach my kids not to take life too seriously,
but
to be wise to the situations they are in,
to their surroundings,
and never to hurt anyone unnecessarilly.
You can still be respectful of the person IN the bag,
without having an ounce of respect for the bag itself.

Some people cover their faces in public,
others of us 'cover' our comments/words, in public.

Hope I expressed that well.
My children, and I , really are VERY loving.
We just don't do reverence. or piety.
And at home,
we speak freely.

You might say that is OUR religion.

I have no doubt you & your children are very loving, in fact i have no doubt that all your feelings against this, and your tendency to criticize it, is driven from your contempt to what you believe it does to women, or what it represents in terms of how some men view women. If my understanding is correct, i also happen to wholeheartedly agree.

If i was a woman wearing a niqab or burqa though, i'd still be insulted even if i realized your intents. Because the fact is its not a body bag, it already has a name. Tents & body bags or sacks are insulting terms to any women who chooses or even is forced on wearing this. This is not such a big deal that i need to tell you about it, however in your posts in general you try to be compassionate towards other women, and these terms would be a barrier.

I honestly hope i didn't get too personal, but i just thought its worth it to tell you this.

 

[waitasec]

You still haven't provided any evidence. Seems like you're getting more and more frustrated.

i did you chose to ignore it...:ignore:
not my problem

 

[waitasec]

Not if they chose to.

And for arguments sake if we assume that this choice does hold back, its their choice not yours.

not if they have been indoctrinated...

Once again, this is your view of the burqa, which on its own is completely irrelevant to whether or not it should be banned.

it is wrong because it is a double standard...simple

 

[Bismillah]

you are equating the right for same sex marriage to the niqab..

Try reading a bit harder.

"There are many things not accepted as socially acceptable that many humanists argue for "

because it is not socially acceptable behavior in the western culture...

Integrating is NOT CONFORMITY.

 

[blackout]

I have no doubt you & your children are very loving, in fact i have no doubt that all your feelings against this, and your tendency to criticize it, is driven from your contempt to what you believe it does to women, or what it represents in terms of how some men view women. If my understanding is correct, i also happen to wholeheartedly agree.

If i was a woman wearing a niqab or burqa though, i'd still be insulted even if i realized your intents. Because the fact is its not a body bag, it already has a name. Tents & body bags or sacks are insulting terms to any women who chooses or even is forced on wearing this. This is not such a big deal that i need to tell you about it, however in your posts in general you try to be compassionate towards other women, and these terms would be a barrier.

I honestly hope i didn't get too personal, but i just thought its worth it to tell you this.

Garments, in general, are given "general" names.

Pants, dress, skirt, shirt, socks....
Cloak, cape, hoodie....

They are descriptive of a "general" type of garment.

When there is a general/generic name for a full body/face covering garment,
I will call it by that name.

In real life, to a Muslum woman, I would refer to her ... clothing?....
as a "full body covering". (not a "body bag")

If y'all didn't give your full body covering a religious name,
and an assembly line design,
france would have NO'THING to BAN.
Do you understand that?

really.

 

[waitasec]

Try reading a bit harder.

"There are many things not accepted as socially acceptable that many humanists argue for "

like what?

Integrating is NOT CONFORMITY.

you mean culture shock?
:areyoucra

 

[Badran]

While religion not calls for face-covering, it is sure that they wear as they are brainwashed.

They may have just misunderstood, it doesn't have to be that they're brain washed. Or of course, another possibility, is that we misunderstood, not them.

When this is the case, dont you think people like yourselves has the duty to eduacate them, rather than allowing them to lead a miserable life?

i have no call in allowing anybody to do or not to do whatever they want. However i agree i should try to get my opinion across. Big difference between forcing people to follow my opinion and between convincing them to do so.

it is actually 'freedom' to practise non-freedom, im talking about freedom of dressing offered by religion.

So in other words in your opinion religion shouldn't have a say in this matter, fine thats your opinion. Obviously not theirs. And they chose to follow this religion, and they accept its teachings. None of our business.

badran, while religion not demands for face-covering, how did it gained so much popularity out of no-where? why the reverse cannot happen?

It could, but it most likely won't. And that on its own even if it was most likely that it'll work does not justify us taking their decisions for them.

thanks for the example, i think not everyone will force women to stay at home, taking them as example the number starts growing as people are not comfortable staying at home all the day.

Not everyone of course, but some will. And like i said even if the result was going to be as such, that doesn't justify us making their decisions for them.

 

[Bismillah]

like what?

"gay marriage"

you mean culture shock?

Don't try to replace actual arguments with jargon. Adjusting to a new environment does not mean CONFORMITY.

 

[zenzero]

Friend Badran,

This is an inhibition.

Then do liberate by example!

Love & rgds

 

[Badran]

not if they have been indoctrinated...

Which you have no authority of determining who was and who wasn't. And of course even if they were, that still does not justify doing this.

it is wrong because it is a double standard...simple

No not simple at all.

Its wrong in your opinion, which is irrelevant.

Also, if it was wrong, that still doesn't mean it necessarily should be illegal.

 

[blackout]

Here is another full body covering...

and another......

 

[Badran]

Garments, in general, are given "general" names.

Pants, dress, skirt, shirt, socks....
Cloak, cape, hoodie....

They are descriptive of a "general" type of garment.

When there is a general/generic name for a full body/face covering garment,
I will call it by that name.

In real life, to a Muslum woman, I would refer to her ... clothing?....
as a "full body covering".

If y'all didn't give your full body covering a religious name,
and an assembly line design,
france would have NO'THING to BAN.
Do you understand that?

really.

So if in real life you would call it full body covering, okay then.

But why is it okay on the internet to call it a body bag? Isn't there a possibility a woman wearing it would read this?

I'm pretty sure i misunderstood something, especially because i can't make sense of the last part of your post.

 

[blackout]

So if in real life you would call it full body covering, okay then.

But why is it okay on the internet to call it a body bag? Isn't there a possibility a woman wearing it would read this?

I'm pretty sure i misunderstood something, especially because i can't make sense of the last part or your post.

It's my own generic lingo.

I'm not singling out the "burqa" to call it a body bag.
The beekeeper suit is ALSO a body bag.

 

[Bismillah]

wrong topic.

 

[Badran]

Friend Badran,


Then do liberate by example!

Love & rgds

Okay i'll try

 

[zenzero]

Friend Bismillah,

wrong topic.

Kindly correct the wrong topic by guiding it to the right.

That is what human mind does; it either takes one to the *LEFT* or towards the *RIGHT* but never transcends itself to overcome the past and future by being in the PRESENT and that is France has banned the wearing of BURKHA by human on its soil.

Love & rgds