God's conditional love

[Spirit of Light]

Why is God's love for us conditional on us believing in him and doing what he says?

If a person didn't believe in me and didn't do what I told them to then I wouldn't not love them because of that

It wouldn't even bother me yet God would send such people to Hell because of this

So why is it that way with God? Why is his love so conditional?

I can not speak for God, but maybe it is because the teaching God have sent to people is the recipe for how we can come back to heaven? So when we follow the teaching, and make progress it pleases God.

 

[AppieB]

It's not totally conditional but not totally unconditional. God is trying to find a way to redeem us through his compassion and wants us to enter paradise out of his grace, but if we become hateful towards God and his light and don't respond to the call of God and his Messengers, we've really wasted our lives and belittled God's sanctity in this case, the proper response is his wrath and anger.

So that means God's love is conditional. Why would his "wrath and anger" be a proper response to a person who honestly seeked the truth, but didn't became convinced God existed?

If we seek intercession of God and his chosen guides, we will, be responded to through his grace. It's not that we earn paradise through his justice nor that we enter hell solely through his justice, but rather we enter paradise due to his grace and would enter hell despite his compassion and grace outreach in this world.

Wouldn't that be the proper response to everyone, theist or atheist?

If we choose to not even give the sent ones from God a chance, we have ourselves to blame truly.
God has the right to be worshiped and no other being does.

If God could provide sufficient reason to believe, why is it the atheists fault for not believing?

 

[AppieB]

On what justifiable grounds would it not be conditional? What does the one and only, holy and transcendent God have to do with an atheist, a satanist or a murderer?

Well, thank you for putting atheists is the same bucket as murderers. Do you really think atheists are inherent bad people?

What lesson does a father teach his children when he allows them to disobey him, curse him, or spit in his face?
How can one build a sinless kingdom with subjects who don't care about righteousness, respect and decency, and who prefer to do the opposite.

Not being convinced God exists doesn't mean we want to disobey him or we don't care about righteousness.

Love must be free, therefore humans must be fee to chose that which attracts them. But, freedom is a great responsibility and comes at a price - people make their own beds.
God has not rejected anyone, they have rejected Him, and it serves no purpose to compel them by force or coercion to do that which their heart is not inclined to do.

Did God give you sufficient reason to believe in Him? If so, why couldn't I get sufficient reason to believe in Him? It doesn't have to be by "force or coercion". I'm open to the existence of God. Just give me sufficient reason.

 

[Link]

So that means God's love is conditional. Why would his "wrath and anger" be a proper response to a person who honestly seeked the truth, but didn't became convinced God existed?

Wouldn't that be the proper response to everyone, theist or atheist?

If God could provide sufficient reason to believe, why is it the atheists fault for not believing?

If there is no sufficient reason to believe in God, God would not punish people for not believing in him. And if people sought the truth but didn't find it, he would not punish people for that.

 

[pearl]

Why is his love so conditional?

Its not. We are loved unconditionally. But we do not always choose to accept it.

 

[Brian2]

God's love is conditional by John 3:16 alone. Maybe it's more whoever wants to accept his conditions may benefit but it's definitely not unconditional. The events in the bible prove that there are conditions to even receive god's forgiveness. If those who don't believe get the same benefits as those who do then it's unconditional. If they do not (whether non-believers are consequenced or they just die by default), it's conditional.

Even the term god alone makes it conditional. If something/someone is an object or person of worship and the purpose is to worship, those that don't, well. Maybe unconditional would be if god was a friend not a parent.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

That tells us how God unconditionally loves us even before we turn to Him.
Judgement of humanity is coming and accepting the condition of repentance and faith in Jesus gives us a pass over the judgement.
Not accepting Jesus means we go through the judgement.
The loving God is being loving at the judgement and when He rids creation of those who refused to do what was right in life.
Is this loving for those who receive the judgement?
That is up to you to decide.
It is certainly loving for those from whom the evil people are taken.
The truth is that God can be a friend to those who are His friend and can be anything that people need. It is all done in love.
If we think that God's love means we can do anything we like and be forgiven at the end of the day, I don't think that is correct.

 

[Kenny]

Not being convinced God exists doesn't mean we want to disobey him or we don't care about righteousness.

This wasn't my statement to which you answered... I'ts ok, I've done that before.

Did God give you sufficient reason to believe in Him? If so, why couldn't I get sufficient reason to believe in Him? It doesn't have to be by "force or coercion". I'm open to the existence of God. Just give me sufficient reason.

It is interesting that what convinces one person doesn't convince another, isn't it?

I have three children. I can say something to them and get three different responses. Is it really the messengers fault? or is it the hearers fault?

That being said, when someone asked me to believe in God and the work of the Cross, I said "No". But it wasn't "NO" but rather "No, you haven't given me enough information to be convinced".

I had a lot of questions but I was interested in knowing the answers.

Yes, you are right, it can't be by "force or coercion". And certainly i don't know what classifies as "sufficient reason" for you. For that matter, as Jesus would say, "Come to me if your are thirsty". Two points being 1) One really has to be thirsty - there are those who are not and 2) You have to come. Some people really are thirsty buy have no interest in coming and they fill their thirst with other things.

Did you have a question?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

That tells us how God unconditionally loves us even before we turn to Him.
Judgement of humanity is coming and accepting the condition of repentance and faith in Jesus gives us a pass over the judgement.
Not accepting Jesus means we go through the judgement.
The loving God is being loving at the judgement and when He rids creation of those who refused to do what was right in life.
Is this loving for those who receive the judgement?
That is up to you to decide.
It is certainly loving for those from whom the evil people are taken.
The truth is that God can be a friend to those who are His friend and can be anything that people need. It is all done in love.
If we think that God's love means we can do anything we like and be forgiven at the end of the day, I don't think that is correct.

"Who soever believes" brings a condition to his love.
If it were god loved the world for all people have everlasting life, then its unconditional.

 

[1213]

God's love is conditional by John 3:16 alone. Maybe it's more whoever wants to accept his conditions may benefit but it's definitely not unconditional....

Sorry, I disagree with that. God loves all (cares of all), but it does not mean He allows evil people to continue forever and make life miserable eternal suffering for all.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Sorry, I disagree with that. God loves all (cares of all), but it does not mean He allows evil people to continue forever and make life miserable eternal suffering for all.

Unconditional love doesn't have "evil" people. It doesn't let evil people continue forever because unconditional love will not let people be in sin. Unconditional love doesn't allow suffering and won't even have that as an option. It doesn't have "whosever believes" but loves all people whether they believe or not.

 

[muhammad_isa]

Sorry, I disagree with that. God loves all (cares of all), but it does not mean He allows evil people to continue forever and make life miserable eternal suffering for all.

True .. but it is not for us judge.
We don't even know our own destination..
..we all rely on God's Mercy.
..and His mercy is greater than His wrath.

 

[muhammad_isa]

Unconditional love doesn't allow suffering and won't even have that as an option..

That makes no sense whatsoever.
Almighty God allows suffering in this life, doesn't he?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

@1213 The whole bible is made up of conditions for god's love. The "unconditional love" god gives are only to his believers. What Does the Bible Say About Unconditional Love?

1. Unconditional love loves people despite their belief
2. Unconditional love would die for all people not just for those who believe
3. Unconditional love will make sure everyone knows this love and no one will be absent from it
4. Unconditional love doesn't choose who it wants to love-there are no strings attached
5. 1 Corinthians 13:4-7 But love is jealeous?
6. John 15:13 But why not die for evil people too? Unconditional love says yes.
7. Luke 6:27 Unconditional love enemies and call them enemies and even blame enemies at the same time

All the verses in the link apply to whosever believes not all people.

God's love is very conditional.

 

[AppieB]

This wasn't my statement to which you answered... I'ts ok, I've done that before.

Ah yes, I'm sorry.
I corrected it.

It is interesting that what convinces one person doesn't convince another, isn't it?

I have three children. I can say something to them and get three different responses. Is it really the messengers fault? or is it the hearers fault?

Maybe no ones fault. But if that means you would go to hell (like the OP suggested) I would consider that immoral.

That being said, when someone asked me to believe in God and the work of the Cross, I said "No". But it wasn't "NO" but rather "No, you haven't given me enough information to be convinced".

I had a lot of questions but I was interested in knowing the answers.

Yes, you are right, it can't be by "force or coercion". And certainly i don't know what classifies as "sufficient reason" for you. For that matter, as Jesus would say, "Come to me if your are thirsty". Two points being 1) One really has to be thirsty - there are those who are not and 2) You have to come. Some people really are thirsty buy have no interest in coming and they fill their thirst with other things.

Did you have a question?

Yes, I'm "thirsty". Not necessarily to know and love God, but first of all to know if God is real. After that, we"ll see.

No further questions, your Honor.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

That makes no sense whatsoever.
Almighty God allows suffering in this life, doesn't he?

Not an unconditional god, no. He wouldn't "allow" it but cure it-for ALL people not just to those who believe.

Does a parent allow their child to put their hand over fire for him to get burned and learn a lesson?

I know some parents do that but then they won't let their child get hit by a car to learn not to cross the street.

It's very conditional.

Why is that a bad thing, though?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

@1213 Another is the bible says jesus told believers to love their enemies. Unconditional love doesn't see people they love as enemies. If unconditional love said love all people because you have no enemies (nonbelievers, pharacies, etc) then yes, that's unconditional. However, the god of the bible just doesn't promote that. It has killed many people because of their sin while a human parent ideally loves their child regardless if that child loves them or leaves them or not.

I can continue, but god's love has conditions. Believers took up those conditions thereby experience god's love for them. People who once new god (so no atheist) and left shouldn't be guilt-tripped and told they created their own downfall. Unconditional love lifts people up from that whether they choose it or not.

I actually don't know any person who sees love as unconditional once they have criteria to tell them who to love and who not.

 

[muhammad_isa]

Why is that a bad thing, though?

I'm not saying that it is..
How can God's love save us from doom if we turn away from Him?
Logically, it is our own doing.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I'm not saying that it is..
How can God's love save us from doom if we turn away from Him?
Logically, it is our own doing.

The general consensus is that nonbelievers turned away from him and its their fault. Everything in the bible applies to those who take up their god's conditions. There's a verse somewhere that says god "never knew" people who decide not to follow him. Unconditional love doesn't do that. It lets "everyone" in.

 

[muhammad_isa]

Unconditional love doesn't do that. It lets "everyone" in.

Yes, but it's a contradiction, isn't it?

Given: we have been given free-will to choose our own path in life.

Some people will be believers, and some will turn away from belief, for whatever reason.
As Almighty God is the "Fairest of All Judges", it follows that
God will not turn away from anybody, WITHOUT GOOD REASON.
i.e. He accepts both atheist and theist 's sincere repentance

The problem for us, is that if we go "too far", it becomes extremely difficult to change.

God's love is unconditional, BUT if we die in a state of disbelief,
we fail the chance to be righteous.

Would YOU trust somebody who knowingly turns their back on truth? No?
Nor does Almighty God..

..bearing in mind, that God is not a "person". He is unique, absolute, and is neither male or female, and non-physical.

Physical beings are God's creatures.
God is more of an obscure concept, rather than of this world.

 

[Trailblazer]

So that means God's love is conditional. Why would his "wrath and anger" be a proper response to a person who honestly seeked the truth, but didn't became convinced God existed?

I do not believe that is God's response. The all-knowing God knows who honestly searched for the truth and why they did not find it. If they sincerely sought the truth and did not find it the proper response is compassion and mercy.

Wouldn't that be the proper response to everyone, theist or atheist?

I believe that is God's response, unconditional love.

"How ignorant therefore the thought that God who created man, educated and nurtured him, surrounded him with all blessings, made the sun and all phenomenal existence for his benefit, bestowed upon him tenderness and kindness, and then did not love him. This is palpable ignorance, for no matter to what religion a man belongs even though he be an atheist or materialist nevertheless God nurtures him, bestows His kindness and sheds upon him His light."
('Abdu'l-Baha, Star of the West, Vol. 8, issue 7, p. 78).

If God could provide sufficient reason to believe, why is it the atheists fault for not believing?

I believe that God provided sufficient evidence thus a reason to believe but not everyone recognizes the evidence and ends up believing in God. I do not believe that is anyone's fault, but I don't speak for God. Only God knows what is in anyone's mind and heart.