Hamas must be eradicated

[Revoltingest]

Agreed. Haters gonna hate.
In this case though, it befalls on Israel to stop giving them reasons to hate.

Not that I support Hamas off course.

Personally, I'm of the opinion that in this conflict, there are no "good" guys.
It's like a white racist fighting against a black racist.
Both are racists. Both are bad.

I see good guys & bad guys who
might some day become good guys.
USA should influence this outcome.
Instead, it gives Israel approval &
resources to violate human rights.
USA must change for the better.
But we've mostly religious bigots
running the show.

 

[Mock Turtle]

Do you see any actions by Israel that inspired
the historical & current violence?
Or is the path to peace solely the responsibility
of Palestinians?

If you think that Hamas had an inevitability over the Oct 7th attack from past Israeli actions then you are just continuing the merry-go-round. Both sides need to step down, and unfortunately neither will do so - one from hatred and one from mistrust most likely.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

I doubt that they have such power.

They do.

End the apartheid system. Stop building illegal settlements. Stop driving palestinians out of their homes. Stop holding water, energy, food, meds,... "ransom".

In short: stop treating them as second class citizens.
It's relatively easy.

 

[Revoltingest]

If you think that Hamas had an inevitability over the Oct 7th attack from past Israeli actions then you are just continuing the merry-go-round.

To end the cycle requires understanding
why the violence recurs. Tis the opposite
of continuing it.

What do you believe Hamas's
attack arose from?

Both sides need to step down, and unfortunately neither will do so - one from hatred and one from mistrust most likely.

Who should act first....
Hamas ending its war with Israel?
Or Israel ending the oppression of Palestinians?

 

[Mock Turtle]

To end the cycle requires understanding
why the violence recurs. Tis the opposite
of continuing it.

What do you believe Hamas's
attack arose from?

Who knows. To gain public sympathy for their cause perhaps. If so then they gambled a terrible price for the civilian population over any gains that might have come from this. What else were they hoping to achieve?

Who should act first....
Hamas ending its war with Israel?
Or Israel ending the oppression of Palestinians?

Perhaps both at the same time, but the hatred coming from the Palestinians doesn't seem to make this likely.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Perhaps both at the same time, but the hatred coming from the Palestinians doesn't seem to make this likely.

Therein lies the question. What do you believe the cause of Palestinian animosity may be?

 

[Mock Turtle]

They do.

End the apartheid system. Stop building illegal settlements. Stop driving palestinians out of their homes. Stop holding water, energy, food, meds,... "ransom".

In short: stop treating them as second class citizens.
It's relatively easy.

Really? And all the while Hamas and such are building up their capability to do what they did on Oct 7th - so, lack of trust.

 

[Mock Turtle]

Therein lies the question. What do you believe the cause of Palestinian animosity may be?

A long history from some bad decisions no doubt - such that separation became the norm rather than integration.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

A long history from some bad decisions no doubt - such that separation became the norm rather than integration.

Bad decisions by whom? How do you believe you could reduce the animosity?

 

[Mock Turtle]

Bad decisions by whom? How do you believe you could reduce the animosity?

No idea.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Really? And all the while Hamas and such are building up their capability to do what they did on Oct 7th - so, lack of trust.

So, therefore, it's not worth the effort to treat Palestinians better, because Hamas will just carry out another attack?

Since when has "It won't stop terrorists from carrying out another attack" ever been a sufficient argument to support continuing the oppression and alienation of an entire group of people?

 

[Revoltingest]

Who knows. To gain public sympathy for their cause perhaps. If so then they gambled a terrible price for the civilian population over any gains that might have come from this. What else were they hoping to achieve?

Do you believe that 70 years of apartheid,
oppression, death, & theft at the hands of
Israel aren't Hamas's motive.

Perhaps both at the same time, but the hatred coming from the Palestinians doesn't seem to make this likely.

What of the hatred coming from Israel?
Or do you believe the hatred & violence a
re one sided, ie, only from Palestinians?

 

[ImmortalFlame]

No idea.

No idea whatsoever?

You don't think it might, at the very least, be related to their continuing persecution, the annexing of their lands, the destruction of their villages, the eradication of their culture and the displacement of their people?

You don't think that maybe, just maybe, trying to stop doing those things (something that is explicitly a requirement of international law) MIGHT leave at least a little more room open for the animosity to reduce?

 

[Mock Turtle]

Do you believe that 70 years of apartheid,
oppression, death, & theft at the hands of
Israel aren't Hamas's motive.

Not all one-sided though.

What of the hatred coming from Israel?
Or do you believe the hatred & violence a
re one sided, ie, only from Palestinians?

How would I know what goes on in their heads?

 

[Mock Turtle]

So, therefore, it's not worth the effort to treat Palestinians better, because Hamas will just carry out another attack?

Since when has "It won't stop terrorists from carrying out another attack" ever been a sufficient argument to support continuing the oppression and alienation of an entire group of people?

You are still seemingly letting one side off as to being complicit in the antagonisation between the two sides. Why is this? Are you equating Israel as being much like the USA when it was oppressing black slaves?

 

[Revoltingest]

Not all one-sided though.

What does that mean in response to my question?

How would I know what goes on in their heads?

You claim to know what goes on in Hamas heads.
Why is Israel exempt from your keen insight?

 

[ImmortalFlame]

You are still seemingly letting one side off as to being complicit in the antagonisation between the two sides.

No, I'm not. You are making the argument that, because Hamas engages in antagonism, that justifies the CONTINUING antagonism of Israel.

Neither is justified.

Why is this? Are you equating Israel as being much like the USA when it was oppressing black slaves?

I'm not sure such a comparison is even remotely appropriate here. My argument was fairly simple.

 

[Revoltingest]

Are you equating Israel as being much like the USA when it was oppressing black slaves?

That's a good analogy.
Slave owners told themselves stories to justify
slavery & brutal treatment of slaves.
- They aren't as good as we are.
- You can't reason with those people.
- They hate us for no good reason.
- They're violent, & must be controlled.
- They're not <insert religion>.
- Scripture justifies what we do.
- Our critics are deluded & dishonest.

 

[Mock Turtle]

What does that mean in response to my question?

Well, because the Palestinians haven't been innocent during all this time.

You claim to know what goes on in Hamas heads.
Why is Israel exempt from your keen insight?

Hamas seem intent on the destruction of Israel from the various interviews with their leaders I've come across. I've not heard the reverse as towards any Palestinians, apart from the odd nutter threatening to nuke Gaza.

 

[Revoltingest]

Well, because the Palestinians haven't been innocent during all this time.

Does this mean they deserve how Israel treats them?

Hamas seem intent on the destruction of Israel from the various interviews with their leaders I've come across. I've not heard the reverse as towards any Palestinians, apart from the odd nutter threatening to nuke Gaza.

A country run by authoritarian extremists, that
bombs civilians recklessly, that oppresses non-Jewish
citizens, that is rife with....

Death to Arabs - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

....is worse than Hamas because it has the color
of authority, the backing of the western world,
& kills far more people while proclaiming to
be the innocent victim.