How are these Great Beings explained?

[loverofhumanity]

There have been several questions I've asked that have gone unanswered. A couple come to mind. One was a question about why, in the official Baha'i' information, the fact that Baha'u'llah appointed his son as his spiritual successor, and then in turn, the grandson. From an outsider's POV, this is pretty relevant info, but it seems it's a forbidden topic. (I think there are several forbidden topics) Another is the 'equality of women' issue that somehow doesn't apply to the House of Justice. Adrian did try to explain it to me, but most certainly it was no outright admission of hypocrisy in the leadership. I know If I was there, I'd just put forth a woman's name at the next round of elections. Course I'd probably be labelled a detractor and booted.

So every time I encounter something like this, I think there are two faces ... the public side, and then the secret within the Baha'i' stuff.

The question about why they appointed successors is that the question or why they appointed their own bloodline?

This is not a forbidden question. There are no forbidden or secret questions we can't answer or speak about so I don't know how you arrived at that conclusion.

In His Will, Baha'u'llah appointed His eldest son as His Successor and Interpreter. He said Abdul-Baha knew everything He meant and was thus the one who was best able to succeed Him.

Then Abdul-Baha appointed Shoghi Efrendi in His Will to be the next Interpreter and Successor after He passed away. I assume He had prepared Shoghi Effendi with that in mind.

I don't know if you want more information but please let me know. It's not an issue for us as we trust fully both Baha'u'llah's and Abdul-Bahá'í judgement on these matters.

Again, there are are secret forbidden topics. As far as women not being on the House of Justice we don't know the reason, Abdul-Baha said it would become clear as the noonday sun in the future but until then we don't know why.

 

[loverofhumanity]

What has changed. Instead of Jesus, you now have Baha'u'llah?

A lot has changed. We are more interconnected now than at any time in our history. Because of technology we've all been thrown together. It's a totally new paradigm.

We live in an entirely differently shaped world. There is no comparison between life 2,000 years ago and now.

 

[loverofhumanity]

This does not make sense. So that means an individual Christian is controlled by his dogma and the religion's purpose is to keep followers from leaving as they (the religion?) are both wealth and power?

I highly feel your definition of religion is completely off. While many religious have their political wars, that does not reflect a person's faith nor does the teachings of their religion and your religion too keep them locked in their faith.

Remember, you have dogma too. You have practices and you have traditions. This is the bias I'm speaking of.

You can't make peace with this mindset.

If people weren't so conditioned and manipulated and searched the truth for themselves we would have found peace unity long ago.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

If people weren't so conditioned and manipulated and searched the truth for themselves we would have found peace unity long ago.

I'm talking of those who find peace in their dogma, traditions, and rituals (such as yourselves and many others with similar goals).

Religion does nothing. I feel your experiences are coloring the fact that people don't have to be in unity yet in order to be at peace in their rituals, dogma, and traditions.

If you can do it, why not give credit to others?

 

[loverofhumanity]

I'm talking of those who find peace in their dogma, traditions, and rituals (such as yourselves and many others with similar goals).

Religion does nothing. I feel your experiences are coloring the fact that people don't have to be in unity yet in order to be at peace in their rituals, dogma, and traditions.

If you can do it, why not give credit to others?

People have done so for thousands of years and we've had wars and conflicts all that time and still to this day.

I wish it were as easy as live and let live but it's just not working.

We need to try something else if our way is not working.

.

 

[Vinayaka]

The question about why they appointed successors is that the question or why they appointed their own bloodline?

This is not a forbidden question. There are no forbidden or secret questions we can't answer or speak about so I don't know how you arrived at that conclusion.

I

My question was: Why, in most of the Baha'i' literature I have encountered, (To be fair, I haven't read all that much) there is no mention of the bloodline? That was my question. I realise it's not totally avoided, but still, it seems to be only with questioning that it was let out. So in stead of saying Baha'u'llah appointed his son, Abdul-Baha. as his successor, they say 'Baha'u'llah appointed Abdul-Baha as his successor, not mentioning any blood relation.

So in royal lineages this is the way it is done. I'm familiar with that. But in Hinduism, in Buddhism, in Catholicsm, in politics, successors are appointed in different ways. So I was just wondering if they (I mean the Baha'i' authorities) are actually attempting to limit this important fact, and history.

Do you understand my question now?

 

[Vinayaka]

A lot has changed. We are more interconnected now than at any time in our history. Because of technology we've all been thrown together. It's a totally new paradigm.

We live in an entirely differently shaped world. There is no comparison between life 2,000 years ago and now.

It's also changed a lot in the last 200 years, in case you haven't noticed. The rate of change is accelerating, so a good argument could be made that this planet has changed more in the last 200 than in the previous 2000. Just as you make the argument that Jesus is no loner relevant, anyone can make the argument that Baha'u'llah is no longer relevant.

 

[Vinayaka]

If people weren't so conditioned and manipulated and searched the truth for themselves .

Who exactly ate 'these people'? All non-Baha'i'?

I personally think Baha'i's are incredibly conditioned and manipulated to think a certain way.

 

[Vinayaka]

People have done so for thousands of years and we've had wars and conflicts all that time and still to this day.

.

Which people? Again with the massive generalisations. You mean Muslims and Christians?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

People have done so for thousands of years and we've had wars and conflicts all that time and still to this day.

I wish it were as easy as live and let live but it's just not working.

We need to try something else if our way is not working.

.

You dont give us credit without basing our spirituality off the wars of the people?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Who exactly ate 'these people'? All non-Baha'i'?

I personally think Baha'i's are incredibly conditioned and manipulated to think a certain way.

They Ate the people?

 

[loverofhumanity]

My question was: Why, in most of the Baha'i' literature I have encountered, (To be fair, I haven't read all that much) there is no mention of the bloodline? That was my question. I realise it's not totally avoided, but still, it seems to be only with questioning that it was let out. So in stead of saying Baha'u'llah appointed his son, Abdul-Baha. as his successor, they say 'Baha'u'llah appointed Abdul-Baha as his successor, not mentioning any blood relation.

So in royal lineages this is the way it is done. I'm familiar with that. But in Hinduism, in Buddhism, in Catholicsm, in politics, successors are appointed in different ways. So I was just wondering if they (I mean the Baha'i' authorities) are actually attempting to limit this important fact, and history.

Do you understand my question now?

I sent you this link when you asked the question before.

Bahá’u’lláh and His Covenant | What Bahá’ís Believe

It mentions the bloodline on this page. Here is a quote.

In His will, Bahá’u’lláh appointed His oldest son, ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, as the authorized interpreter of His teachings and Head of the Faith.

Here is another quote

Appointed Guardian of the Bahá’í Faith by ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, His eldest grandson, Shoghi Effendi, ......

The bloodline is there on that link mentioned openly.

 

[loverofhumanity]

They Ate the people?

On the contrary, we are people who have made a significant discovery.

We don't have clergy or priests so our beliefs are based upon our own independent investigation.

Many are taught that other religions are false and only their religion is true so they never investigate further. We are told there is truth in all Faiths, not just our own,

 

[loverofhumanity]

You dont give us credit without basing our spirituality off the wars of the people?

It's just not enough. There are terrible cruelties going on as I type. They need to be fixed. Apparently we haven't found a solution with billions of 'religious' people on earth.

Something is definitely not right. If we have all that much spirituality on earth why have we descended into materialism and wars?

Credit must be given on deeds & performance not belief alone. Belief alone is not fixing the words problems. We need a new system. Belief is not our Saviour.

 

[Vinayaka]

I sent you this link when you asked the question before.

Bahá’u’lláh and His Covenant | What Bahá’ís Believe

It mentions the bloodline on this page. Here is a quote.

In His will, Bahá’u’lláh appointed His oldest son, ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, as the authorized interpreter of His teachings and Head of the Faith.

Here is another quote

Appointed Guardian of the Bahá’í Faith by ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, His eldest grandson, Shoghi Effendi, ......

The bloodline is there on that link mentioned openly.

Like I said, it is mentioned ..... sometimes, but not generally. So you managed to avoid the question ... Why is it GENERALLY avoided.

 

[Vinayaka]

On the contrary, we are people who have made a significant discovery.

Many are taught that other religions are false and only their religion is true so they never investigate further. We are told there is truth in all Faiths, not just our own,

So have many other people. My religion has never taught that it is the only one that is true. Again, you are speaking of Christianity and Islam, and then extending that to all other religions, Again, that just isn't fair.

 

[crowfeather]

How do we explain these Great Beings: Buddha, Moses, Krishna, Christ, Zoroaster, Muhammad, the Bab & Bahaullah? They are somewhat unique and unparalleled in human history and were clearly not ordinary people.

There are famous people in history, famous artists, musicians and scientists but none can compare to the influence of the Educator, Teacher, Messiah or Prophet.

But Who were they? And why were they and still are so influential throughout history? Why did they inspire civilizations? Why have their scriptures become patterns of life followed daily by billions of people for thousands of years?

What gift did they possess to be able to be persecuted, oppressed, tortured, exiled and crucified by the most despotic and powerful leaders of their age with but a handful of followers and yet eventually triumph over adversity and establish Their Cause all over the world?

Statues, Churches, Temples, Pagodas, Mosques and Synagogues are built all over the world to pay tribute to these Great Souls.

Are they from another world? Did they pre exist? Without a special power how could they have accomplished what they did and who is their equal in influence?

And aren't we in dire need of another Great Spiritual Teacher to revive us spiritually?

All these characters started out as ordinary people. Then they discovered things others never do.
This should encourage the drones: any one of them could do the same.
Yes, a great spiritual leader is what the world needs, but unfortunately, even though these beings currently exist, nobody recognizes them.
Instead they are known as egotistical fake losers. The modern equivalent of crucifixion.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Which people? Again with the massive generalisations. You mean Muslims and Christians?

If you consult history you will find every religion has been involved in wars. They are not confined to just Christian and Muslim but Hindu, Buddhist and Jewish as well.

In Rakhine State in Burma, there are atrocities being committed by Buddhists against the Rohinga minority.

No one can claim that their religion is free from violence because the history books and encyclopedias can easily prove it otherwise.

My 'generalization' was for the sake of 'brevity'.

To change things I believe we need to recognize that we need to do something different than what we've been doing for thousands of years - namely, to rid ourselves of this us vs them mentality which is unfortunately promoted intensively by religions today.

If we all saw the truth in every religion and accepted each other religion what harm could come from that? A world war perhaps? Genocide? Civil wars? To see all religions as part of our own is that going to destroy the world or bring on a nuclear holocaust?

This is where Baha'u'llah seeks reconciliation over confrontation, consultation over competition. But humanity's stubbornness clings to ways that have been proven to be disastrous.

As Abdul-Baha said. We can give compromise and peace a try and if we don't like it we can always go back to war.

But we believe this is the age of acceptance, of embracing all truth not just our own.

 

[loverofhumanity]

So have many other people. My religion has never taught that it is the only one that is true. Again, you are speaking of Christianity and Islam, and then extending that to all other religions, Again, that just isn't fair.

Do you teach that other religions are true and we should accept them?

Same thing. The fact people are not taught to accept any other truth or religion by Procyon are being told only theirs is the right path.

This is where we differ. We are taught to accept all religions.

Buddhists are the same in Burma. If you are a Buddhist you get treated fairly. If you are a Bahá'í you are not. There is widespread discrimination by Buddhists nationwide against all minority Faiths in Burma.

None of the major religions teaches their followers to accept all the other religions.

 

[loverofhumanity]

All these characters started out as ordinary people. Then they discovered things others never do.
This should encourage the drones: any one of them could do the same.
Yes, a great spiritual leader is what the world needs, but unfortunately, even though these beings currently exist, nobody recognizes them.
Instead they are known as egotistical fake losers. The modern equivalent of crucifixion.

You have a solution then?