Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
Thank you. I haven't painted a full canvas painting before. I might take classes but now I'm getting my fingers wet first.
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How are these Great Beings explained?
- Thread starter loverofhumanity
- Start date
Thank you. I haven't painted a full canvas painting before. I might take classes but now I'm getting my fingers wet first.
Hmm. I have to ask youDo you understand the difference between sharing your faith and proselytising (more accurately, evangelism)?
To be honest, I never or rarely think about it. We kind of live in the moment, and whatever happens happens. I have shared stuff, or made comparisons to illustrate a point, the philosophy side for sure. But the inner experiences, nah. That's between you and your Guru. I do find it another difference in paradigms. Some westerners have gotten upset with me about it, lol. My thoughts can go to, ... Hmmmm, who should I listen to here, some stranger off the internet, or my Guru?" The difference in paradigms is food for humour.
Fair enough.
Yes, it's on the decrease in some places. The information hasn't spread too far though, so some places emulate the west of 30 years ago. They'll catch up.
We finally have an agreement. Awesome!
My Guru often specifically said. "Don't lean on me. Lean on your own spine!" This sort of sums up the difference in paradigms regarding prophets. Yes, we mystic Hindus have a basic understanding of philosophy, but at the core is the belief, "All knowledge is within you." and in meditation, bhakti, devotion, saucha, we try to tap into that.
Another paradigm difference is language. In Catholicism and in Hinduism we have liturgical ritualistic languages, namely Latin, and Sanskrit. So language itself can be taken out of philosophy into metaphysical realms in the mystical paradigms.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
This is just my experience, but out of all westerners, Catholics and others in liturgical religions understand what you mean. Twice a year, the Legion of Mary (Catholic Organization) comes to say hello, give me a rosary or two, and ask me how I am. I've never heard, on a personal rather than t.v. level, a Catholic push his or her beliefs on me.
I also feel westernism has gotten a bad image. A lot of us religious don't want to know your relationship with you and your guru but maybe curious of the general things a guru may talk to you about. With me, it's about experiences so I probably won't get much. It does vary, though especially the intent. I wouldn't put us all in a boat, though.
We do have some equitique we are just people that "need to understand" before we know what not to ask. However, if we don't know, how could we be faulted for asking questions most others would assume as personal?
That's why I general talk about confession. I've had a few people ask me what I talked about in confession, and I'll give them a gist as in "a lot of people come to confession with they have different problems that come to mind... maybe with their marriage, their family, or something they want to talk to god about but also need a listening ear."
To tell you honestly, the only westerners, if one likes, that don't "get it" are protestants if talking about religion. Everyone else gets it. Even Muslims I talk with sometimes. We just get it.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
Had I been drawn to Christianity at all, it would have been Catholicism, or Eastern Orthodox ... anything with a ritualistic tendency, and a monastic tradition.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
I think we got a lot of information from Bahai. Can't remember all my questions, though. They were in set and repeated often.
I honestly can't learn about you through Bahaullah. That is like asking an atheist to learn about you by asking god first.
Kinda understand?
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
Yeah. I went to a Christian chat room one time during my transition from Catholicism to Buddhism. One heavy evangelistic christian said to me, "no wonder you went to Buddhism..." and I asked him why, "because they have the same pagan rituals as Catholicism." I can see why he said that. We don't have many Buddhist monasteries here. I don't know if Buddhists have guru to go to. Western perception of Buddhism takes the mysticism out of it. But Mahayana has a lot of mysticism that I assume theravada doesn't have.
I know very little about Buddhism other than they are my dharmic brothers and sisters.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
From what I read in the Hindu DIR, they are very different in how they see philosophy especially the focus on the mystic things and god. I like Hinduism because I'm used to the saints. There are a lot of temples near me not believing in deities is a huge issue. The Dharma is basically about wisdom and understanding. They don't go together from The Buddha's point of view. However, both religions are beautiful.
I was drawn to the tolerance, and Shiva. Past life samskaras (memories). When it makes sense to an individual, there isn't much else to say, regardless of which faith it is. I only get into debate when there is a sense of 'I'm right and you're wrong' rather than true tolerance, or when my own faith is misinterpreted. People have the right to hear diverse opinions and views.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
I don't understand. You don't get into a debate when someone displays true tolerance?
For me, getting into a debate is based on understanding. For example, one JW here I'll never forget and I were talking, of course, about the Catholic Church. He said it was pagan. I said it was not. Then as he was listing all the pagan things in Catholicism, I told him that what these practices were used for in Roman paganism is not used in that intent in Christianity.
Then he says, "why would any christian want anything pagan in their practice regardless the intent." I guess he is right to that extent though I had to remind him he was beating a dead horse.
But once I got that understanding, I didn't need to debate or challenging his logic anymore. But with Bahai, I can't get around the prophet-belief idea. I'm all for individual expression so when one talks through someone else it's.. can't think of the word.
Anyway, all I can do is really shrug.
Simple clear answers to the following questions.
What do the Baha'is believe regarding
1)Afterlife. Is there a bodily resurrection or the souls go to heaven or hell. Is there a hell. Is it eternal. If not does everybody goes to heaven.
2) what is the fate of animals after death.
3) Actions matter more or faith. Does a good atheist go to heaven. Does a bad Bahai go to hell (if there is one). What is the relationship between faith and afterlife.
4)How was the universe created. When. How will it end. When. Will there be others before or after. Or is it a one shot thing.
5)Do the Bahai believe in evolution. How about human evolution. How did God create the universe and the life forms in it.
6) Do miracles occur. How are they defined.
7)Why do natural evils (disease etc.) exist. Why do human evil exist. Do humans have free will. Does God foreknow all that will happen. Did he also foreordain all that will happen.
8)Does God act in the world. How.
Thanks.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
@loverofhumanity
If you cannot say my belief is false politely, but then can disagree with it, isnt that the same as telling me what you believe is true without bluntly saying you dont believe anything opposed to it?
If you believe all religions have the same foundation, what is there to disagree with? And if you disagree, why do you disagree if you do not believe it is false?
If you cannot say my belief is false politely, but then can disagree with it, isnt that the same as telling me what you believe is true without bluntly saying you dont believe anything opposed to it?
If you believe all religions have the same foundation, what is there to disagree with? And if you disagree, why do you disagree if you do not believe it is false?
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What I meant was that we leave each other alone regarding religion. I'm fine with what they do, and they're fine with what I do. So there is no need to discuss either, because we're both tolerant. It's different with people who aren't tolerant because they have a psychological need to convince you their way is right, and by inference, yours is wrong. This is why I don't find the Baha'i' faith to be all that tolerant at all, despite claims to the opposite.
So many questions
A book worth of answers. There is a book called the Hidden Words by Baha'u'llah that is short meditations that contains the Essence of all the Holy Books/Writings of the Past. Bahá'í Reference Library - The Hidden Words of Bahá’u’lláhThe main theme in your questions is that of Creation and of the Souls Progresses after death and that of Heaven and hell. There is over 100 Volumes of Writings from Baha'u'llah that give answers to these topics, to condense too far is to not offer accuracy. I offer the following explanations.
1) When every Human passes from this world, they pass into the Spiritual Worlds of God in a condition they have obtained to while upon this earth. Heaven is nearness to God and Hell is remoteness from God.
2) All kindness must be shown to all animals upon this earth, as to the progress of the animal soul after death I have not read upon this subject to date.
3) Words without Deeds are Hollow and empty. Words must be backed by actions and service to all humanity. We are all to be judged according to the efforts we have made to find the source of Truth and how true we have been to that search by our actions we offer to all other peoples.
4) Our God is the creator, it endures as long as God endures. This creation that we are finding out about, is but one Lamp of 100,000,000 Lamps - This provisional translation of the Tablet of the Universe may interest you - Tablet of the Universe
5) All of Creation is ever Advancing, ever Evolving. Man has evolved and will continue to evolve as a distinct species. He was and will always be man in the process of evolution, there is no mutation of species.
6) Miracles do occur, they are defined by those that receive them. A Baha'i places no greater importance upon them and does not use them to Prove or confirm Faith to others.
7) Evil really does not exist. Evil is only the absence of Good. Nature has a balance that when tipped rights itself by natural Laws, Man is part of this system and has added many artificial changes into this balance, nature is now well out of balance. With mankind and his God given Free Will choices, all goodness is the choice to Live by the Virtues, Laws and Will of God. The levels of Evil are how much we choose not to follow God, His Virtues and His Laws. This world is one of Crisis and Victory of Love and Pain, it is what this life offers to understand what is Love.
8) God acts in every moment of our lives. His Covenant is that He will never leave us without guidance and will never leave us alone. But we must also consider God says; "O SON OF BEING! Love Me, that I may love thee. If thou lovest Me not, My love can in no wise reach thee. Know this, O servant (Hidden Word).
Of course there is years of discussion in each question you have raised. May you be well and may you be always happy - Regards Tony
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
Makes sense. On that note, I had to go out to get something to eat, right. I bring my cane and just before leaving the building, the lady who introduced me to The Church said she joined as a Novice of the Benedictine Order. I love the Church but I don't evangelize. So I talk with her and she gives me her book and says "read it. You may want to join an order [her voice softens] Well. When you come back to the Church. You know you love god, don't you?" and she gets off the elevator to her apartment.
There are a few advantages of evangelism if two people are interested in hearing each other out. It could be a personality thing but one would have to pin me to the floor if I can't express myself.
But I completely understand what you mean. In The Church when we go to the bigger Parish, there are many saint statues. Catholics go to the Saints they are called to and we don't talk to them or ask them anything. It's a solace atmosphere. Similar to when I went to the Hindu temple except they were very happy to see me that they gave me so much fruits
. I don't know if Bahai will understand that, really.