How can a Jew reject Jesus as the Messiah?

[Skywalker]

There is no choice about accepting. People are either convinced or not convinced. No choice involved.

And really, why should we choose something that is blatantly false?

People's beliefs are influenced by what is convenient or not for them. Believing that God is our Savior puts a desire to strive to do better and not be our own God.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

People's beliefs are influenced by what is convenient or not for them.

That's nonsense. For example, there is nothing convenient about my belief that God has given my people 613 laws that he expects us to obey.

 

[Skywalker]

That's nonsense. For example, there is nothing convenient about my belief that God has given my people 613 laws that he expects us to obey.

I'm not saying being Jewish is something believe in out of convenience. I meant that people rejecting Jesus is something done out of convenience. It's not easy to accept that we are sinners who need a savior, like a kid who trips and falls and needs their parents to pick them up.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

I'm not saying being Jewish is something believe in out of convenience. I meant that people rejecting Jesus is something done out of convenience. It's not easy to accept that we are sinners who need a savior, like a kid who trips and falls and needs their parents to pick them up.

I don't think people reject Jesus out of convenience. It's actually more convenient to believe in a faith where salvation is based on intellectual assent rather than the effort of a good moral life.

 

[Skywalker]

I don't think people reject Jesus out of convenience. It's actually more convenient to believe in a faith where salvation is based on intellectual assent rather than the effort of a good moral life.

Salvation by works is not mentioned in the Bible. It's a teaching of certain denominations, who are just human beings who make mistakes like everyone else.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Salvation by works is not mentioned in the Bible. It's a teaching of certain denominations, who are just human beings who make mistakes like everyone else.

The teaching of the primary importance of obedience, from the Torah to the last pages of the tanakh, is consistant.

"When all is said and done, this one thing remains: fear God and keep his commandments, for this is the whole of man." Ecclesiastes 12:13

 

[Skywalker]

The teaching of the primary importance of obedience, from the Torah to the last pages of the tanakh, is consistant.

"When all is said and done, this one thing remains: fear God and keep his commandments, for this is the whole of man." Ecclesiastes 12:13

I'm not saying that people believe in the Torah out of convenience. I believe that people reject Christ out of convenience and come up with replacements for him like Santa Claus.

 

[Skywalker]

The teaching of the primary importance of obedience, from the Torah to the last pages of the tanakh, is consistant.

"When all is said and done, this one thing remains: fear God and keep his commandments, for this is the whole of man." Ecclesiastes 12:13

The Tanakh also mentions the Messiah being a Savior. Isaiah 52:13-53:12 | Messianic Bible

Isaiah 52:13 See, my servant will act wisely; he will be raised and lifted up and highly exalted. 14 Just as there were many who were appalled at him- his appearance was so disfigured beyond that of any man and his form marred beyond human likeness- 15 so will he sprinkle many nations, and kings will shut their mouths because of him. For what they were not told, they will see, and what they have not heard, they will understand. Isaiah 53 1 Who has believed our message and to whom has the arm of the LORD been revealed? 2 He grew up before him like a tender shoot, and like a root out of dry ground. He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him, nothing in his appearance that we should desire him. 3 He was despised and rejected by men, a man of sorrows, and familiar with suffering. Like one from whom men hide their faces he was despised, and we esteemed him not. 4 Surely he took up our infirmities and carried our sorrows, yet we considered him stricken by God, smitten by him, and afflicted. 5 But he was pierced for our transgressions, he was crushed for our iniquities; the punishment that brought us peace was upon him, and by his wounds we are healed. 6 We all, like sheep, have gone astray, each of us has turned to his own way; and the LORD has laid on him the iniquity of us all. 7 He was oppressed and afflicted, yet he did not open his mouth; he was led like a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is silent, so he did not open his mouth. 8 By oppression and judgment he was taken away. And who can speak of his descendants? For he was cut off from the land of the living; for the transgression of my people he was stricken. 9 He was assigned a grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death, though he had done no violence, nor was any deceit in his mouth. 10 Yet it was the LORD’s will to crush him and cause him to suffer, and though the LORD makes his life a guilt offering, he will see his offspring and prolong his days, and the will of the LORD will prosper in his hand. 11 After the suffering of his soul, he will see the light of life and be satisfied; by his knowledge my righteous servant will justify many, and he will bear their iniquities. 12 Therefore I will give him a portion among the great, and he will divide the spoils with the strong, because he poured out his life unto death, and was numbered with the transgressors. For he bore the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

I'm not saying that people believe in the Torah out of convenience. I believe that people reject Christ out of convenience and come up with replacements for him like Santa Claus.

Santa Claus is not a deity. I don't know of a single person who worships Santa. Try again.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

The Tanakh also mentions the Messiah being a Savior. Isaiah 52:13-53:12 | Messianic Bible

Any time in Isaiah the metaphor of servant is used, it is speaking of Israel. You will find that Isaiah tells us that the servant is Israel several times.

 

[Skywalker]

Santa Claus is not a deity. I don't know of a single person who worships Santa. Try again.

Santa takes the focus of Christmas away from Jesus and to commercialism. It's easier to focus on a replacement for Jesus than on Jesus-that's why beleiving in Jesus isn't something people do out of convenience.

The Santa-fication of Jesus | Christ Chapel Bible Church

The first question we must ask is: What is the goal of celebrating Christmas? Is it having a great family day of celebration? Is it the giving of presents? Is it something more? When we read in Luke 2 we see a great paradigm to follow. Angelic hosts appeared to some petrified shepherds and gave them the message that a savior had been born. What was their response? “Let us go over to Bethlehem and see this thing that has happened, which the Lord has made known to us.” Hearing about Christmas, they wanted to go and see what God had done – they wanted to celebrate Jesus. This is the goal of Christmas. That our hearts would be stirred to experience the birth of the Savior. The shepherds also show us what it looks like to have experienced Him. When they returned home they were “glorifying and praising God for all that they had seen and heard.”

What did they celebrate? They celebrated the fact that God had intervened into the world and that the Savior was born. How did they celebrate? Did they exchange gifts? Have pumpkin pie? Watch The Polar Express? Hard to know, but to be sure they were singularly struck by the momentous truth that the Messiah had come. Oh, that our hearts would respond in that way this Christmas season.

 

[metis]

People don't go to hell because they are sinners they go to hell because they reject Christ.

Since you still have avoided answering my question, why should I continue this conversation? I want your opinion, thus not just parroting someone else's opinion.

 

[Skywalker]

Because he was chosen by God, thus "anointed".

Why do you think that only Jesus could be a messiah? What about those who lived before him? What about those who lived and still live in areas where he's basically unknown? Doesn't God care about them?

The rapture won't happen until everyone has heard the gospel.

 

[metis]

Eh, this is why Christianity is so objectionable. It doesn't damn people based on anything that makes sense.

That form of Christianity, and I do agree with you.

 

[metis]

I don't think people reject Jesus out of convenience. It's actually more convenient to believe in a faith where salvation is based on intellectual assent rather than the effort of a good moral life.

Exactly, which is why the fundamentalist's concept of having a p.c. belief grants one a trip to heaven, whereas the Gospel actually doesn't say that.

 

[metis]

The rapture won't happen until everyone has heard the gospel.

Again, why are you continuing to avoid my question?

 

[Skywalker]

Again, why are you continuing to avoid my question?

You asked about people not hearing of Jesus.

 

[metis]

Let me repeat: If having a p.c. belief about Jesus is mandatory for salvation, what about all the people who existed before Jesus was even born? What about those who came after Jesus but never heard of him? What about those who may have heard of him but with only limited information. IOW, what about probably 99+% of all the people in the world?

And what about the indigenous people of the Americas prior to the Europeans? Didn't God care about them? or indigenous Aussies? or eastern Asians? or Pacific Islanders?

 

[metis]

You asked about people not hearing of Jesus.

So, then answer the question. [see above post]

 

[Skywalker]

Let me repeat: If having a p.c. belief about Jesus is mandatory for salvation, what about all the people who existed before Jesus was even born? What about those who came after Jesus but never heard of him? What about those who may have heard of him but with only limited information. IOW, what about probably 99+% of all the people in the world?

And what about the indigenous people of the Americas prior to the Europeans? Didn't God care about them? or indigenous Aussies? or eastern Asians? or Pacific Islanders?

Romans 1:20.

"For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse,"

Because of God's marvelous creation, people will have no excuse on judgement day for why they didn't find out who it was that designed this grand universe.