how did man appear on earth

[Breathe]

One problem with your analogy though, S-word; a space shuttle is not a living being. It is inorganic, it does not produce children. It is not even sentient, not knowing its existence, for it is mineral (unless you believe EVERYTHING has a soul, in which case, good for you and I'm sorry if I came across as rude ).

 

[YmirGF]

We Muslims don't believe in Darwin's idea of human evolution.

Why, pray tell, should we give a rat's hindquarter's as to what the garden variety Muslim chooses to believe or not believe? It isn't like their collective thinking on this matter can be considered particularly insightful, now, can it?

Like everyone to respond this.

Why? Is there something truly meaningful written here that requires a response?

If this debate continues beyond this comment, we may perhaps be able to delve deeper into this apparent mystery, but for now, let us continue.

Although one might wonder why one would bother with such an uninformed approach that is attempting to mask itself as "delving deeper into this apparent mystery".

When the angels who were under me, heard this, they also refused to worship Adam, (

These were the spirits within the enclosure of who Eve was their compilation) And Michael saith, “Worship the image of God, (The Most High and Lord of Creatures) but if thou wilt not worship him, the Lord (Jah) God (El) will be wrath with thee.”

This almost sounds like one of those news reports on Faux News. Pray tell, why should we take this drivel seriously?

It is also written somewhere else in the Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament, that after Satan had been hurled down to the earth of the sixth cycle of universal activity and while Adam was still in Paradise, the ruling spirit in the enclosure that was Eve whose pregnant body today has become the entire body of mankind, then understood that God was about to bring in a new creation and so he entered into Eve who was still in paradise in the Garden of Eden and deceived her, but he was unable to touch Adam.

And amusing tale, suitable for those with rather a superficial capacity for "thought".

This world isn't screwed up but some that reside on it sure seem to be.

On this, I certainly agree, though not from the standpoint you likely intended.

 

[Jose Fly]

Here's a little factoid that your run-of-the-mill internet creationist is either unaware of, or conveniently ignores:

Evolution happens right before our eyes, all the time. Every population we've ever studied evolves; in fact, we've never seen a population not evolve. Every new trait, characteristic, and species we've ever seen arise has done so via evolutionary mechanisms.

So saying things like "evolution is a myth" and "evolution is the lowest of sciences" is akin to saying "erosion is a myth". You're simply denying observed reality.

 

[Valjean]

Good point, Jose.
Evolution isn't some abstract, theoretical hypothesis. It's real, it's observable, it's used. It's the driving force behind all biology.

 

[Draka]

BTW, it's not as if we were ape and then suddenly human and THEN started using tools. Apes and monkeys use rudimentary tools such as sticks and rocks for purposes as well you know. Take an ape that has a slightly larger and more intelligent brain and it figures out how to use a certain object for a certain purpose that greatly helps him. He breeds with others and this trait is passed on. The longer this goes on, the more larger brain apes there are to reproduce. They can figure out different things that the other smaller brained apes can't and therefore are able to do more. Erect shelter, hunt, use hides for warmth and so on and so forth. Being able to construct tools and weapons meant that being stronger and faster than others was not as important anymore and concentrating on smarter and better ways to survive became more important. All this GRADUALLY brought about the humans of today.

We are STILL evolving. Every generation gets taller, smarter on average. We no longer have use for some organs in our bodies that just a thousand or even a hundred or more so years ago were used. If we were created "as is" then why have organs that serve no purpose and why did they serve a purpose before? Why? Because of our brains. Due to our growing intelligence we have figured out how to process and treat and clean our food better so that things like our appendix are unneeded. We don't have to have 2 kidneys to survive.

Evolution is seen everywhere. It's quite obvious that evolution occurs on a small scale right in front of us. Just look at bacteria and head lice for goodness sake. The more medicine you throw at something the ones that, for some odd reason, are immune to it reproduce and create more that are immune. Thus slowly working on a whole other "breed". Now, if that can be seen and acknowledged then why is it so incredibly hard for some people to realize, that given millions and billions of years, that this very same action would produce very different species?

Honestly, to look at the evidence right in front of us, then to look at our fossil record, and NOT believe that evolution exists and is, most VERY likely, what brought us about, is to flush down the toilet that very thing that evolution has done for us. Namely...our brains and our ability to think and reason logically.

 

[Luminous]

Science would have you believe that the universal body began as an invisible singularity that burst into light (the big bang HYPOTHESIS) and life and developed into a living breating body in which there developed a supreme intellect able to comprehend the invisible mind that is He(wa do for YOU being such a supreme intellect), but they say that there is no God( Agodists say there is no god, science says nothing about god, and scientists say we should wait and see). And yet they believe(believing is not something scientist are supposed to do, we are supposed to postulate) that their bodies which have taken, not one cycle of universal activity to come into being, but have evolved over many periods of universal activity in this eternal Cosmos with its eternal oscillating "living universal" cells that are forever disappearing and reappearing, changing from being to nonbeing then back to being again, and yet they have the hide to call that body in which they, the supreme personality that has developed in that body, ME, I, Myself
.

The christian church in the main(the main is in the eye of the beholder), would have you believe that there is an invisible mind that was always all knowing and all wise , never having had to gain all that wisdom, knowledge and insight from experience, it simply always was. (scientists postulate that our reallity always was)


This can only be possible if that mind maintains its position in space time at the very beginning and all that it becomes descends and is gathered into that dimensionless point which is the beginning(you are suggesting that dimensions breed dimension so the first one had to be created), which would mean that the invisible singularity at the beginning, is the invisible and divine reality of the universe; from which all things originate and yet the end result of all that is at any given point in time, or the compilation of all things in all time. But, the greater majority of Christians still see God as separate from the universe that he creates, rather than seeing him as the divine animating principle that pervades all that is, which eternal Cosmos is in fact, only the physical representartion of the ever growing invisible mind of God, and mankind who is the reflection of the heights to which the mind that is God has attained, is not the end of the growth of that mind.

I longed to hear someone express the words I couldn't speak
Reveal to me the mysteries of life which all men seek
So I saught the men of science who claim God's body has no mind(postulate that the mind is part of the body and is just a body part)
O! They say the universe is living, but will die one day in time.(postulate, postulate, postulate)(each scientist has personal axioms)
So then the men of piousness?(hypocrites who do not even listen to themselves), with them I sat me down
But they say God has no body those men in flowing gowns.
Then finally in silent dream, Just me and 'Who I Am'
We floated on life's living stream with a pen held in my hand.
Twas then--that the veil began to tear in this temple that is me
And there, within God's sanctuary, I saw the one that I will be.(personal interpretation of GOD(its existance, meaning, and desires)

Who comprehends what?
None, but the philosophy is close to my quaking agnostism.

 

[Riverwolf]

ok i'm glad you made this point.

it is said that a ape like creature evolved into a homo sapien, right.

evolution states this " only the fittest creatures survive in nature, thus the weak dies" did you know that a human is the most vulnerable creature on the planet. a huma cannot run 125 km an hour like a cheetah, and if it was chased by a bear it could not outrunn it. then why did monkeys evolve into a voulnerable creature such as a human. when human evolved from monkeys they weren't born with weapons in their hads, thus they would have been killed and eaten by stronger and more powerfull animals in the animal kingdom, please explain this for me then, if my previous example wasn't enough for you.

They learned how to make tools, and it was Homo habilis that first learned how to control fire.

And it is theorized that our very own species, homo sapiens, was once on the brink of extinction.

Until a single tribe managed to get creative.

 

[Luminous]

its not that 'only the FITEST survive' thats Darwinism. Evolution is "species CAN and some have evolve" (which does not mean the original species cannot also exist at the same time as the mutant species)

 

[painted wolf]

I'm still looking for a useful definition of 'human' from creationists.

wa:do

 

[Riverwolf]

I'm still looking for a useful definition of 'human' from creationists.

wa:do

God's chosen race.
The ones chosen to have dominion over all things in nature.
The perfect race.


I thought that last one was the elves.

 

[Luminous]

God's chosen race.
The ones chosen to have dominion over all things in nature.
The perfect race.

i thought that was bacteria.

 

[Runewolf1973]

i thought that was bacteria.

Well....I can't say that's not true.

 

[Riverwolf]

i thought that was bacteria.

I'm just repeating what I've heard.

I'd certainly give whatever species of bacteria that's survived to this modern time from antiquity the title of Supreme Species.

 

[Runewolf1973]

Even plant life reigns over human life. It has been here from the beginnings of life as well. Without plants or trees, humans would not survive. We exist because they exist.

 

[S-word]

One problem with your analogy though, S-word; a space shuttle is not a living being. It is inorganic, it does not produce children. It is not even sentient, not knowing its existence, for it is mineral (unless you believe EVERYTHING has a soul, in which case, good for you and I'm sorry if I came across as rude ).

Which goes to show how much greater is the mind that is God as compared to the mind of man. If 'soul' is concidered as the animating principle which pervades all living beings, then yes, I believe that the one immortal soul that pervades the entire Cosmos, is inheritant in all, of course I beleive that all physical bodies must die,even the bodies in which, there develops the most righteous of all minds will burn, which is the first death, but I also believe that it is possible for the malformed and diseased Spirits=minds who have developed in the bodies of mankind to be wiped clean of the immortal soul as one wipes the pictures and words from a recorded tape, and this means the second death.

 

[painted wolf]

Many plants wouldn't exist without animals... life is a two way street.
Trees can't grow without help from fungi and bacteria.

wa:do

 

[Runewolf1973]

Many plants wouldn't exist without animals... life is a two way street.
Trees can't grow without help from fungi and bacteria.

wa:do

Yes. Absolutely! You are right. Bacteria are ultimately the dominant form of life on this earth and probably all of the Universe. Funny how humans tend to think they the supreme species and are the top of the food chain. Forms of bacteria even eat humans. Perhaps bacteria is more highly evolved than we are.

 

[S-word]

Even plant life reigns over human life. It has been here from the beginnings of life as well. Without plants or trees, humans would not survive. We exist because they exist.

Without the singularity that existed when Space and time were still united as one in the Great Abyss which is their nuptial chamber, there would be no visible Cosmos.

And Michael went out and called all the angels saying: “Worship the image of God as the Lord God hath commanded.” And Michael himself worshipped first; then he called me and said, “Worship the image of God the Lord.” And I answered, “I have no need to worship Adam.” And since Michael kept urging me to worship, I said to him, “Why dost thou urge me?” I will not worship an inferior being than me. I am his senior in the creation, before he was made I was already made. It is Adam’s duty to worship me.” so sayeth the spirit of the plants the reigning being (According to you) to who you bow as being superior to man the Most High in the creation and lord of creatures. When the brilliant new temple of God, which is the glorious new creation that comes from man, that is soon to appear on earth, I hope that you don't say to him, "I am your senior in the creation, before you were made I was already made and you must now bow before me as your Lord."

 

[Runewolf1973]

And Michael went out and called all the angels saying: “Worship the image of God as the Lord God hath commanded.” And Michael himself worshipped first; then he called me and said, “Worship the image of God the Lord.” And I answered, “I have no need to worship Adam.” And since Michael kept urging me to worship, I said to him, “Why dost thou urge me?” I will not worship an inferior being than me. I am his senior in the creation, before he was made I was already made. It is Adam’s duty to worship me.” so sayeth the spirit of the plants the reigning being (According to you) to who you bow as being superior to man the Most High in the creation and lord of creatures.

I don't think that any life is superior over another. Life is life. Some forms of it are just more prevalent than others, but that does not make them superior. I worship existence.

 

[S-word]

Many plants wouldn't exist without animals... life is a two way street.

Trees can't grow without help from fungi and bacteria.

wa:do

How right you are my dear friend 'painted wolf.' every living thing, in fact even the invisilbe powers and princapalities that cannot be conciderd as living, that are part and pacel of the invisible mind that is made manifest as the visible Cosmos, work in harmony for the good of the whole, that is of course except for the mind of man which is the spirit that is developing in the body of the most high in creation, gaining all the wisdom, knowledge and insight needed by the heir to the throne of Godhead by the lessons learnt from the sufferings of that body which sufferings are caused by the sins and mistakes that we make in our lives on earth.

But you do realise of course that the body in which you, who have developed as the Supreme personality of godhead to that body in which, the divine animating principle of the Cosmos is immanent, is so far beyond you capability to understand, that it is rediculous for A sinlge person to see themselves as superior to others and to divorce themselves from the multi celled body in which the heir to the throne of Godhead is developing. And the heir to the throne of the Most High in creation, is 'The Son of Man,' the multi celled body of light which will dwell on earth among mankind, of which glorious being, the man Jesus who is the first chosen of many brothers is the cornerstone and yet the head, as he grows in wisdom, knowledge and insight with the gathering to him of each of the spirits of mankind who are redeemed from that body before it is cast back into the refining fires of the new world.