How on earth can the Qur'an be considered the perfect book?

[gnostic]

If the king said , i'm the king
What the problem with it, God isn't a writer and (he) doesn't lick ice cream.
The problem that we portray God as if he's a human whereas he isn't.

He has give himself a whole bunch of epithets, not names.

That of course, if God is the real author, not Muhammad.

If Muhammad (if he was the author) was the one giving god all these epithets, then I wouldn't be debating this with you.

 

[Augustus]

Umayyad Caliphate, I assume?

Abbasid Golden Age.

Wealthy stable regime, new technology (paper), mixing of Greek, Egyptian and Persian scientific traditions, the translation movement, lots of funding for the sciences, etc.

Was a good period for Arabic philosophy and science, although not exclusively Islamic.

During this time the Islamic and Chinese Empires were the world leaders in these fields though.

 

[morphesium]

Believe what you want to believe, it doesn't make it a fact.

please; I asked for proof.

 

[FearGod]

It was in a peer reviewed academic journal so it is likely true that somebody has made a reasoned argument for this etymology. Seeing as this person was Muslim then I would imagine that he genuinely believes it to be correct and has reasons for believing this. It also logically its into the history. It's possible that it is incorrect though.

The point was more about the laws, than the lexicon anyway and there is historical evidence that some Islamic laws were continuations of Roman and Persian practice which is unsurprising as the Arabs had no experience of running an empire so it was easier to keep existing social structures in place after the conquests. Nothing much changed except for the leadership.

If the Arabs used laws of the Romans and Persians then it isn't too hard to imagine that they might have kept some of the words for these laws also. That's what most people do when there isn't a word in their own language for what they want to describe, they just borrow a foreign one.

The Muslims used to crucify the disbelievers, they fixed their hands on the cross by nails
and leaving them to die, the law was borrowed from the Romans.

Arabs used to borrow the laws and they used to buy the nails from the Romans to crucify the disbelievers,
the nails were used in a different way for the homosexuals.

 

[FearGod]

please; I asked for proof.

Look it yourself.

 

[Augustus]

The Muslims used to crucify the disbelievers, they fixed their hands on the cross by nails
and leaving them to die, the law was borrowed from the Romans.

Arabs used to borrow the laws and they used to buy the nails from the Romans to crucify the disbelievers,
the nails were used in a different way for the homosexuals.

The Romans actually abolished crucifixion under Constantine because it was used on Jesus.

 

[FearGod]

He has give himself a whole bunch of epithets, not names.

That of course, if God is the real author, not Muhammad.

If Muhammad (if he was the author) was the one giving god all these epithets, then I wouldn't be debating this with you.

Do you think it's bad if the doctor said, i'm the doctor?

 

[FearGod]

The Romans actually abolished crucifixion under Constantine because it was used on Jesus.

Awful punishment, they were monsters indeed.

 

[muhammad_isa]

Please tell me the contribution of islam to knowlege and science in the last 500 years.
Please don't run away from here or alter the topic.
What we are seeing in front of us is this - deeply islamic people destroying ancient monuments and historic evidence. Where is the trace of other (non-islamic) religious people (or culture) that once populated the present islamic countries???
For this reason - I don't believe in islamic achievements that predate 200 or 300 years. It is more likely they are projecting someone else's achievement as theirs.

History is often made by the the powerful to favor themselves even though the powerful is more barbaric and uncivilized than the culture it overthrows.

What you are saying is that 'the devil is winning' as far as your concerned. You see evil behaviour from many Muslims around the world and either you wish to portray this as Islam, or you believe it to be Islam.

I remain optimistic that the many multi-cultural societies around the world can be successful if we DEFEND OURSELVES against this useless rhetoric. It's only a call to nationalism in 'sheeps clothing' imo

 

[Useless2015]

When they reached Spain.

Make that south of France

 

[mahasn ebn sawresho]

See who liked your post.
Yes, we can use the nuclear bombs to save the world, actually that's the purpose of it,
i think Iran will help as well.

You should praise God because the atomic bombs was discovered by scientists in the world
And not the demons of the world
Because if the atomic bombs, however, the devil, it will destroy the Throne of God because he is the enemy of God

 

[mahasn ebn sawresho]

Quite a few 'Islamic' laws derived from preexisting Roman and Persian laws, including the jizya:

As a matter of fact, Jizya or poll tax had been in vogue since before the advent of Islam. The Greeks are reported to have imposed a similar tax upon the inhabitants of the coastal regions of Asia Minor during 500 B.C. The Romans imposed similar taxes upon the people they conquered, and the amount was much heavier than what was later imposed by the Muslims. The Persians are also reported to have introduced a similar tax upon their subjects.6 According to Shibli Nu'mani, theword Jizya itself is the Arabicised version of the word c*c^ (Kizyat), meaning a levy which the Persian rulers used to employ in administering the affairs of war. Shibli further indicates that this term was either in currency in both the languages, or the Arabs adapted it from the Persian language.

Whatever the case, it is certain that the Arabs first knew about this tax from the Persians. The Sasanid emperor Nawsherwan is reported to have introduced a tax, upon his subjects also termed as Jizya by the Arab historians, with the exemption of the nobility, satraps, military personnel, secretaries and those in the service of the emperor, at the varying rates of 12/8/6/2 dirhams upon each person.

But they did not say it from God
They said it is one of the laws of the Roman Emperor
But this did not lie on humanitarian
And also did not Evradwha to spread the religion of the Persian Empire and Romania

 

[mahasn ebn sawresho]

What you are saying is that 'the devil is winning' as far as your concerned. You see evil behaviour from many Muslims around the world and either you wish to portray this as Islam, or you believe it to be Islam.

I remain optimistic that the many multi-cultural societies around the world can be successful if we DEFEND OURSELVES against this useless rhetoric. It's only a call to nationalism in 'sheeps clothing' imo

Muslims in the world ticking time bombs that can explode at a moment when completed Terms explosion
And conditions of the bombs exploded in the world is
Concentration in one place with a numerical density
Then you will notice how explode
The last example is Bosnia in the old YugoslaviaIslam spread in that territory
By Ottoman Turks
And the concentration in that region
The explosion happened by demanding an Islamic state in Bosnia and separation
It was support from Saudi Arabia and all Muslims in the world
It can be Alsaanrio repeated in France, Britain and Germany
For the Muslims they had received very serious heavily

 

[mahasn ebn sawresho]

Muslims colleagues is trying to change the subject
In subjects Side From page 24 of this dialogue
And stay away from the topic
But I repeat the question
Where is the throne of God, O Muslims
You Ahbab God
You must know the place of his throne
If you say that the Kaaba is the house of God
And they say was his throne on the water
Why did not tell you in any water ????
Is it in the water on Mars, for example ???I hope that we stay on the subject and looking for a place the throne of God

 

[use_your_brain]

Muslims colleagues is trying to change the subject
In subjects Side From page 24 of this dialogue
And stay away from the topic
But I repeat the question
Where is the throne of God, O Muslims
You Ahbab God
You must know the place of his throne
If you say that the Kaaba is the house of God
And they say was his throne on the water
Why did not tell you in any water ????
Is it in the water on Mars, for example ???I hope that we stay on the subject and looking for a place the throne of God

our universe is in some levels.
- first heaven, second ... until seventh heaven. we live under or inside the first heaven.
- Sidratul muntaha, it is above the seventh heaven.
- water
- Throne.

 

[mahasn ebn sawresho]

our universe is in some levels.
- first heaven, second ... until seventh heaven. we live under or inside the first heaven.
- Sidratul muntaha, it is above the seventh heaven.
- water
- Throne.

My friend if there are seven heavens
Or ten skies
This is not the topic
Thread is that the words of the Koran emphasizes that God has a throne on the water
It is intended that the ground and not the other heavens
Do not go out on the subject
Answer interpretation of the Koran interpretation without wordsWe discuss the words of the Koran
If I said that his throne on the water, which meant the ground
How to create water before the creation of the earth
The contrast in verse clear
I wish I could offer us a place that only the throne

 

[-Peacemaker-]

The Quran is an incoherent mess of a book. It lacks any sort of structure and is just a collection of random thoughts strung together. I never found any of its religious insights to be thought provoking either. It resembles the OT more than the new and in that respect represents a regression in religious thought. Defying logic its chapters are organized by order of size rather than by when the 'revelations' actually occurred. I could never worship a god that can't even express himself coherently

 

[Shad]

Abbasid Golden Age.

Wealthy stable regime, new technology (paper), mixing of Greek, Egyptian and Persian scientific traditions, the translation movement, lots of funding for the sciences, etc.

Was a good period for Arabic philosophy and science, although not exclusively Islamic.

During this time the Islamic and Chinese Empires were the world leaders in these fields though.

They also helped stabilized the "Silk Road" trade routes which was a major influences to all the above.

 

[outhouse]

Was a good period for Arabic philosophy and science, although not exclusively Islamic.

Yet we started with this.

The Islamic Golden Age refers to the period in the history of Islam, traditionally dated from the 8th century to the 13th century, when much of the historically Islamic world was ruled by various caliphates, experiencing a scientific, economic and cultural flourishing


And now we have this.


In the Muslim world today, most of the focus on the relation between Islam and science involves scientific interpretations of the Quran (and sometimes the Sunna) that claim to show that these sources make prescient statements about the nature of the universe, biological development and other phenomena later confirmed by scientific research, thus demonstrating proof of the divine origin of the Qur'an (and sometimes the Sunna). This effort has been criticized by scientists and philosophers as containing logical fallacies,[1] being unscientific, likely to be contradicted by evolving scientific theories.[2][3]

 

[mahasn ebn sawresho]

The Quran is an incoherent mess of a book. It lacks any sort of structure and is just a collection of random thoughts strung together. I never found any of its religious insights to be thought provoking either. It resembles the OT more than the new and in that respect represents a regression in religious thought. Defying logic its chapters are organized by order of size rather than by when the 'revelations' actually occurred. I could never worship a god that can't even express himself coherently

great talk
Many of evidence
Including
The Koran has been arranged according to the length of Sura and palace
And not by subject
One Sura include several subjects and these subjects without including link
It's an intellectual chaos
I believe that the God of the Koran did not know the logical order of his ideas ???